[srb]

Now I am curious, how long have you been in the audio world? You have never heard of a percentage better between two components? I have been hearing that remark from other audiophiles for the last 30+ years. Maybe I am just from the old school.

I have heard people say it myself, but I could never make anymore sense of it than I do when I am told "Component A 'smoked', 'buried' or 'blew the doors off' Component B".  When someone tells something is 40% better, I can't help but automatically think "+ or - 40%"!
 
But your actual descriptions of differences in sound attributes in your last post is something that people can relate to.  Many things are just not quantifiable with a numerical value, including sound, food, wine or sex, regardless of a tolerance range of error.
 
Steve

[OzarkTom]

Im with you Tom, I'm going to try and find out what they say about battery PS for Ncore.

 gonna take a lot of big batteries for these though!

I posted this question this morning on Bruno's DIY thread. This is his quote.

"There are no plans in that direction. We have been entertaining the idea of an upconverter for car use for quite some time now but all I can say is that it's been quiet on that front for a few years now."

[Rclark]

Not a worry then, because it looks like the PS had a lot of effort put into it. If the amp as is is already besting expensive gear... Think just plug and play in this case.

[OzarkTom]

Not a worry then, because it looks like the PS had a lot of effort put into it. If the amp as is is already besting expensive gear... Think just plug and play in this case.

It still would sound better on batteries, at least 10-20%.  Maybe I can hunt down someone that can make a battery power supply for the Hypex.

[Rclark]

still... unmeasurable distortion, etc. Wonder if power matters as much considering all the tech in the PS. Read the tech PDA and Bruno's comments on it, seems very high tech.

[OzarkTom]

still... unmeasurable distortion, etc. Wonder if power matters as much considering all the tech in the PS. Read the tech PDA and Bruno's comments on it, seems very high tech.

The Hypex maybe unmeasurable, but have you checked the distortion ratings on your loudspeakers?

What? 10-20%?

[Phil]

An experiment with a battery would be interesting. 

I'm listening to the amazing, little ICE 125asx2 with NO power conditioning (except separate dedicated line; my sources are conditioned by an equitech which is fed by a separate dedicated line) right now.  An inexpensive implementation with very inexpensive connectors, etc. Total cost was $300 shipped.

This stereo version is at the very low end of what my speakers are rated to need.  And this thing rocks in every respect (dynamic, great tone, full, etc.).  Really.  This makes me VERY curious about the Ncore.  If the Ncore's cost vs ICE is an indication, and it might not be of course, you might be able to just plug and play the Ncore an never look back. 

Phil

[Rclark]

Tom I meant in terms ofna battery being beneficial.


- Phil I did come across the term "end of the road amp" quite a few times in all that reading.

[decal]

Now I am curious, how long have you been in the audio world? You have never heard of a percentage better between two components? I have been hearing that remark from other audiophiles for the last 30+ years. Maybe I am just from the old school.

Actually, I was just being conservative on the 40% figure. My friend that borrowed my amp thought I was BS'ing him on this high of a figure. He tried the amp on his Tonian's and he thought the amp was bigger than a 40% improvement on DC. The other day, he even told me that this syatem beats his modified stack Quads with the NYAL OTL tube amps. My buddy Rex said he now hears the singer lick or smack their lips in between verses, I do too. Rex said for his first time, this amp pinpoints individual instruments in the soundfield instead of smearing them. Hmmm, sounds like he is talking about how good that everyone is saying about the Hypex.

This TBI amp sounds very good on AC, but when you hear just the first note of music powered by DC, the improvement is not a slight one, it slaps you in the face. I would call that at least a 40% improvement, give or take 10%. Rex calls it a 50% improvement over AC.

Yes, I've heard people say things like this before, I've just never been able to figure out how one comes up with these percentage numbers. Oh well, I guess it's just one of life's mysteries that will forever be unknown to me !!!! Anyway, I'm glad when someone is happy with the sound their equipment is providing them. BTW, I've been in this hobby 30+ years so it's not an old school/new school thing.

[James Romeyn]

The Hypex maybe unmeasurable, but have you checked the distortion ratings on your loudspeakers?

What? 10-20%?

Highest distortion in speakers is in the bass range.  It's interesting (and helpful for audiophiles) that human sensitivity to distortion in the bass range is extremely low (inverse for the midrange).  IIRC humans can barely detect the difference between 1 and 30% THD in the bass range. 

Modal effects are another story entirely.  Swings from -12 dB to +12 dB in the bass range are not uncommon and very audible.  But even worse and more audible is the effect on timing.  Modal effects can multiply by two or three x's the bass note's original value, destroying the music's flow and rhythm, which is its foundation. 

Modal effects explain why audiophiles sometimes prefer reproduced music without deep bass.   

[OzarkTom]

Here is the first commercially produced Hypex-based Ncore amps, due out in April. This is Theta's very first Class D amp, called the Prometheus . Only $12,000 a pair. But if I win the lottery, I would surely buy these.

[James Romeyn]

Drats, I was right there in the Theta room at CES looking  right at that exact amp in the photo (so it appears) sitting right in front of the doorway.  I would love to have spoken to someone at Theta about it.  First heard of Ncore after CES.   

Ditto, three of these would rocket to the top of my personal assistant's shopping list if I won the lottery.  Yeah, I might make do somehow with a measly 1200Wrms @ 2 Ohms...maybe.   

[Jonathon Janusz]

Reading this thread reminded me (and if I had a need for such a beast, I probably would have pulled the trigger myself by now), I didn't see that Gary Dodd had got this gem sold:

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=101246.0

I know the N400 has matching power supplies built for it by Hypex, but I can't see someone going wrong with a Dodd balanced power supply built like that tank. 

[OzarkTom]

Reading this thread reminded me (and if I had a need for such a beast, I probably would have pulled the trigger myself by now), I didn't see that Gary Dodd had got this gem sold:

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=101246.0

I know the N400 has matching power supplies built for it by Hypex, but I can't see someone going wrong with a Dodd balanced power supply built like that tank. 

But that is with the UCD modules which many says does not compare with the new ncore modules.

[Rclark]

the new Ucd's will have some of the ncore feature set. Ncore is the premier amp.

[Jonathon Janusz]

But that is with the UCD modules which many says does not compare with the new ncore modules.

Sorry, I guess I meant to qualify that with some of the thoughts in that thread.  For the cash, picking up that amp for the casework and power supply, parting out the old modules, and strapping in the ncore modules. . . 

. . . but I really don't know if it would be that simple. . . mileage varies with me in regards to DIY endeavors. . . 

[James Romeyn]

mileage varies with me in regards to DIY endeavors. . . 

Ditto!  Audio quote of the millennium! 

[Rclark]

Not sure if this one has been posted or not, found this review, translated with Bing.

With pictures:

http://www.microsofttranslator.com/BV.aspx?ref=IE8Activity&a=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.htforum.nl%2Fyabbse%2Findex.php%3Ftopic%3D115205.0


 I know they are relatively very lightweight, so I was surprised by their larger than expected size in these shots.

[Rclark]

Stopped and actually looked at this picture. Those are really nice looking. So this company has never done a Class d amp before, huh? And here it is.

[jackman]

That Theta amp looks like a fancy toaster!  Mine only makes two pieces at a time, this one looks like it makes 4.  The slots are big enough for bagels!