[SCM]

Hello. I have an old set of speakers that I bought new quite a few years ago.
They are Dayton Wright XAM-4`s.

I would like to use the enclosure to put SET low power type drivers into. A Zu or Tekton type speaker.
I`m going to use a little Sophia Baby 10 watt tube amp I have.

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated !

[SCM]

Ok...no need for new drivers at this point.
I hooked the speakers up after having sat dormant for all these years and they sound fine.
They are 33 years old now so I`ve decided to change out the caps in the crossovers.

It`s a chore trying to get inside these things and I had to use chisels and pry bars to get to the crossovers.
Everything is glued and nailed.
Even the speakers are epoxied in place !

Here`s the crossover..no board just components glued here and there.

It`s been suggested to change the bundles of Nichicon 100uf 50v caps out to a better brand but to use fewer ones using a different value.
Can anybody offer advice here ? That would be great !!!

[SCM]

Is this in the wrong section ?? I could really use the help 

[WGH]

Contact Danny Richie at GR Research for advise, or ask in this thread:

I bet I can make your speakers sound better.
https://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=137288.0

[Peter J]

We're looking at the unmodified speaker in your photos, correct? If so, that's easily the sloppiest job of speaker construction I've seen. Appears drivers held in place by construction adhesive. These were a commercially made speaker? 

[SCM]

Contact Danny Richie at GR Research for advise, or ask in this thread:

I bet I can make your speakers sound better.
https://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=137288.0

Thanks !

[SCM]

We're looking at the unmodified speaker in your photos, correct? If so, that's easily the sloppiest job of speaker construction I've seen. Appears drivers held in place by construction adhesive. These were a commercially made speaker?

Yes commercially made. The pictures show what was behind the 'Wrap'. There`s no grill at all and there is fiberglass matting stuffed around the speakers. In order to  get to the drivers themselves you have to pretty much cut your way in and sacrifice the speaker cloth.
The drivers are actually glued in too as you noticed.

[JohnR]

Holy cow.

As a starting point, maybe you could try tracing out the crossover and drawing the schematic.

[SCM]

Holy cow.

As a starting point, maybe you could try tracing out the crossover and drawing the schematic.

John I have no idea how to go about that     I can almost solder

So I need someone to guide me and say "See those things right there in the pic ?....Pull them out and put these in instead" 

[JohnR]

Well you already identified the electrolytic caps, so I suppose do those then. These days you may as well use film, $15 for 50uF from parts express or spend as much as you want. You've been given the info in your diyaudio thread on how to convert series/parallel to an equivalent value. You might be better off just building a kit from scratch though, if you want a speaker project.

[SCM]

Got it

[JohnR]

Oh, sorry, those are 100 uF not 50.

The thing is (not sure if this was mentioned already) that if you just replace the parts with same-valued ones, you could be spending money to fix up a crossover that wasn't designed very well in the first place. (Considering the care put into the construction, you wonder what the design process was like...) I mention this because I did exactly that once.... Plus you don't really know if all of the drivers are functioning within spec any more.

OTOH, you could just view it as a learning exercise...

[WGH]

At first glance the speakers look like something from a Goodwill store, but they did get good reviews. There even is a Dayton-Wright zombie website that has more info on your speaker, those boys sure could write some purple prose (all without the help of an editor or spell checker too):
http://www.dayton-wright.com/xam-4-Speakers.html

     "Continuing (in a more serious vein) with our development of loudspeaker systems employing our proprietary Controlled Periodicity Design techniques, the XAM-4 Monitor Loudspeaker combines very wide and smooth amplitude response with unusually smooth phase response, superb transient attack, good efflclency and much higher power handling than the LCM-l's In a unit which also has remarkable stereo fusion, stereo Imaging, and depth of the stereo Image.

     "This has been achieved through our employment of computer algorythms which emulate the process of audio perception, to process Amplitude/frequency response measurements made In our laboratory.  These programs help to reveal why It Is that many other loudspeaker designs while achieving flat phase response and low distortion do not sound entirely satisfactory because of Inherent coloration and poor stereo Imaging.  The result Is that these other speakers do not begin to produce an acceptable sense of realism.  The Insight provided by these computer analyses has allowed us either to modify or eliminate many design elements that actually degrade the listener's perception of sound by Introducing masking effects.  These artefacts, while subtle, nevertheless prevent the listener from perceiving properly scaled, tightly fused stereo, not to mention diminishing the amount of musical detail and texture that could otherwise be heard.  These masking effects also cause listening fatique and prevent a fully satisfactory enjoyment of the music Itself!"

And so on and so on...............


This is interesting: Dayton Wright XAM-4 service manual
http://www.dayton-wright.com/XAM-4-Manual01.html

Dayton-Wright main page with much, much more stuff, they were probably the one of the first companies to make electrostatic speakers (1958): http://www.dayton-wright.com/
There are a couple of email links on the main page, try them and see what happens.

[FullRangeMan]

Remove these 4 driver per box may damage the wood hole borders.
If this speaker are 3 ways as the specs link above say the xover have 4 freq cuts, this not a purist design, so I could leave it as it is to be preserved or use it for movies and invest in a current hi sensitivity two way simpler speaker.
To me it worth more in original condition than modified.

[JLM]

Interesting proposition because you have the design process entirely backwards.  Underlying your project premise is the pricing structure for the manufacturing costs of home speakers which spends the most on finishes, then cabinets, and finally the guts (drivers and crossovers). 

Cabinets should fit the speaker concept, not the other way around (as this exercise is trying to accomplish).  What are the goals/priorities of the design?  SPL's, frequency range, efficiency, dynamics, imaging, monitor/dipole, room that it's going into, genres targeted, etc.

[SCM]

Oh, sorry, those are 100 uF not 50.

The thing is (not sure if this was mentioned already) that if you just replace the parts with same-valued ones, you could be spending money to fix up a crossover that wasn't designed very well in the first place. (Considering the care put into the construction, you wonder what the design process was like...) I mention this because I did exactly that once.... Plus you don't really know if all of the drivers are functioning within spec any more.

OTOH, you could just view it as a learning exercise...

Thanks John. I guess Mike Wright had his own way of doing things as speakers can attest ! The drivers up front are all working, don`t know if they are still in spec though.

[SCM]

Remove these 4 driver per box may damage the wood hole borders.
If this speaker are 3 ways as the specs link above say the xover have 4 freq cuts, this not a purist design, so I could leave it as it is to be preserved or use it for movies and invest in a current hi sensitivity two way simpler speaker.
To me it worth more in original condition than modified.

They are a 4-way design I`m pretty sure.
You are right about damaging the cabinet. It`s particle board and the epoxy used to mount the drivers is some tough stuff.
Because I`ve owned them all these years the value is more sentimental than anything else, lots of history, lots of moves, good times etc...

[SCM]

Interesting proposition because you have the design process entirely backwards.  Underlying your project premise is the pricing structure for the manufacturing costs of home speakers which spends the most on finishes, then cabinets, and finally the guts (drivers and crossovers). 

Cabinets should fit the speaker concept, not the other way around (as this exercise is trying to accomplish).  What are the goals/priorities of the design?  SPL's, frequency range, efficiency, dynamics, imaging, monitor/dipole, room that it's going into, genres targeted, etc.

Mr Wright designed them and he had some different ideas I guess.There are bags of Inert gas in them too which surprisingly were still intact ! Supposedly it made the drivers act like the enclose was bigger than it actually was.

Just want to freshen them up and hopefully have them back to form and look better than original at the same time. They were not the prettiest even when new 

[SCM]

Interesting proposition because you have the design process entirely backwards.  Underlying your project premise is the pricing structure for the manufacturing costs of home speakers which spends the most on finishes, then cabinets, and finally the guts (drivers and crossovers). 

Cabinets should fit the speaker concept, not the other way around (as this exercise is trying to accomplish).  What are the goals/priorities of the design?  SPL's, frequency range, efficiency, dynamics, imaging, monitor/dipole, room that it's going into, genres targeted, etc.

Hi JLM...My apologies. I forgot about the original post and the intentions I had at that time. I posted than 8 years ago
Now I just want to get them back in good form.
Sorry for the confusion !

[FullRangeMan]

They are a 4-way design I`m pretty sure.
You are right about damaging the cabinet. It`s particle board and the epoxy used to mount the drivers is some tough stuff.
Because I`ve owned them all these years the value is more sentimental than anything else, lots of history, lots of moves, good times etc...

If the xover are 4 ways, it have 6 legs to cut the music to the drivers.