[Letitroll98]

ain't that the truth.  i lurk on these "flavor of the month" dacs, hoping that, one day, at a somewhat reasonable price, i might find something actually worth buying that will supplant my humble modded art di/o from its place in my system.  but it seems it's not to be.  in this thread, the schiit was compared to the benchmark dac1 - as i know more than one person who has let got a benchmark dac in favor of the di/o, i know that, at best, these new dacs may sound "different", but won't sound "better"...

personally, i think there's only so much blood that can be squeezed from the cd "stone".  someday if someone dumps silly money on me, i may, for grins, try something like the nova physics memory player 64; meanwhile i will continue lurking on these "new dac" threads.   

doug s.

I agree about CD quality limits Doug, there's only so much there.  The frontier for affordable DACs is in how they handle Hi Rez material.  That's why I was interested in the BiFrost, one of the very few affordable units with 24/196 usb capability.  Agreed not too much in 172 or 196 out there now, but it's coming fast, I have three examples here in front of me now from MA Recordings.  Perhaps somebody will get 'round to posting impressions of Hi Rez decoding on the BiFrost. 

Back to CD, it seems like only tube buffers, either internal or external, can make CD's sound truly analog.  All other DAC's go only so far in Redbook decoding sound quality, it seems to need editing whether by tube or upsampling.  But I haven't heard everything for sure.

[intelonetwo]

...Agreed not too much in 172 or 196 out there now, but it's coming fast, I have three examples here in front of me now from MA Recordings.... 

Letitroll98, I think the material is what's lacking. It seems that DAC resolution has increased, but the material to play on it is sorely lacking in quantity. Particularly my type of music which is varied, but ers on the side of newer 1990's to current Rap, R& B, Soul, Hip-Hop, Rock, Folk, Rap. Your thoughts?

[wushuliu]

Letitroll98, I think the material is what's lacking. It seems that DAC resolution has increased, but the material to play on it is sorely lacking in quantity. Particularly my type of music which is varied, but ers on the side of newer 1990's to current Rap, R& B, Soul, Hip-Hop, Rock, Folk, Rap. Your thoughts?

The quantity will increase but it will take a few years. The success of mainstream offerings like Beats By Dre products and now external DACs from PC hardware manufacturers like Asus point to an emerging mainstream mid-fi market for digital/hi-rez playback. However I am sure the higher the res, the more expensive the music will be and I would bet money that prices from places from HDtracks, etc. will increase as the transition settles. With CDs becoming obsolete major companies will start squeezing every drop out of hi-rez (imagine 16/44,24/88,24/96,24/192, 24/3xx remasters of _____  with each commanding higher price tag). It will take a couple years but it will happen.

[rotarius]

Yes, I agree you can only do so much at CD resolution and the differences in many sub-$1K DACs are subtle at best.  However, I do not think adding tubes makes CD sound more analog.  Good LPs sound crisp without being harsh, you know it instantly when hearing cymbals, kick drums, etc.  Tubes soften up the sound and it does not sound analog, just makes CD more pleasant perhaps.  Ditto with upsampling.

Meanwhile, I got my Bifrost today and it has been playing for 5 hours now.  My initial impression was that the fit and finish is really much better than anything in it's price range, certainly better than anything I have seen coming from China.  I am thrilled to see an American product not costing an arm and a leg

Without getting into too many details, let me just say that it is NOT bass shy by any means.  Some of you may get that impression reading some posts on Headfi.  One thing I heard right away - this is a very clean sounding dac, noticeable when listening to female vocals and massed strings.

I did download the drivers for USB to test it out with hi rez files.  No problems found so far.  I am going to let it burn it for a day or so before I start to critically evaluate it.

[Sonny]

rotarius, thanks for the comments.
hey, i've had my Bifrost for some time now, but have not used the USB input.  Can you tell me where to download the USB Driver?
Thanks
T

[rotarius]

rotarius, thanks for the comments.
hey, i've had my Bifrost for some time now, but have not used the USB input.  Can you tell me where to download the USB Driver?
Thanks
T

The manual has the link : Schiit.com/drivers
You will need to load the drivers to make it work, it is not plug-n-play

[Sonny]

thanks!

[rotarius]

UPDATE:  I am not sure what the burn in period should be but I don't think it will change much from this point on.  The Bifrost was hooked up to an Onkyo DV-SP800 universal as a transport via coax input.

Like Sonny reported earlier, this thing is very detailed, clear and crisp.  Directly comparing the Dac to the Onkyo, it is quite noticeable, the player sounds a bit more laid back.  The upper mids of the bifrost seem a touch more forward in comparison which project instruments like acoustic guiter and female vocals a bit more into the room.  This may be why Sonny and others feel the upper bass is a bit recessed.  I still have my spitfire/bravo/supplier combo to compare to and things got interesing here since they are in the same ball park pricewise.
The spitfire combo has a bit more bass heft/drive.  Yes, it has a bit more bass heft compared to most Dacs I tried.  It is also non-upsampling like the bifrost but the bifrost has a tiny bit more detail and clarity.  Soundstage is similar, we are splitting hairs in this regard.  Massed strings also seemed a tiny bit cleaner with the bifrost at times but I am not fully convinced of that yet. 

I tried the USB input briefly and immediately noticed that it sounded different from Coax input.  Bass was fuller, tonal balance a touch warmer but the sound was not as crisp as before.  I suspect many will pefer the USB input in their systems.  Now, I had to try the toslink input and I had a glass toslink cable for that purpose.  Switching between coax and toslink, I could tell that the Toslink sounded closer to the USB input, a bit fuller bass but not as sharp and crisp like coax input.  Differences in sound are all quite small.  How small is quite small?  More noticeable than changing interconnects but not a whole lot more if that helps.

All in all, a very neutral, detailed and crisp sound without harshness.  I prefer non-upsampling dacs because they are more dynamic and crisp than upsampling ones.  The Bifrost seems to have those qualities but without any grit/grain or digital harshness found in cheap DACs.  Brass, cymbals, etc. are presented well.  It definately has a split personality with optical and coax inputs.   If you need added mid-bass warmth, look elsewhere.  It compares quite well to any of the sub-$1K Dacs and I have had quite a few!  I prefer it to any of the upsampling Dacs I have used.  Compared to the Spitfire combo, it is not better or worse, just a bit different.

[eclein]

rotarius- That was excellent, Thank you so much I now have a very clear idea of the sound as that was a very good excellent descriptive. 

[rotarius]

Thanks Eclein.  Now that I have had it for a few more days, I am happy to report the dac did settle down since my last post, bass is a bit fuller and the previously reported characteristics still apply.  I did have a number of coax cables so I swapped around and settled for a Blue Jeans/Canare LV77 which I think helped warm up things a little compared to a BJ Belden ic.  So, to anyone buying it, do try different inexpensive cables like Blue jeans, DH labs silversonic, glass toslink, etc.  I am not a believer in exotic cables, so no experience there.

[ted_b]

Srajan has completed his review.  He likes it a lot, compares it pretty favorably with his other two "value DACs" inhouse (Kingrex and Burson, both more $$) and says it is only missing those things (like uber-resolution) that are not necessary to enjoy music.

http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/schiit2/1.html

[roscoeiii]

6moons review of the BitFrost is up now:

http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/schiit2/1.html

Srajan had reviewed a ton of DACs up and down the price chain.

[ted_b]

6moons review of the BitFrost is up now:

http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/schiit2/1.html

Srajan had reviewed a ton of DACs up and down the price chain.

What was wrong with my post directly above yours??

[srb]

What was wrong with my post directly above yours??

You failed to erroneously refer to the DAC as "BitFrost" instead of Bifrost ?

[JohnR]

What was wrong with my post directly above yours??

Too factual.

[roscoeiii]

What was wrong with my post directly above yours??

Clearly I should not post until I have had my coffee.

[Letitroll98]

“The most valuable of all talents is that of never using two words when one will do.”
― Thomas Jefferson

As far as the review goes, can anyone decipher what Srajan is saying?  (In any review for that matter)  From what I can tell there's not much difference between any of these DACs, but he needs to get four pages of review in.  It was nice seeing the modules taken apart, but I've seen circuit boards before.  The technical explanations were nothing more than a regurgitation of the Schiit website, with one exception, the fact that the Bifrost doesn't do 176.4 Khz, a major flaw in a unit said to handle all sampling rates.  And a note that $3,000 DACs sound a bit better.  I got more information on the sound of the unit from rotarius' review here.   

[JohnR]

Touché

 

[roscoeiii]

Some of the analogies he has used have caused some head scratching at time, but I feel like I usually come away from his reviews with a better idea of the product and how it compares to the many others he has reviewed. I tend to skip over the background pages if I have already looked over the manufacturer's lit. But he nicely positions the DAC relative to the Burson and KingRex. I thought the 2nd vs. 3rd harmonic comparison, along with the discussion of the greater air in the Bitfrost and its lack of ultimate bass depth and impact would give me a clear enough idea of the sound to decide if it was worth an audition.

[brother love]

I agree the 6 moons Bifrost review is a difficult read. Srajan released a preliminary report of this DAC before the Schiit shipping delays, so the review is really 2 parts combined, which explains part of the excess nature.  On the whole though I really like Srajan's reviews & appreciate his efforts.