[Hebrew Hammer]

I should be getting mine in the next few days and I'll start posting up pics and comments   

[dBe]

Very good looking design.
I will happily stand in line for a set, so let us know when they will be available.

Ed

Ed, we are shipping them now.  You can shoot Greg a PM (he is ADD in the member's list) and he will give you all of the scoop.

Thanks for the kind words,   

Dave

[tasar]

Very good looking design.
I will happily stand in line for a set, so let us know when they will be available.

Ed

Ummmm.......what design ? Is there a link to what you and Dave are referring ?

[dBe]

Ummmm.......what design ? Is there a link to what you and Dave are referring ?

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=91052.msg905422#msg905422


Earlier in the thread.  They run $5.00 more per pair in the 24x24 unpainted versions.

Dave

[tasar]

....good start Dave.......now let us know how many and where for starters. there's no "typical room" but there must be benchmarks and suggestions such as, "you don't need corner tubes with these", "they work well as absorbers and deflectors(diffusers)" etc etc

[dBe]

....good start Dave.......now let us know how many and where for starters. there's no "typical room" but there must be benchmarks and suggestions such as, "you don't need corner tubes with these", "they work well as absorbers and deflectors(diffusers)" etc etc

Well, we are still on the learning curve with these like any new product.  That's one thing that never changes, we ALWAYS are learning.

You are right about another - there is no such thing as a typical room is residential settings.  There are certainly similar rooms and some basic guidelines, but no cookie cutter approach for treating a residential listening setting.

There are some things going on with openbaffle speakers that are certainly different than closed or infinite baffles.  We'll get in to these this week, but I want to really and I mean REALLY step on some toes and tell you that a lot of what is going around about open baffles making room treatment unnecessary is BS with a capital BULL.  Modes are still modes, reflections are still reflections and room pressurization still occurs - it just occurs differently.

That ought to bring 'em out of the woodwork.   

Back to work: hi-ho, hi-ho......................

Dave

[gooberdude]

I would agree 100% with Dave's last post - room treatments are critical no matter what type of speakers you have.

I've had a full OB speaker set for some time (Hawthorne Sterlings + Auggies - 15") and i wouldn't enjoy them nearly as much without room treatments. Same goes for the Thiel & other non OB speakers i've owned in the past.

My only experiences to date have been with absorption - Owens Corning 703 based products & Michael Greens Room Tunes...but i'm planning to try these PI diffusers as well.

Dave - since you make other designs of diffusors, which i'm assuming are not OB specific, will you be able to discuss the differences between the designs & what led you to to an OB design?

matt

[dBe]

I would agree 100% with Dave's last post - room treatments are critical no matter what type of speakers you have.

Dave - since you make other designs of diffusors, which i'm assuming are not OB specific, will you be able to discuss the differences between the designs & what led you to to an OB design?

matt

Matt, I started with EPS QRD Diffusers back in the early 90's and sold a ton of them to recording studios and some to home use for dedicated listening rooms.  I took a left turn about 10 years ago and pretty much quit doing acoustical design and treatment work... just got burned out.  When I decided to start working with room acoustics again (at the behest of Igor and Jim Rogers) I knew that it was time to come up with a diffuser that worked well but wasn't butt ugly like QRDs tend to be.  Having had many years of experience in using diffusion and absorption I knew a few things going in.  Measuring the effects of diffusion is really, REALLY hard.  Bob Hodas and I talked about this at RMAF a couple of years ago.  By definition, it is very difficult to measure a diffuse soundfield.  Measuring absorbers is really easy. Not so with diffusors.  A lot of diffusers have heavily relied upon the optical phase grating approach to address acoustical diffusion.  This led to the QRD diffusers which produce a cylinderical re-radiation of sound in a time delayed manner that is quite predictable mathematically and works extremely well.  Problem is that QRDs do not address incidental sound very well, hence products like Skyline, ArtFusors, etc.

When I set about designing the new diffuser line I had three things in mind: using math to determine the frequencies that needed to be addressed for home application;  something that worked visually in an interesting manner; a low cost material that has a lot of things going for it acoustically - EPS.  It is a bit on the fragile side and needs to be placed carefully and protected as much as possible.  This is not a product that can be used in a home with three year olds running around, for sure.

The sonic concerns are really quite simple.  Scatter sound in a non correlated, redirected manner.  The stroke of genius on my part was that I listened to Trung Tran and had the same pattern cut 90 degrees in opposition.  The man had a great idea and I followed his lead.  Thank you, Trung.  There you go.  We are all in this together.  When something works, it works.  A good idea is a good idea.  This one just makes pefect sense to use for room treatment for open baffles in that it re-radiates energy in a 4 pi manner.

Shared brilliance is what I am all about.

Dave

[gooberdude]

Great info Dave, thanks.

Do you see an issue with making thin wooden frames for these, or could that introduce additional reflections that might hamper the design?

I'll have diffusors in 2 rooms mounted a solid masonry wall, and a 3rd that'll be mounted on drywall.
 
Not sure how i got so lucky, but i bought a lightly used set of your ob diffusors here at the trading post this weekend.

[dBe]

Great info Dave, thanks.

Do you see an issue with making thin wooden frames for these, or could that introduce additional reflections that might hamper the design?

I'll have diffusors in 2 rooms mounted a solid masonry wall, and a 3rd that'll be mounted on drywall.
 
Not sure how i got so lucky, but i bought a lightly used set of your ob diffusors here at the trading post this weekend.

The frames will be OK as long as they don't shadow (block) the rest of the diffuser from incidental sound.

They didn't work out for Jason.  They really didn't work out in his room.  I'm glad that it worked out for both of you.

Dave

[jtwrace]

He really didn't work out in his room.
Dave

 

[dBe]

I bet you are curious.  The correct word is "They".  I really need to wear my glasses when posting, especially on the laptop.

My bad.   

Sheesh!  Obviously I have no problem hitting the dumbass button.   

Dave

[gooberdude]

Dave, are you saying Jason needs to hit the gym or what???   


Initially i might try some picture hanging wire with fasteners attached to the back of the panels, to try & avoid a frame.  Do you recommend the diffusors fit flush to the wall, or can there be a slight gap - 1/2" or so?

matt

[dBe]

Dave, are you saying Jason needs to hit the gym or what???   


Initially i might try some picture hanging wire with fasteners attached to the back of the panels, to try & avoid a frame.  Do you recommend the diffusors fit flush to the wall, or can there be a slight gap - 1/2" or so?

matt

Nah, if you read Jason's posts about the Abbey's you know that he worked out in his room a LOT!  I was watching the Las Vegas race and I can't see the TV with my readers on.  Something had to give...

Spacing them slightly off of the wall slightly will improve their performance in the lower frequencies.  That is what I recommend if possible.

Dave