[Johnny2Bad]

Johnny thanks for the post.  There is a lot of good info in there pretaining to Apple TV and great audio on a budget.


A couple of things.  First, the Mac Mini mods aren't mine by any stretch of the imagination.  I'm just blessed to know Darrell and Kevin, they are then ones that have the Minis figured out.  Second, when fully optimized for audio, none of the older Minis hold a candle to the 2010.  This does not keep the older ones from being used for high quality music servers, they just don't sound as good as a fully optimized 2010.


Dave

You have to be willing to use an external USB DAC with the G4 Mini for best sound quality. Although my experience suggests the CPU works very well, the standard audio-out is not particularly remarkable in the G4 versions, although it's better than something like, say, a Creative Sound Blaster card, most of which resample everything, including 44.1 CDs, to 48 Khz.

Some people on a strict budget may start with the G4 and save for an appropriate DAC; you can, for example, get the full 16 bits of resolution from a CD in 24 bit analog out mode with a G4 Mini (a 16-bit sound card usually delivers perhaps 13 bits of resolution). That's really the only other situation where it would be most useful.

[newzooreview]

You have to be willing to use an external USB DAC with the G4 Mini for best sound quality.

That's exactly what Dave is talking about: the old G4 Mini vs. the current model using a high-quality USB DAC. He's saying the old G4 Mini does not sound as good. The processor is only a small part of the story, and if you're using the Mini as a dedicated music server the processor differences that you describe above are not going to govern the overall sound quality since the processor is only doing one thing.

[dBe]

That's exactly what Dave is talking about: the old G4 Mini vs. the current model using a high-quality USB DAC. He's saying the old G4 Mini does not sound as good. The processor is only a small part of the story, and if you're using the Mini as a dedicated music server the processor differences that you describe above are not going to govern the overall sound quality since the processor is only doing one thing.

The differences between the two units is not great, but there are differences.  Kevin and Darrell work on all iterations of the Mini and they can all sound terriffic.  The biggest difference is the 2010 responds very well to power cable tweaks.  The older brick has limitations that the new integrated PS does not from the standpoint of tweaking power.  Computers are just like every other piece of audio gear in that incoming power is what drives the audio quality.  The efficiency of the new processor layout is another reason that the 2010 sounds so good.  Dan's reference to the response of the G4 to a linear power supply is a very good recommendation.  Bolder's supply is another way to improve the sound of an older Mini.

The whole computer based audio system revolution is a boon to quality audio whose time has come.  It is awesome to hear the quality that is easily accessible and affordable that (gasp!) rivals vinyl in listenability.  Now is a great time to be an audiophool.

Dave

[jtwrace]

Bolder's supply is another way to improve the sound of an older Mini.

Dave

So you're saying that the Bolder supply would be better than just plugging the '09 Mini into a Majik, Uber or MuthaBuss?

[dBe]

So you're saying that the Bolder supply would be better than just plugging the '09 Mini into a Majik, Uber or MuthaBuss?

I'm all about linear power supplies for computers, especially ones for audio.  Some years ago a couple of us here in Albuquerque put our heads together and built a linear power supply for a MAC that was running a full blown ProTools Core 6.  The difference in audio quality was amazing.  The glassy, cold high frequencies and the bass were the areas of the greatest improvement, but everything was better and sounded less digital.

All of that to say:  The best deal would be a linear power supply powered by a BUSS.  Part of the problem with the brick is the power cable that comes out of the power supply to the Mini.  It is a long antenna for the RF generated by the brick as well as the RF imprinted on the power from the brick.

I just snapped!  THIS is the topic that started our friendship.  It is a trip into the wayback machine for me.  Cool.   

I'm still thinking that battery power for the older Minis is the way to go, though.  I have been told that the only reason the older Mini needed 18.5V was for the screen display and the brians would run on 12V all day long.  I have not been able to verify this.  If so, it would be a no-brainer to hook up to a battery/charger combo like we have for our Dodd gear.

Are you thinking about Mach2 doing their mods on your Mini?

Dave

[jtwrace]

If a linear supply is the way to go with a buss then why not do that?  I'm pretty sure I got the Buss part.   

Get to it!   


Mini mods?  **thinking** 

[dmccombs]

Just a quick update from Mach2 Music...  We have a new and improved website up.

We have been filling orders, listening to customers, and listening to various hardware and software options.  As a result we learned some things and we have updated our website with some new options, and more information.

We want to provide the best sound possible at a reasonable price point.  Thank you all for your support and feedback thusfar.  It helps us put out a better Mach2 for all to enjoy.

Darrell
www.mach2music.com
 

[Phil]

Darrell,

The new website looks great.  What is your opinion about differences in overall sound using the mini networked via a wireless router connection vs. wired?

Phil

[dmccombs]

Phil,

   Thanks for the feedback on the website.  I have been working to add more info as I get time between orders.
 
   We hear a subtle difference with the wifi turned on.  If you can easily run a wired Ethernet to your Mac, that would be best, but the difference is subtle enough that most of us just go ahead and use the wifi.

  When I use Wifi, I turn off the Ethernet port.  Either way you have to have a connection on, but the wired ethernet is quieter.

   Having network access is really cool with the Mach2.  I can control it via a Mac, PC, iPhone, iTouch, iPad, and my Driod Phone.

   I am having the best time controlling Amarra from my driod phone.  I thought it would be a pain from the little screen, but in fact, the Interface is easy and quick.

Darrell
www.mach2music.com

[mchuckp]

I just got a stock model Mac Mini a few days ago.  Running it into a Wyred4Sound Dac-1 via USB.  So far everything is working great.  Running headless using 'Screen Sharing' from my MacBook.  Currently using Fidelia as my software of choice.

Here's my question.  I was planning on dropping some more memory in it relatively soon and take it up to 4g or 8g of RAM.  Besides that expenditure, I have about $300 more I can put into it in the short term.  What is the best place to start?  Try and get a Mach2Mac software upgrade? PI Audio power cord?  MacSandwich?  SS internal drive?  I can always do more down the line but trying to get the most bang for the buck in the near future.

BTW, I do have a Majik Buss in the chain and running my music library on an external HDD attached to Mini.

Thanks!
Mike

[dBe]

I just got a stock model Mac Mini a few days ago.  Running it into a Wyred4Sound Dac-1 via USB.  So far everything is working great.  Running headless using 'Screen Sharing' from my MacBook.  Currently using Fidelia as my software of choice.

Here's my question.  I was planning on dropping some more memory in it relatively soon and take it up to 4g or 8g of RAM.  Besides that expenditure, I have about $300 more I can put into it in the short term.  What is the best place to start?  Try and get a Mach2Mac software upgrade? PI Audio power cord?  MacSandwich?  SS internal drive?  I can always do more down the line but trying to get the most bang for the buck in the near future.

BTW, I do have a Majik Buss in the chain and running my music library on an external HDD attached to Mini.

Thanks!
Mike

Mike, this is a toughie, but I'll take a swing.   

The best thing you can do is the Mach2 mod, but there is a kicker here.  IMO one of the integral parts of the Mach2 "sound" is the internal HDD.  This makes their work on your Mini a bit pricier.  Perhaps Darrell will weigh in on this and give you some guidance.  It really is worth it, though.  They have just recently added Fidelia as a supported music player.

Of the two: the MacSandwich and the MPC/Mini power cable, the one to do first is the power cable.  It provides the sonic foundation that the MacSandwich will build upon later.

Here is my bottom line,  I would go for the items in this order - Mach2, MPC/Mini, MacSandwich.  With this in mind and if your budget is fixed at ~ $300, the MPC/Mini is the way to go.

Any other opinions from Mach2 owners (and others) are welcome here, please.

Dave 

[jtwrace]

SSD first

[dmccombs]

Mike,

  I agree with Dave, this is a tough one, and as usual, Dave has given terific advise.

  All the mods Dave listed improve the sound.  We consider the Mach2 upgrade the basis for all other upgrades.  By replacing the internal hard drive with an SSD, and doing our numerous software mods, the MacMini is taken to another level.  This allows all other mods to be be heard even more.

   But, this isn't necessary of course.  There are many ways to great sound.        The MacSandwich and MPC/Mini power cord will help any MacMini, in a great way.  Both of these are within your $300 range.  I like both products tremendously and had to think which I would get first if I were in your shoes.

   The MacSandwich lowers the noise floor a little and provided a wider and deeper soundstage in my system.  The soundstage improvement was not subtle.

   The MPC/Mini in my system, lowered the noise floor noticeably so things sounded cleaner, there was better seperation between instruments, and the soundstage was improved a bit.

   Not knowing your system, but seeing what the two products did in my system, I would agree with Dave and recommend the MPC/Mini power cord.  Its a great upgrade.   

Darrell
www.mach2music.com

P.S. A point of clarification...  We now provide a script for Fidelia as a bonus for our users.  Our customers can e-mail us for the script, if they use Fidelia and want to make it sound better.  We also have them for Audirvana, Decibel, and of course for the Apps in our build (iTunes, Play, Pandora), and the ones we sell (Amarra, and Pure Music).

But, we don't provide support for Fidelia/Audirvana/Decibel (i.e. don't ask us questions about them).  They are not apps we include in the Mach2 Setup. 

[Nels Ferre]

Hi All,

Just to throw it out there-

I went from a MacBook to a Mac Mini, and the sound improved dramatically. I am thinking this is because the screen isn't attached to the computer. I still have a 40" LCD monitor attached to the Mini as we use it for TV and movies (Hulu and Netfix.) The built in DVD player has also become our default DVD player, rendering our Philips model redundant.

We have a 2010 Mini, and I have upgraded the RAM to 8GB. I am thinking of changing the 320GB internal hard drive out, but have looked at the process on You Tube videos, and while the videos are clear, I am still somewhat apprehensive. Assuming that I bite the bullet and upgrade the hard drive, the next logical step would be the Mach2 setup.

But here's the catch, I have personal info on my hard drives (financial, etc.) and would not want to send the Mini out of the house. Now if Mach2 were to offer a DIY alternative (like sell a Disk Image of the setup) for those of us who are comfortable installing the software on our own, that would be very cool.

Just a thought.

[dmccombs]

Nels,

  Yeah, it would be nice if we could get someone else to do our work.  LOL  DIY...   But it wouldn't work in your situation.  We wipe the drive and load the OSX fresh.  This way we don't have crap from previous versions.

  We do recommend that people use their Mach2 just for music.  As people load other business, photography, Instant Messengers, applications, process get kicked up in the background.  All sorts of process run that don't have to do with music playback.  This works against our music optimization.

  So, if you were to have us turn you Mac into a Mach2Music server, we would ask you to remove your data before you send us the machine.  We would then wipe the disk and turn it into a Mach Music server.

  I hope this expalins our approach a bit.

Darrell
www.mach2music.com

[dBe]

Hi All,

Just to throw it out there-

I went from a MacBook to a Mac Mini, and the sound improved dramatically. I am thinking this is because the screen isn't attached to the computer. I still have a 40" LCD monitor attached to the Mini as we use it for TV and movies (Hulu and Netfix.) The built in DVD player has also become our default DVD player, rendering our Philips model redundant.

We have a 2010 Mini, and I have upgraded the RAM to 8GB. I am thinking of changing the 320GB internal hard drive out, but have looked at the process on You Tube videos, and while the videos are clear, I am still somewhat apprehensive. Assuming that I bite the bullet and upgrade the hard drive, the next logical step would be the Mach2 setup.

But here's the catch, I have personal info on my hard drives (financial, etc.) and would not want to send the Mini out of the house. Now if Mach2 were to offer a DIY alternative (like sell a Disk Image of the setup) for those of us who are comfortable installing the software on our own, that would be very cool.

Just a thought.

Nels, a few thoughts.

Changing the hard drives out in a 2010 Mac Mini is not for the faint of heart, like you said.  It is not at all like the older Minis.  The first 1/4" is the most critical.  If you screw up there it is a VERY costly mistake.  Like the guys at Mach2 say: there are a lot of machines that are FUBAR because the owners thought they could just tear into their Minis.  The SSD is a very good improvement, but I'll let others do that one for me.   

Another thing that wasn't mentioned is the source drive for the data.  Make sure to use a HDD enclosure with the Oxford 934 or 936 chipset.  They sound the best, so far.  Use a good Firewire cable, too.

Here is the deal on the image file from someone that is not involved in Mach2's business.  I am speaking from experience here.  Intellectual property is worth a lot or nothing depending upon who you talk to.  I know that Darrell has hundreds upon hundreds of hours invested in the software that is the core of the Mach2 modifications.  All it would take is one inconsiderate, unethical SOB with no regard to the work involved or the fact that this is another person's income to rip it off, post it on a torrent site and that would be that.  No support, no upgrades, no worries    People that think that everything should be in the public domain should get a clue.

Who is John Galt?

Your MacSandwich and MPC/Mini power cable go out tomorrow.  Gayle is doing better, the granchildren are home with Mom and I have a huge backlog of things to get out, so I'm off to the shop.

Dave

[Nels Ferre]

Dave,

You are right. I had not thought if torrent sites. I'd like to think no one on the audio community would actually post a disk image, but Darrell has to protect himself. I hereby withdraw my original idea. Not a good idea after all.

I was already aware of the chipset issue. I need to get a new case for my main hard drive (WD Elements 1.5 TB USB) and move the drive into the case. That will get the drive off of the USB Bus  which is where my DAC is connected with a M2Tech Hi Face.

Looking forward to the Sandwich and Cable. I guess I'll be contacting Darrell sometime in the future.

Any recommendations on firewire cases?

[hifiguy2008]

Hi Nels,

Many people who are into the Mac Mini audio server plan, including me, are really high on the Oyen Digital drives (http://oyendigital.com/2.5-portable-hard-drives.html). I use a MiniPro with a firewire interface. Oyen's technical support guy is quite knowledgeable and friendly, plus he even knows about us audiophile types and what we are up to. Several of the DAW workstation companies also recommend Oyen drives. Lastly, and as you already know, never underestimate the importance of the USB cable to the DAC... seriously! 

Happy Listening!

[jtwrace]

Here is the deal on the image file from someone that is not involved in Mach2's business.  I am speaking from experience here.  Intellectual property is worth a lot or nothing depending upon who you talk to.  I know that Darrell has hundreds upon hundreds of hours invested in the software that is the core of the Mach2 modifications. Dave

That's why EVERY piece of software that I use during the day is dongle protected.

[dBe]

Hi Nels,

Many people who are into the Mac Mini audio server plan, including me, are really high on the Oyen Digital drives (http://oyendigital.com/2.5-portable-hard-drives.html). I use a MiniPro with a firewire interface. Oyen's technical support guy is quite knowledgeable and friendly, plus he even knows about us audiophile types and what we are up to. Several of the DAW workstation companies also recommend Oyen drives. Lastly, and as you already know, never underestimate the importance of the USB cable to the DAC... seriously! 

Happy Listening!

Seriously!  +1

Dave