Anyone want to live longer?

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JohnR

Re: Anyone want to live longer?
« Reply #20 on: 8 Mar 2011, 12:53 pm »
This article is complete crap.

Um... are you suggesting that they should forcibly move people to specific altitudes?

Photon46

Re: Anyone want to live longer?
« Reply #21 on: 8 Mar 2011, 12:55 pm »
[quote

This is an epidemiological study, meaning that it proves correlation, NOT causation.  In other words, it could be living at a high altitude causes a lower risk of coronary artery disease, or it could be a million other things (more exercise, lower stress, you name it). 

This article is complete crap.
[/quote]

The distinction between correlation and causation seems to be the most difficult hurdle preventing people from making meaningful decisions about life choices. I sometimes wonder if the scientific method's reductive elimination of variables in a valid study or experiment will ever give us an anywhere near complete understanding of why many lifestyle choices have different outcomes in different cultures and locales. Humans and their varying cultures are so vastly complicated that trying to tease out meaningful determinants of health from statistical noise often seems nearly impossible.

HAITIMAN

Re: Anyone want to live longer?
« Reply #22 on: 8 Mar 2011, 01:29 pm »
[quote

This is an epidemiological study, meaning that it proves correlation, NOT causation.  In other words, it could be living at a high altitude causes a lower risk of coronary artery disease, or it could be a million other things (more exercise, lower stress, you name it). 

This article is complete crap.


The distinction between correlation and causation seems to be the most difficult hurdle preventing people from making meaningful decisions about life choices. I sometimes wonder if the scientific method's reductive elimination of variables in a valid study or experiment will ever give us an anywhere near complete understanding of why many lifestyle choices have different outcomes in different cultures and locales. Humans and their varying cultures are so vastly complicated that trying to tease out meaningful determinants of health from statistical noise often seems nearly impossible.

Well said.

Bottom line: your longevity has already been, (for the most part) determined by your parents. You can eat what you want, smoke what you want, drink what you want, and live wherever you please. Your life expectancy won't change much.
The obsession with "living longer" is held, uniquely, by the American Baby-Boomers. They fuss and stew over this every day of their lives.
We Gen X-ers couldn't care less.

jackman

Re: Anyone want to live longer?
« Reply #23 on: 8 Mar 2011, 02:17 pm »
Haitiman,
I bet the Boomers didn't care about living longer when they were young either!  Caring about living longer is usually a middle-age to older preoccupaction (for the most part) because old age and death are usually too far away for young people to obsess about. 

I'm not trying to outlive everyone I know, but would like to be healthy enough to have a decent quality of life as long as I am alive. :D   Many things are outside of our control and we all know people who live clean and healthy lives only to succumb to cancer (or similar) at a young age.  Genetics play a major role but we don't have control over that so we focus on things within our control. 

My grandfather lived to be 98 and was very active and healthy in his early 90's.  He never worked out or watched his diet one day in his life.  He smoked cigars for over 80 years, gambled, led a very high stress lifestyle, and ate more salt and fat in his diet than anyone I have ever met.  He never drank alcohol in excess (other than homemade wine he made)and he was in the produce business so he ate much more fresh fruits and vegetables than most people but other than that he did nothing to promote good health.  When he was in his 90's, his doctor said his cardio was on par with a guy 30 years younger.  He suffered from the usual aches and pains of an older guy including arthritis but was generally healthy. 

He was rushing to the window at the racetrack (horses) and slipped on some coffee someone had spilled and broke his hip.  He was over 90 years old and never recovered from the surgery.  He spent the last  5 years of his life in nursing homes and eventually died of pneumonia.  My grandfather was a really mean dude and I can't say I liked him when he was alive but he taught me the importance of genetics!  Unfortunately, most people in my family only inherited his bad genetics (baldness, etc.). 

HAITIMAN

Re: Anyone want to live longer?
« Reply #24 on: 8 Mar 2011, 03:20 pm »
Haitiman,
I bet the Boomers didn't care about living longer when they were young either!  Caring about living longer is usually a middle-age to older preoccupaction (for the most part) because old age and death are usually too far away for young people to obsess about. 

I'm not trying to outlive everyone I know, but would like to be healthy enough to have a decent quality of life as long as I am alive. :D   Many things are outside of our control and we all know people who live clean and healthy lives only to succumb to cancer (or similar) at a young age.  Genetics play a major role but we don't have control over that so we focus on things within our control. 

My grandfather lived to be 98 and was very active and healthy in his early 90's.  He never worked out or watched his diet one day in his life.  He smoked cigars for over 80 years, gambled, led a very high stress lifestyle, and ate more salt and fat in his diet than anyone I have ever met.  He never drank alcohol in excess (other than homemade wine he made)and he was in the produce business so he ate much more fresh fruits and vegetables than most people but other than that he did nothing to promote good health.  When he was in his 90's, his doctor said his cardio was on par with a guy 30 years younger.  He suffered from the usual aches and pains of an older guy including arthritis but was generally healthy. 

He was rushing to the window at the racetrack (horses) and slipped on some coffee someone had spilled and broke his hip.  He was over 90 years old and never recovered from the surgery.  He spent the last  5 years of his life in nursing homes and eventually died of pneumonia.  My grandfather was a really mean dude and I can't say I liked him when he was alive but he taught me the importance of genetics!  Unfortunately, most people in my family only inherited his bad genetics (baldness, etc.).

I'm 49. And, no, I am not a Baby-Boomer.

jackman

Re: Anyone want to live longer?
« Reply #25 on: 8 Mar 2011, 04:16 pm »
I'm 49. And, no, I am not a Baby-Boomer.

I'm not so sure about that... :wink:

Quote
The United States Census Bureau considers a baby boomer to be someone born during the demographic birth boom between 1946 and 1964.[8] The Census Bureau is not involved in defining cultural generations.

At least by US definition, you are a Baby Boomer.  Either way, it's just a label and I don't agree with all of the marketing, generalities and BS behind these types of labels.  Plus, you are still relatively young and I don't blame you about not worrying about getting old.

I'm 45 (Gen X) and have a 5 year old son.  My obsession with getting healthy has nothing to do with living to be 100.  I just want to be able to coach my son's baseball team and keep up with him on a bicycle when he is 10!  Hopefully I will live to see him graduate from HS but I'm taking it one day at a time!

Cheers,

Jack

S Clark

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Re: Anyone want to live longer?
« Reply #26 on: 8 Mar 2011, 04:35 pm »
My obsession with getting healthy has nothing to do with living to be 100.  I just want to be able to coach my son's baseball team and keep up with him on a bicycle when he is 10!  Hopefully I will live to see him graduate from HS but I'm taking it one day at a time!
You hit it nail on the head! The key is having goals to achieve,experiences to enjoy, and lives to enrich. These are the things that make life worth living.

rajacat

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Re: Anyone want to live longer?
« Reply #27 on: 8 Mar 2011, 04:37 pm »
Well said.

. You can eat what you want, smoke what you want, drink what you want, and live wherever you please. Your life expectancy won't change much.


I doubt that. You might not live longer but if you choose to smoke, drink and eat the SAD diet,  the probability is much greater that you'll end up in an old folk warehouse instead of living an active and independent old age. I'd much rather choose a healthy lifestyle that would extend my fitness to the max and then die with my body and brain still functional instead finishing my last years in a bed "extending my life".

-Roy

rajacat

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Re: Anyone want to live longer?
« Reply #28 on: 8 Mar 2011, 05:06 pm »
Here's an interesting article about a study on the effects of exercise on the well being of rats
http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/03/02/can-exercise-keep-you-young/?src=me&ref=healthbeing .

-Roy

"At 8 months, when their sedentary lab mates were bald, frail and dying, the running rats remained youthful. They had full pelts of dark fur, no salt-and-pepper shadings. They also had maintained almost all of their muscle mass and brain volume. Their gonads were normal, as were their hearts. They could balance on narrow rods, the showoffs."

Tyson

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Re: Anyone want to live longer?
« Reply #29 on: 8 Mar 2011, 05:36 pm »
Just so people don't think I'm talking out of my @ss on sugar, here's a few interesting facts - Average body mass obesity trending for the US:



So what, you might say?  Lets look at diabetes trending for the US as well:



Gee, looks like there is a strong correlation there - get fat, get diabetes.  Not good. 

OK, so what could possibly be driving the weight gain?  Traditional wisdom says to eat low fat to deal with weight gain, particularly the "bad" fats like beef, butter, bacon, eggs, etc....  Most people assume we don't eat low-fat enough, and thus get fat.  Is that true?  Here's the trend for saturated fat consumption over the same time period:



So, if we are eating less saturated fat, what are we eating more of?  2 things mainly - Polyunsaturated Fat (PUFA), and Sugar (especially High Fructose Corn Syrup):



and:



It's pretty clear, as we've stopped eating animals and started eating more sugar and PUFA's, our weight gain and exposure to chronic disease are trending up with it in lock step.

Wheat is a whole 'nother topic.  For that I'll just direct you to the posts of a cardiologist that has documented (and published) consistent reversal of heart disease.  He has a lot to say about wheat, obesity, diabetes, and heart disease - powerful stuff:

http://www.heartscanblog.org/2010/05/super-carbohydrate.html

http://www.heartscanblog.org/2009/10/name-that-food.html

http://www.heartscanblog.org/2009/04/blast-small-ldl-to-oblivion.html

http://www.heartscanblog.org/2009/03/can-millet-make-you-diabetic.html

toxteth ogrady

Re: Anyone want to live longer?
« Reply #30 on: 8 Mar 2011, 07:37 pm »
Those graphs certainly are eye-opening. It's unbelievable how much the modern diet has degenerated. I feel much better about the order I placed last week for 100lbs of grass fed beef :lol:

I'm 40 and have only been doing the Paleo thing since the first week of January, but the results of this diet combined with my Crossfit regimen are truly impressive. Together they have been transformational. I play pick up soccer once a week and in the last couple of years have fallen back to a more defensive position due to steadily declining stamina. In less than 9 weeks I'm back in the midfield running and sprinting upwards of 5 miles a game and in the process, embarrassing a few of the twenty-somethings that I play with. Of course, the Crossfit regimen plays a huge role in this, but there's no question the way I'm eating also contributes greatly to how I am feeling.

As for living longer, I can't say. But I can say for sure I will feel better in the years to come by removing as much as I can of the processed, refined, pesticide-laced, hormone and antibiotic saturated foods from my diet. It's common sense really.




jackman

Re: Anyone want to live longer?
« Reply #32 on: 8 Mar 2011, 09:33 pm »
Those graphs certainly are eye-opening. It's unbelievable how much the modern diet has degenerated. I feel much better about the order I placed last week for 100lbs of grass fed beef :lol:

I'm 40 and have only been doing the Paleo thing since the first week of January, but the results of this diet combined with my Crossfit regimen are truly impressive. Together they have been transformational. I play pick up soccer once a week and in the last couple of years have fallen back to a more defensive position due to steadily declining stamina. In less than 9 weeks I'm back in the midfield running and sprinting upwards of 5 miles a game and in the process, embarrassing a few of the twenty-somethings that I play with. Of course, the Crossfit regimen plays a huge role in this, but there's no question the way I'm eating also contributes greatly to how I am feeling.

As for living longer, I can't say. But I can say for sure I will feel better in the years to come by removing as much as I can of the processed, refined, pesticide-laced, hormone and antibiotic saturated foods from my diet. It's common sense really.



What is Crossfit?  Is there a website with more information? 

Thanks!

J

rahimlee54

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Re: Anyone want to live longer?
« Reply #33 on: 8 Mar 2011, 09:52 pm »
What is Crossfit?  Is there a website with more information? 

Thanks!

J

Crossfit: http://crossfit.com/

It is what the police and firefighters use alot of the time.  It is high high intensity, good workout and great for weight loss.  It usually costs but you can get workouts on the site for free.

I am not sure about the processed grains and all that, as I eat them daily, but diet is a huge factor in overall health.  I changed mine about a year ago and went from 225 at 20% or so BF to around 10% bodyfat in about 5 months.  That was a personal goal, but not everyone is interested in that.  The diet change gave me more energy and now when I eat unhealthy food, my stomach and body let me know. After eating complex carbs eating simple sugars just won't cut it. 

Jared

Tyson

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Re: Anyone want to live longer?
« Reply #34 on: 8 Mar 2011, 10:18 pm »
I like the approach that is advocated in the Primal Blueprint for exercise - several days of just walking around, punctuated by an occasional day of high intensity interval work (sprints), followed by more walking, followed by high intensity lifting, followed again by several days of walking.  He also estimates that diet is about 80% responsible for body composition, and exercise only 20%.  Judging by how he looks, I believe him! 

Even if his approach is not "more effective" than standard training, I'd personally rather spend the majority of my time moving about at a moderate pace, which has a long history of proven health benefits, and only a little bit of time doing the sprints and heavy lifting - both of which do not have the same proven benefits in studies.  Of course, this type of interval, intense training is still fairly new and hasn't had the time to be studied quite as thoroughly as good old walking.  I am guessing it will prove quite valuable too, over time, but the results are still not fully in (although they are trending in the right direction). 

From a personal standpoint, walking most days I can stick with, and I can even get myself to do some weight training or sprints on occasion.  But kicking my ass every day (or even every other day) with high intensity physical work?  Ain't gonna happen, I'll just stop doing it eventually, and sooner than later. 

The cool thing is that jogging and "aerobics" is completely off my radar.  I f'ing hate jogging, or the elliptical, etc...  Luckily, the studies that have compared jogging to walking have shown zero additional benefit for jogging over walking.  And in some cases it's seems as though jogging a lot is actually detrimental!  So, moderate walking with sometimes doing sprints or heavy lifting seems very doable and very reasonable to me.

Oh, and if anyone wants to check it out, I highly recommend the website for the Primal Blueprint:

http://www.marksdailyapple.com

toxteth ogrady

Re: Anyone want to live longer?
« Reply #35 on: 8 Mar 2011, 10:30 pm »
Jackman,

Check out youtube for hundreds of videos of different crossfit workouts. Unfortunately most of them are set to obnoxious soundtracks. Here's one of the less offensive ones - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IVBgKB4Gnsw

jhm731

Re: Anyone want to live longer?
« Reply #36 on: 8 Mar 2011, 10:37 pm »
If you're looking to change your eating habits, here's a good site:

http://www.eatrightamerica.com

Yes, there's a strong correlation between being fat and getting diabetes. Look at all the ads for diabetes products on TV.

Buy stock in companies make diabetes products.




Photon46

Re: Anyone want to live longer?
« Reply #37 on: 9 Mar 2011, 12:14 am »
I like the approach that is advocated in the Primal Blueprint for exercise - several days of just walking around, punctuated by an occasional day of high intensity interval work (sprints), followed by more walking, followed by high intensity lifting, followed again by several days of walking.  He also estimates that diet is about 80% responsible for body composition, and exercise only 20%.  Judging by how he looks, I believe him! 


http://www.marksdailyapple.com

I've never heard of the Primal Blueprint, but it's the sort of approach my wife & I have taken for the last thirty years. After she quit competitive bodybuilding, we've lifted weights about twice a week and alternated that with fast walking and jogging the other days. We take one day a week off from everything. Alternating hard days and easier days sure suits us better as the years add up! Personally, I like to jog. It clears my head, gives me an endorphin high and makes me happy that I've successfully battled entropy another day. :lol: I'd also add that stretching is important, we really lose flexibility if we don't work to maintain a supple frame. Aging really is about losing flexibilty of the mind, spirit, and body.

geezer

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Re: Anyone want to live longer?
« Reply #38 on: 9 Mar 2011, 02:00 am »
About 20 years ago I learned an important lesson about the effects of different diets. While browsing in a bookstore I came on a chapter where the author (an MD) claimed that certain elements in one's diet can trigger allergies. I knew that many people have food allergies (mine are peanuts and shellfish), but this was not what he was talking about. what he was saying was that sometimes a certain food will trigger an allergy to something else, such as pollens for example. Since at the time I had been tortured for years  by air borne allergens, I paid attention. Following his advice, I reduced my diet to a meager minimum of foods: just eight fruits and vegetables.

In a few weeks my allergies began to diminish. Then the process was to add new foods, one at a time each week, to see if they were safe, or if they again aggravated my allergies. Over a period of several months I found out what I could safely eat, and what I couldn't. The upshot was that I ended up as a vegetarian (excepting fish), but certain vegetables were taboo, as were all processed foods.

After about six months my allergies had disappeared, but it turned out that there were also some benefits that I didn't expect. One that was not a surprise was that I lost weight, back to what I weighed at high school graduation and, although I eat like a horse, I don't gain it back. Another was that my blood pressure, which had been at the level where my MD wanted to put me on medication, went back to 120/70. I don't know whether that was mostly due to the vegetarianism (with the only fats being olive oil and such), or the loss of weight; probably both.

But there were a couple of real surprises: I used to have 3 or 4 headaches a week, and especially if I had only one alcoholic drink I'd have a headache within the hour. Since I changed my diet, 20 years ago, I haven't had one headache even though I now have a glass of wine at lunch and one at dinner every day. Another surprise: While I used to have 3 or 4 cold sores each year, I haven't had even one since the diet change. And finally, there was a significant increase in my general energy level.

If you're having health problems, you might try this kind of food elimination process. Of course, what works for me may not work for you, but if you have a health problem you haven't been able to solve, it might be worth a try.

Elizabeth

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Re: Anyone want to live longer?
« Reply #39 on: 9 Mar 2011, 02:43 am »
Plan on living 'longer' NO.
Everyone in my family lived way too long. They all had ugly empty deaths when in thier 90's. (and way too many of my friends parents had the same problem)
I do not plan on allowing that to happen to me. When the time i feel my quality of live has receeded far enough, that is it.