[Napalm]

thanks, Nap. btw, i've never heard about Kirkwood processors...are they common in the Hifi domain?

al.

Dunno about hi-fi but they're very common where you need a small low power board that runs Linux.

Nap.

[Napalm]

Tell me more Nap !!

The color of your underpants will influence the soundstage.

nap. 

[vengky]

Hi VK,

The connectors are soldered directly to the output board so it would have to come to service.

james

Yeah My AD saw my posting and told me to bring it in.

I was looking at the connector it looks like its made of some kind of gold wire or it is just copper wire. 

Cheers
VK

[Phil A]

The color of your underpants will influence the soundstage.

nap. 

Does that mean if it has a brown stripe the soundstage is not very 3D?

[Welly123]

Welly123

RU done jisming all over this board ?. Cuz if you are you can go and try some different usb cables and maybe respond with some real experience on it. I would actually like to hear what you say on the differences or if any. There are many people here who are not interested in this form of overlording that seems to be your way of communication.

Oh well, I tried... I guess some people are just happy in their ignorance.

[terrycym]

I, for one, am finding this "debate" between the two of you non-productive.
Can you please desist here and take it off-line?

Werd, why don't you go spend the night outside wearing only underpants, it will make you hear celestial music.

nap.

[Napalm]

I, for one, am finding this "debate" between the two of you non-productive.

We don't do unpaid productivity.

Nap. 

[werd]

Oh well, I tried... I guess some people are just happy in their ignorance.

Yah the same ignorance that led me to try out some different usb cables. Why would you go spend that kind of money on a BDP and then lock down your hobby because of your misconceptions? Its because you are too stubborn to challenge yourself. Its your money do what you want with it but stay off my posts.

[BrysTony]

Thats what i was afraid. keep that HD and go get a 2.0 ssd usb. You got like 4 usb inputs on the bdp. You will need more space anyways. I only say this because thats what i would do, i am not sure how long it will be before we see a 3.0 usb from a good wire manufacture. Looking at the usual suspects and nothing like you said.

The thing that sucks is its hard to test drive this stuff. HD and usb interface for sound that is.

Werd, 

OK -- Back to the conversation about USB 3.0 cables.  I got a response from the three manufacturers that I contacted.  Nordost said that they will have one out in the next few months.  Cardas says yes but not soon -- maybe for CES 2012.  Kimber says no plans due audio industry not yet adopting USB 3.0 standard.

I responded back to Nordost that I would be happy to have them send me an engineering sample for test.   

Tony

[Napalm]

Say Werd, how did your listening session go last night? The temperature was just perfect...

Nap. 

[werd]

Werd, 

OK -- Back to the conversation about USB 3.0 cables.  I got a response from the three manufacturers that I contacted.  Nordost said that they will have one out in the next few months.  Cardas says yes but not soon -- maybe for CES 2012.  Kimber says no plans due audio industry not yet adopting USB 3.0 standard.

I responded back to Nordost that I would be happy to have them send me an engineering sample for test.   

Tony

Hi Tony

Thats some pretty fine initiative.  Hopefully Nordost will send you one.  An ssd driving a 3.0 could be an improvement over a 2.0 usb without having to rummage through usb cables.  I would like to hear that HD on its own as is.

I just gave the bdp back to it's owner. I have to admit i was kind of chilled by having to connect its own HD and control it remotely through ethernet.  But after having one in my house and using my ipod/desktop its hard to look at other dacs and systems. Even if i found one i like better sonically(and we are talking thousands more) the functionality of this unit makes it really hard to pass up. I know Other dacs can be set up with computer control but this means using a really long cord (for me anyways) that streams the actual audio data. The longest cord with the bdp is the ethernet connect and its not transfering audio data but control commands.

Using my ipod with the bdp is about as convenient as you can get. If you are nimble enough you can build playlists but i did most of that on my desktop and scrolled though tunes on my ipod. Its too funky to ignore using the ipod imo 

You got a really nice player 

[werd]

Say Werd, how did your listening session go last night? The temperature was just perfect...

Nap. 

sorry man, i don't want get you  turned on.... 

[skunark]

Keep in mind when looking for SSDs, one should select the higher reliable single-layer cell SSD over the multi-layer cell SSD designs.    SLCs have a 10x longer life, consumes less power and typically a faster design.   Yes it's a little more but keeping those bits safe is key. 

Also make note that all SSDs will use several flash chips made from  different OEMs and in the end the key difference will be in the 1) the chip used to create the SATA interface and 2) the chip used to bridge SATA and USB.  Eventually this will probably become the same chip for the low-cost manufactures but the architecture is unlikely to change until USB 3.0 is fully adopted. 

Also note, even if you buy an external SSD drive with USB 3.0, it will still operate in the 2.0 standard with the BDP-1 which eliminates any protocol gains USB 3.0 would offer, which is mostly speed in this case.  The only advantage or disadvantage would be the chips in that design are newer.   From a reliability standpoint, since the USB are defined as a harddrive (i.e. vs a USB DAC) there's no issues with data loss over that interface as the error correction is enabled and checked unlike the USB DACs where it's is ignored.

The argument for an expensive USB cable for a SSD is significantly weaker than for a USB cable for a DAC.   As it annoys me, selecting a USB 3.0 drive over a 2.0 drive would likely get you to a newer analog PHY that conforms to a tighter electrical specs, which would potentially make that interface more reliable.  You could argue since error correction is enabled end-to-end, the cable would have to be extremely poor for the user to hear a difference.

Most USB chips offer the ability to report errors so it would be interesting if James could get their engineers to provide a method to report that to the consumer so they would know if they have a bad USB cable or some unexplained failure with the USB device.   

[skunark]

Regarding the USB cable used in a BDP-1. You are better-off spending your money elsewhere and sticking with a standard cable.

The data read from a connected HDD is not "Audio data", i.e. timing, jitter, noise etc. are simply not relevant, it is just the same as reading/running a computer program, passing through the processor, memory, sound card, motherboard and all the little conductors on the motherboard. I am not of the "bits is bits” persuasion but in the case of the BDP-1, the USB cable cannot be relevant to audio quality... Unlike synchronous/asynchronous DACs taking data from a USB stream where the USB cable could make a difference because they are reading audio data where timing, jitter, noise are relevant.

Regards

Russell

Actually Russell seems to have already address the USB cable for SSD topic effectively and a second time in true EE fashion, kinda made my day.  Don't take it personally Werd, that's how we EEs think and to bend our views will require to point out what we didn't test, but he is correct.    Russell, to keep the theme, why did you select silver over gold solder?   Anyways no need to flame me, sorry for the addressing this via my angle a second time.

I will point out it would be beneficial for digital transports, players and DACs to report data failures.   It would also be interesting for the audiophile type magazines to review this as well.

[Bugsy]

I spoke to James a while back about usb3 versues usb 2 and he said some what the same as Skunark " even if you buy an external SSD drive with USB 3.0, it will still operate in the 2.0 standard with the BDP-1 which eliminates any protocol gains USB 3.0 would offer, which is mostly speed in this case"  The BDP-1 and BDA-1 have usb 2 inputs.

[werd]

Actually Russell seems to have already address the USB cable for SSD topic effectively and a second time in true EE fashion, kinda made my day.  Don't take it personally Werd, that's how we EEs think and to bend our views will require to point out what we didn't test, but he is correct.    Russell, to keep the theme, why did you select silver over gold solder?   Anyways no need to flame me, sorry for the addressing this via my angle a second time.

I will point out it would be beneficial for digital transports, players and DACs to report data failures.   It would also be interesting for the audiophile type magazines to review this as well.

Thats ok Skunark.  . I was never suggesting this was an electrical issue. Its a pure biological issue on the basis of hearing and listening. I wouldn't expect an EE to be able answer that anyways. I am coming at this from a hobby point of view. Go ahead and talk shop about electical matters and i will talk about what it sounds like.

[BrysTony]

I recall a discussion on this board where James said that USB 3.0 was not required because 2.0 was fast enough for transfer of music files.  I agree but it may have been faster for updating the file index for the BDP-1 but we will not know that because the BDP-1 uses the 2.0 protocol.  As for SSDs, they offer the advantage of no physical noise and speed.  Today, most external SSDs are USB 3.0 protocol and that requires a different connector on the SSD end.  The only cables currently available are the cheap, made in China variety.  Is that "good enough"?  I have no idea, but I do know that as soon as an "audiophile quality" USB 3.0 cable is available from one of the known high quality cable manufacturers, I will try it. 

Tony

[Welly123]

Yah the same ignorance that led me to try out some different usb cables. Why would you go spend that kind of money on a BDP and then lock down your hobby because of your misconceptions? Its because you are too stubborn to challenge yourself. Its your money do what you want with it but stay off my posts.

Werd,

You contradict yourself every other post, and every post you prove your stupidity. I suggest that you commence a hobby that you do understand, like assembling Lego bricks… rather than allow music to reverberate around in the empty space between your ears. Just to put you straight on a few points, although it will probably be beyond your understanding and you will follow with more irrelevant and inane comments:
1) I have a BDP-1, serial number 00014. I have had it for a number of months now and plenty of opportunity to experiment and listen. I see from a previous post of yours, that you do not have one.

2) I have tried a number of USB sources, including different types of Flash/Thumb drives, SSD HDDs and conventional HDDs. The fact that I (and some like-minded friends) hear no difference between multiple Thumb drives SSDs and the HDDs supports the fact that the USB cable can make no difference with this implementation. Otherwise a thumb drive would be superior because it has no cable. The reason that a number of brands and types of thumb drives were available is because my friends brought some of their favourite and familiar tracks on a variety of USB devices.

3) Because the Flash/Thumb drive has no cable, it is reasonable to use this as a reference. In the (impossible) event that a USB cable employed with the BDP-1 does change the sound then it can only be adding colouration compared to the Flash/Thumb drive reference. In this (still impossible) event, you may actually prefer the changed sound, but then the cable is acting as a tone control and you are no longer listening to the source the way the musician/producer intended. i.e. it is no longer faithful to the original.

So, one more time, I challenge you to attempt to prove your point, and incidentally prove that you may have something of value between your ears.

Regards

Russell

[Welly123]

does anyone knows what kind of processor is used on the BDP-1's mainboard? any specs...??

al.

The processor is AMD I believe this is the model and basic specs:
· AMD Geode LX CPU, 500 MHz 5x86 CPU,
· 256 KB cache (64K data + 64K instruction + 128K L2)

Regards

Russell

[alexone]

...allright, Russell. thank you.

al.