[maxwalrath]

...

I thought it was funny...

[OzarkTom]

Thanks, Scotty. I just found out they sell for $6 a set at Canada's equivalent to Guitar Center (Long & McQuade), so I'll hop right down there and get some!

For 31 pounds, you might want to stack two sets under your speakers on each corner. But first try one set to see if that will work.

[Rclark]

 I actually read that whole damn thread. The reviews are quite staggering, considering the amps ($$) that are being compared and beaten. The descriptions of the Ncore's performance... should be read by all.

 The thread, for me, is an eye opener on many, many levels (mostly Bruno's comments), and thanks to it I finally have sharply defined notions of what I want, and don't want in my system, as far as source gear. For starters, no tubes. I'm sad that I missed out on that whole era, I was kind of looking forward to having big tube monoblocks, wow, neat, look at those!, but I'd rather go this route, superior fidelity. Let the warmth come from the recording, not my amp.

 I'm sure I'll love the amps, because they don't have a house sound of any sort, no tube coloration, no distortion. It will be neat to compare to my current amp, which apparently has a "tube like sound". I'm going to use this theme in my entire system. Whatever piece of gear he introduces next, dac, attenuators, whatever, I'm going to follow closely.

[roscoeiii]

Just because a designer is gifted in one area does not mean that this skill will extend to other types of equipment. Each piece in the audio chain has its unique challenges.

[OzarkTom]

The tube like sound that so many refers to is caused by the outut transformers. OTL's don't have that colored, warm, veiled sound.

[maxwalrath]

I'm sad that I missed out on that whole era, I was kind of looking forward to having big tube monoblocks, wow, neat, look at those!, but I'd rather go this route, superior fidelity. Let the warmth come from the recording, not my amp.

I've read 1/3 of the thread and got the opposite impression...I think it sounds like a nice tube preamp would work very well with a revealing/non-warm power amp.

[roscoeiii]

At this point, I don't think that there is a single "tube sound" that can describe all tubes in all implementations. Best to talk about specific components (DAC, Pre, Amp), specific designs (SET, Push-Pull, OTL, Hybrids), and specific characteristics of particular components/brands. Both SS and tube designers are able to dial in strengths usually attributed to tube or SS designs at this point. And there is much to argue for components like tube amps with "SS-like characteristics" and vice versa.

Likewise, we hear similar things said about class D amps.

We have a great variety of components that find a middle ground between what has traditionally been attributed to SS and tubes. And to that we can mix and match amps, pres and sources in a number of glorious permutations until we hit on what we like best.

Since this is an ncore thread, I'll certainly say that I would be very interested in seeing a review of the ncore paired with a wide range of preamps.

But broad sweeping strokes aren't helping anyone at this point.

[Rclark]

@max
That's only because certain people who've had tubes their whole life will insist in having one in the chain. No problem there. Well, not my problem anyway.

And you should read the while thread and the side links to articles about Bruno. He started life as a tube amp designer. You got the wrong impression.

[Rclark]

Just because a designer is gifted in one area does not mean that this skill will extend to other types of equipment. Each piece in the audio chain has its unique challenges.

He claims to be expert in all those areas, including speakers, and has products coming. Sometimes there is a gifted genius who can do it all.

[Rclark]

Oh and Roscoe, as I said, these are my own conclusions, you're all free to do whatever you want 

[maxwalrath]

@max
That's only because certain people who've had tubes their whole life will insist in having one in the chain. No problem there. Well, not my problem anyway.

And you should read the while thread and the side links to articles about Bruno. He started life as a tube amp designer. You got the wrong impression.

I hear you. I'm one of those people who prefer a little bit of tubes in the chain, typically in the preamp but I've had similar success with cdp's with tubes. Some tube integrateds have done it for me too but they can be missing some punch for my tastes. (my preferences are of course with the limited amount of gear my budget has allowed me to own)

[doug s.]

@max
That's only because certain people who've had tubes their whole life will insist in having one in the chain. No problem there. Well, not my problem anyway.

And you should read the while thread and the side links to articles about Bruno. He started life as a tube amp designer. You got the wrong impression.

you're still wet behind the ears, son!     i have only "been into" tubes for about 12 years.  it took me thirty years to get into tubes.   

now, i am also interested in hearing these ncores.  my feelings are that, while i love tube amps, i can live w/sand amps.  can't say that about preamps, at least not yet.  all i know is that the only thing permanent is change...   

doug s.

[maxwalrath]

Who here has ordered them yet? If so, are you putting everything together yourself? What enclosure are you using and can you share what parts/wires you plan on installing?

[Rclark]

  I hear ya Doug, and I'm looking forward to hearing some all-tube systems soon. But I feel like I missed that boat entirely, and it really just seems like the age of tubes is over. Which is unfortunate because I like the look of these massive, gawky, ungainly looking mono's with light bulbs coming out all over the surface. I love the look. Ncores's will sit in a plain, boring box.  (actually I'm getting in on a volume deal for a very pretty case, but no glowing lights.)

 I'm not being entirely honest, I've listened to tube systems before, but it was way back in the day. Once was at Adire Audio. The sound was rich, almost syrupy.

 I understand that tubes can be made to be transparent, but then what's the point of that since SS, especially now, does that so much better? Transparency with tubes is like making Pepsi taste like water. No point.

 I'd rather go this direction. And I don't have a lot of systems around me so I can't test with my wallet, the things I buy have to be a sure thing.

[doug s.]

I hear ya Doug, and I'm looking forward to hearing some all-tube systems soon. But I feel like I missed that boat entirely, and it really just seems like the age of tubes is over. Which is unfortunate because I like the look of these massive, gawky, ungainly looking mono's with light bulbs coming out all over the surface. I love the look. Ncores's will sit in a plain, boring box.  (actually I'm getting in on a volume deal for a very pretty case, but no glowing lights.)

 I'm not being entirely honest, I've listened to tube systems before, but it was way back in the day. Once was at Adire Audio. The sound was rich, almost syrupy.

 I understand that tubes can be made to be transparent, but then what's the point of that since SS, especially now, does that so much better? Transparency with tubes is like making Pepsi taste like water. No point.

 I'd rather go this direction. And I don't have a lot of systems around me so I can't test with my wallet, the things I buy have to be a sure thing.

it is possible to have tube gear extremely transparent - yust as transparent as solid state, w/o sounding at all like solid state.  good tubes has some soundstaging cues that i have never heard from solid state.  and detail in spades...  if you think tubes cannot be as transparent as solid state, or that making tubes sound "transparent" means making them lose what is nice about tubes - i.e.: making them sound like solid state - then you haven't heard what good tube equipment can do in a system...

regarding making pepsi taste like water, that would be a huge improvement, imo.  but, then again, i haven't drunk soft drinks in 30 years - i prefer water!   

doug s.

[medium jim]

it is possible to have tube gear extremely transparent - yust as transparent as solid state, w/o sounding at all like solid state.  good tubes has some soundstaging cues that i have never heard from solid state.  and detail in spades...  if you think tubes cannot be as transparent as solid state, or that making tubes sound "transparent" means making them lose what is nice about tubes - i.e.: making them sound like solid state - then you haven't heard what good tube equipment can do in a system...

regarding making pepsi taste like water, that would be a huge improvement, imo.  but, then again, i haven't drunk soft drinks in 30 years - i prefer water!   

doug s.

Doug:

I couldn't have said it better!  There is just so much misinformation as to what tubes sound or don't sound like.  The nay sayers have been trying to bury tubes since the invent of transistors. 

Class D amps are not taking the world by storm, although they are good for car stereo.  What Mr. Clark needs to do is take the time to go to a well established Hi-Fi show, to emerse himself in what is out there as it will allow him to really hear first hand what it all sounds like.

Jim

[jtwrace]

Doug:

I couldn't have said it better!  There is just so much misinformation as to what tubes sound or don't sound like.  The nay sayers have been trying to bury tubes since the invent of transistors. 

Class D amps are not taking the world by storm, although they are good for car stereo.  What Mr. Clark needs to do is take the time to go to a well established Hi-Fi show, to emerse himself in what is out there as it will allow him to really hear first hand what it all sounds like.

Jim

Interesting.  So you've heard the Hypex Ncore amps that your posting in the thread about? 

[medium jim]

Interesting.  So you've heard the Hypex Ncore amps that your posting in the thread about?

No, I haven't, but I've heard many a Class D amp and to my ears, they're sterile (not in a good way), have a bit of grain in the HF, and do not have the soundstaging of other amps.  My post never mentioned Hypex Ncore, just a reference to Class D amps in general.  I would think that if Hypex Ncore hit it out with their design, that other than the maker himself telling us how good they are, that the likes of Absolute Sound, Stereophile or the countless other respected industry and hobby magazines would be all over it.   

Call me skeptical that after so many years of Class D that there would such a revolutionary break through in their ability.  Hey, I'm Dutch and would love it if a fellow Dutchman did make a breakthrough....

Point/Counterpoint, has Rclark heard them first hand or his he merely relying what he is reading about them?

Jim

[jtwrace]

No, I haven't, but I've heard many a Class D amp and to my ears, they're sterile (not in a good way), have a bit of grain in the HF, and do not have the soundstaging of other amps.  My post never mentioned Hypex Ncore, just a reference to Class D amps in general.  I would think that if Hypex Ncore hit it out with their design, that other than the maker himself telling us how good they are, that the likes of Absolute Sound, Stereophile or the countless other respected industry and hobby magazines would be all over it.   

Call me skeptical that after so many years of Class D that there would such a revolutionary break through in their ability.  Hey, I'm Dutch and would love it if a fellow Dutchman did make a breakthrough....

Point/Counterpoint, has Rclark heard them first hand or his he merely relying what he is reading about them?

Jim

Saying that you heard a bunch of Class D amps that you didn't like is like me saying "I've heard a bunch of tube amps and they all stink".  Which of course isn't true. 

As for what Rclark has or hasn't heard I have no idea.  I've heard A LOT of stuff and have owned a bunch of it too....

[medium jim]

Saying that you heard a bunch of Class D amps that you didn't like is like me saying "I've heard a bunch of tube amps and they all stink".  Which of course isn't true. 

As for what Rclark has or hasn't heard I have no idea.  I've heard A LOT of stuff and have owned a bunch of it too....

jt:

Just for the record, many have posted their thoughts in this thread who haven't actually heard them, so why are you singling me out?  Let's be fair, okay?

Thanks,
Jim