SalkStream Digital Music System

TJHUB · « **Reply #40 on:** 21 Jul 2011, 11:31 am »

This is from another thread, but Jim seems to make things more clear regarding USB DAC compatibility:

Quote from: jsalk on 21 Jul 2011, 04:11 am

Just a quick note to clarify things...

Our StreamPlayer is compatible with any USB DAC or device at bit rates up to 24/96. Above that bit rate, it is compatible with all USB Class 2 Audio devices which are designed to play higher bit rates. No proprietary device drivers are required for these devices.

Devices such as the Kingrex UC192 and many USB DACs do not meet USB Class 2 audio standards. These devices require proprietary drivers to play files above 24/96. According to their web site, "KingRex supports proprietary drivers for Windows & Mac."

USB audio class 2 was developed in order to address the limitations of the USB standard where the transfer requirements for high resolution audio files are concerned. Devices complying with this new standard do not require special proprietary drivers in order to perform at their maximum rated speed, regardless of the operating system involved.

- Jim

Based on this and Jason Stoddard's response, the Bifrost should be compatible for hi-rez.

Nuance · « **Reply #41 on:** 26 Jul 2011, 01:57 am »

Gents and ladies,

I started a Salk Stream thread over at AVS, for what it's worth. This looks to be an awesome product for the $$$, so I thought another dedicated thread would be beneficial. The link is below.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1349741

cacophony777 · « **Reply #42 on:** 26 Jul 2011, 06:45 pm »

How would the SalkStream compare to the Squeezebox Touch?

nyc_paramedic · « **Reply #43 on:** 26 Jul 2011, 07:41 pm »

Quote from: cacophony777 on 26 Jul 2011, 06:45 pm

How would the SalkStream compare to the Squeezebox Touch?

The Squeezbox Touch has a DAC built in with analog RCA out, a display with an interface, is based on ARM architecture chip and, if I remember correctly, needs Squeezebox Server ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Squeezebox_Server) installed to play music across a network. In stock form, the SB Touch will not feed a USB DAC.

The SalkStream is based on a small x86 single board computer running a headless (no VGA, no screen or LCD), stripped down version of Linux. The Salkstream software and hardware is a very minimalist, high performance music server for feeding USB DACs. If the DAC is USB Audio Class 2 (UAC2) compliant it will play 24 bit audio with sample rates to 192Khz. Salkstream is completely silent and has no moving parts. Audio files (FLAC, WAV, AIFF, etc) are fetched over the network via ethernet. You can have a small NAS in another room, use your desktop as a NFS or CIFS server in another room or use JIm's SalkStream server.

The Salkstream also avoids any noisy (EMI/RFI) LCD or LED displays in the hardware.

The audio software is based on Music Player Daemon (MPD). MPD is a true client/server audio player. The MPD daemon (or server, if you will) runs on the headless Salkstream hardware. It doesn't care about album art, lyrics, graphics, etc. All of that is controlled by the MPD client. The MPD client connects to the MPD daemon over the network and controls music playback and play list selection. The MPD client is also responsible for the storing of album art, lyircs, etc.

A blurb from the MPD wikipedia page:

"MPD simply runs in the background playing music from its playlist. Client programs communicate with MPD to manipulate playback, the playlist, and the database. It is not a full-featured music player program such as Amarok, but its clients serve a similar role.

MPD uses a flat file database to maintain the basic music file information when it is not running. Once the daemon is started, the database is kept completely in-memory and no hard disk access is necessary to look up or search for local audio files. Usually, music files must be below the music root directory and are only added to the database when the update command is sent to the server. Playback of arbitrary files is only allowed for local clients which are connected to the server via Unix Domain Sockets. MPD does not provide a built-in tag editor, this functionality is handled by clients or external programs, though 3rd party patches do exist to add this functionality to the server.

The client/server architecture provides several advantages over all-inclusive music players. Clients may communicate with the server remotely over an intranet or over the Internet. The server can be a headless computer located anywhere on the network. Music playback can continue seamlessly when not using X or restarting X. Different clients can be used for different purposes - a lightweight client left open all the time for controlling playback with a more fully featured client used for intensive database searches. Several clients can use the same database, even running simultaneously remotely or under different user accounts.

You can have several clients connected at once, e.g., use your laptop to put together a complex classical music play list, put the laptop to sleep, then use your iPod Touch or Iphone (http://www.katoemba.net/makesnosenseatall/mpod/) using Mpod or iPad client using Mpad (http://www.katoemba.net/makesnosenseatall/mpad/) to sit at you listening chair and casually control you Salkstream.

There are many clients available for Bluetooth phones, Linux, Windows, Mac OS X, iPod, iPhone, iPad, etc. There are also Web clients available to control MPD on SalkStream.

The cool thing is, if your MPD clients crashes it does not affect music playback. That's the beauty of a true client/server architecture music player. No skips, pops, pauses, etc. That's a big advantage over monolithic programs, e.g., Amarra, Puremusic, iTunes, running on traditional desktop computers that have to run a GUI (graphic user interface) and many system services that a desktop machine requires.

The Salkstream is a stripped down, mean, lean, high performance, silent machine that does one thing only: play bit-perfect audio. No mouse, keyboard, VGA, or other superfluous hardware, nor any other superfluous software like anti-virus, graphic user interface, or unnecessary system services.

Hope that helps.

MaxCast · « **Reply #44 on:** 26 Jul 2011, 07:48 pm »

what is needed to control music through an iphone, pad or pc?

nyc_paramedic · « **Reply #45 on:** 26 Jul 2011, 07:56 pm »

Quote from: MaxCast on 26 Jul 2011, 07:48 pm

what is needed to control music through an iphone, pad or pc?

Any MPD client. Install on the machine, enter IP adress and port of Salkstream server and connect.

For iPod and iPhone use Mpod: http://www.katoemba.net/makesnosenseatall/mpod/
For iPad: http://www.katoemba.net/makesnosenseatall/mpad/

Full list of MPD clients: http://mpd.wikia.com/wiki/Clients

Personally, I use a combination of GMPC (http://gmpclient.org/) and a simple terminal/console text mode client call ncmpc (http://mpd.wikia.com/wiki/Client:Ncmpc). I like console clients because they are super fast and I mostly don't care for album art, lyrics or graphics when putting together classical play lists. GMPC is full featured and has a number of plugins that extend its functionality:http://gmpclient.org/plugins

MaxCast · « **Reply #46 on:** 26 Jul 2011, 07:59 pm »

thanks for the links with screen shots.

AOMH · « **Reply #47 on:** 27 Jul 2011, 01:04 am »

nyc_paramedic:

Does the iPad interact with the Salk Streamer wireless?

Out of curiosity, are there any alternative boxes offering same functionality?

Andre

cacophony777 · « **Reply #48 on:** 27 Jul 2011, 03:16 am »

Quote from: nyc_paramedic on 26 Jul 2011, 07:41 pm

The Squeezbox Touch has a DAC built in with analog RCA out, a display with an interface, is based on ARM architecture chip and, if I remember correctly, needs Squeezebox Server ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Squeezebox_Server) installed to play music across a network. In stock form, the SB Touch will not feed a USB DAC.

The SalkStream is based on a small x86 single board computer running a headless (no VGA, no screen or LCD), stripped down version of Linux. The Salkstream software and hardware is a very minimalist, high performance music server for feeding USB DACs. If the DAC is USB Audio Class 2 (UAC2) compliant it will play 24 bit audio with sample rates to 192Khz. Salkstream is completely silent and has no moving parts. Audio files (FLAC, WAV, AIFF, etc) are fetched over the network via ethernet. You can have a small NAS in another room, use your desktop as a NFS or CIFS server in another room or use JIm's SalkStream server.
...

Thanks for all the info. BTW, the Touch does have digital optical and digital coax output for a DAC, though I'm guessing it only supports sample rates up to 24 bit / 96 kHz. It sounds like it doesn't require a server as you can plug in a USB stick or memory card with music and it will read off that.

Steidl Guitars · « **Reply #49 on:** 27 Jul 2011, 03:27 am »

Quote

the Touch does have digital optical and digital coax output for a DAC

I was about to mention the same thing; it can also be hacked to drive a USB DAC.

Quote

I'm guessing it only supports sample rates up to 24 bit / 96 kHz.

Correct.

Quote

It sounds like it doesn't require a server as you can plug in a USB stick or memory card with music and it will read off that.

Or a USB hard disk. The Touch is a genuine Linux box, with a trimmer version of SqueezeBox Server built into the firmware. It will have appreciably less processing power than what it sounds like Jim will offer, but it's a pretty remarkable little thing.

nyc_paramedic · « **Reply #50 on:** 4 Aug 2011, 01:36 am »

Quote from: AOMH on 27 Jul 2011, 01:04 am

nyc_paramedic:

Does the iPad interact with the Salk Streamer wireless?

Not directly. Youur iPad MPD client would interact with your wireless router. The Salk Stream is hard wired ethernet to your router.

Quote from: AOMH on 27 Jul 2011, 01:04 am

Out of curiosity, are there any alternative boxes offering same functionality?

Off the top of my head?? The Bryston BDP-1 comes to mind. Though, if I recall correctly, they use USB media (e.g, flash keys, external USB discs) exclusively so as to avoid any network setup.

pardales · « **Reply #51 on:** 24 Aug 2011, 06:52 pm »

Can the Salkstream player be configured with SPDIF out or is it USB out only? If you did not have a USB DAC, as it stands, you would need a USB to SPDIF converter. Is this right?

zybar · « **Reply #52 on:** 24 Aug 2011, 07:10 pm »

Jim,

I have a BDP-1 and I am really enjoying it.

I would be happy to compare and contrast your offering with the BDP-1 if you are interested.

George

Phil A · « **Reply #53 on:** 24 Aug 2011, 07:14 pm »

Quote from: zybar on 24 Aug 2011, 07:10 pm

Jim,

I have a BDP-1 and I am really enjoying it.

I would be happy to compare and contrast your offering with the BDP-1 if you are interested.

George

The only issue with that is that the BDA-1 is limited on its USB input vs. some other things out there. So if that is what you are using you will likely just be able to compare CD quality

nyc_paramedic · « **Reply #54 on:** 24 Aug 2011, 07:27 pm »

Quote from: Phil A on 24 Aug 2011, 07:14 pm

The only issue with that is that the BDA-1 is limited on its USB input vs. some other things out there. So if that is what you are using you will likely just be able to compare CD quality

Correct. The BDP-1 does not do USB out to a USB DAC. It has a modified Julia with S/PDIF and AES digital out.

zybar · « **Reply #55 on:** 24 Aug 2011, 07:41 pm »

Quote from: Phil A on 24 Aug 2011, 07:14 pm

The only issue with that is that the BDA-1 is limited on its USB input vs. some other things out there. So if that is what you are using you will likely just be able to compare CD quality

I have fairly easy access to an Antelope Zodiac + or Zodiac Gold DAC's if needed.

George

pardales · « **Reply #56 on:** 24 Aug 2011, 08:18 pm »

Quote from: pardales on 24 Aug 2011, 06:52 pm

Can the Salkstream player be configured with SPDIF out or is it USB out only? If you did not have a USB DAC, as it stands, you would need a USB to SPDIF converter. Is this right?

Anyone...

TJHUB · « **Reply #57 on:** 24 Aug 2011, 08:24 pm »

Quote from: pardales on 24 Aug 2011, 06:52 pm

Can the Salkstream player be configured with SPDIF out or is it USB out only? If you did not have a USB DAC, as it stands, you would need a USB to SPDIF converter. Is this right?

It is USB output only. You would need a USB to SPDIF converter if your DAC doesn't have USB input, or a "good" USB input.

Phil A · « **Reply #58 on:** 24 Aug 2011, 09:17 pm »

Quote from: zybar on 24 Aug 2011, 07:41 pm

I have fairly easy access to an Antelope Zodiac + or Zodiac Gold DAC's if needed.

George

George - would be interested to hear your thoughts if you do the comparison. For now I have a Squeezebox Touch with an upgraded power supply into the BDA-1. Sometime at the beginning of next year at the latest a new computer will be purchased and I'll begin looking at digitizing more. I'm using WMA lossless files I did for an old Zune and a couple of 24/96 downloads now as I have not gotten around to it.

gregcss · « **Reply #59 on:** 2 Sep 2011, 03:18 am »

I've stayed away from streaming audio due to loss of sound quality though this thread has sparked my interest.

How would the sound from a SalkStream (or similar device) streaming FLAC music files to a USB Class 2 dac compare to a CD/BR player playing a CD?