[TheChairGuy]

John is mis-quoting prices, again. There are no .39 cent outlets anymore. Inflation has taken care of that. I used to work for Hubbell.

http://www.homedepot.com/Electrical-Outlets-Plugs-Outlets/h_d1/N-5yc1vZ1xglZbp9iZ1z1170v/R-100055784/h_d2/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10053

USD$3.57 for a 10pk (the way contractors and builders buy 'em) is less than $0.36 an outlet. This is the quality of contacts most of us are using in our homes...until you swap them out.

It is distressing to me to have you note 'John is mis-quoting prices, again'...when in fact it is you, AGAIN, portraying yourself as an expert, while misinformed and so very insular on yet another topic.

I know your heart is in the right place...but, you ain't saving anyone from anything serious if any of us blow $10 or even $148 on an electrical outlet.

John

[Speedskater]

The one plating material that I would not get for a power connector is Gold.  Why? because Gold is not vary robust in high current situations. If you ever plug in/out a high power unit while it's turned on,  the Gold plating will be destroyed. 

[Jon L]

But then again there are a few active power conditioners that improve everything-the Running Springs Audio Dimitri is such a conditioner I'm told.

I don't think many use the term "active power conditioner," so what do you mean?  At first glance, it would seem to mean the conditioner's circuits are "active," as in actively regenerating power, e.g. PS Power Plant Premier, Audiophile APS, etc. 

Running Springs Audio uses capacitors and inductors to passively filter the AC, so I would think they should be called "passive" conditioners instead?

[Elizabeth]

I live in an apartment. Every place I have lived for the past thirty years I have immediately replaced the wall outlets (all of  them) with the 'better' $2. or $3 or so outlets. Cheap apts have the WORST wall sockets you could EVER imagine. They had to be like the low bid builders 1,000 quantity for $25. lot from some third world maker BEFORE third world was the place to go..
My current apt I had replaced most of them, and installed various dimmers, extra outlet with lightswitch etc. I had done most of the living area walls, but curiously not the one I went to (instead of running extension cords 100 ft around the room from a singleton 20 amp).
So YES I really truely did put a Pass & Seymour 20 amp into the wall for my stero A/C plugs. $3 with tax. All I needed.
And for the folks who take it personally. When a poster says the XXX is stupid. That is IMO "I" think it is stupid. I do not say "YOU" are XXXX. It is just for me it is XXXX
So stop taking it as a personal insult. the comment IS NOT A PERSONAL INSULT TO ANYONE. it is just IN MY OPINION TO ME FOR ME. OK?

[TheChairGuy]

I don't think many use the term "active power conditioner," so what do you mean?  At first glance, it would seem to mean the conditioner's circuits are "active," as in actively regenerating power, e.g. PS Power Plant Premier, Audiophile APS, etc. 

Running Springs Audio uses capacitors and inductors to passively filter the AC, so I would think they should be called "passive" conditioners instead?

For me, it pretty much means any conditioner with a transformer has added more pain than pleasure...I have a fairly inclusive list that I've owned, too (impossible of course to have owned or heard them all I realize - so I am painting with a brush broader than some may be comfy with, I realize )

I find the Audience AR-series stuff to be beneficial...like Running Springs, it plugs in a wall (hence 'active') but, lacking a transformer based 'solutions'.

An isolation transformer ONLY on the digital front end is the only place I use an 'active' conditioner...mostly as it acts as a one-way guard to halt digital spewage back into the rest of the system.  So, any downsides sonically there may be (IMO) are FAR outweighed by it's benefits.

Elizabeth - I don't know if your post was directed at me - but, I took nothing you said personally.  I just couldn't tell from your post if you had indeed changed outlets over...and you now answered that you do automatically.  Your right, apartments probably have the worst/cheapest outlets of all places and should be an automatic changeout to something with at least a little more grip and robust construction

John

[Phil A]

http://www.homedepot.com/Electrical-Outlets-Plugs-Outlets/h_d1/N-5yc1vZ1xglZbp9iZ1z1170v/R-100055784/h_d2/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10053

USD$3.57 for a 10pk (the way contractors and builders buy 'em) is less than $0.36 an outlet. This is the quality of contacts most of us are using in our homes...until you swap them out.

It is distressing to me to have you note 'John is mis-quoting prices, again'...when in fact it is you, AGAIN, portraying yourself as an expert, while misinformed and so very insular on yet another topic.

I know your heart is in the right place...but, you ain't saving anyone from anything serious if any of us blow $10 or even $148 on an electrical outlet.

John

Perhaps he just doesn't shop at Home Depot.  I noted a few posts before yours about $0.35 receptacles for the same reason.  I wasn't looking to get it down to the penny.  I was just making the point that the standard builder's grade stuff is cheap and crap.

[Quiet Earth]

Sounds like somebody on that website needs a life! 

I also thought it was pretty funny and it certainly makes a valid point. For the first ten minutes . . . . .

When the Value Police tell me how I am always wasting my money on things that can't possibly make a difference,,,, well, that gets really old too.

[Phil A]

I also thought it was pretty funny and it certainly makes a valid point. For the first ten minutes . . . . .

When the Value Police tell me how I am always wasting my money on things that can't possibly make a difference,,,, well, that gets really old too.

Yes those Value Police know how to make a point -  http://www.fotosearch.com/CSP197/k1972123/

[Wayner]

I guess, not in one of my posts did I call some one a name. I try to never do that. If you want to call me a "value police", Then I will call you an AUDIOFOOL. If you want to replace every outlet in your house with a $149 outlet, I could care less.

This all goes back to my earlier post. If you want to believe in mysticism, this $149 product is for you. I just think it's important for someone to not have the mob mentality, being a "bobble head" that agrees with the original poster, that every product that comes along, regardless of price is the cat's meow to everything audio, and in reality, has nothing to do with audio.

Wayner 

[Steve]

I agree I would not spend vast sums of money on a wall socket. However, one must remember that the AC power cord ground wire is in parallel with the IC shields (on almost all components) and thus a portion of the musical signal current flows through the ground wires, just as it does through the IC shields. Moisture and different contact materials can produce rectification effects which could cause distortion of the musical signal. Of course rectification effects influence low signals the most. I would attempt to find materials that are as close as possible to reduce any rectification problems.

Cheers.

[Quiet Earth]

I guess, not in one of my posts did I call some one a name. I try to never do that.

No, but you constantly belittle people who spend more money than you do. I think you and a few other people here have a chip on your shoulder. Get over it.

[rollo]

  While we are at it take a look at the new Furutech GTX series of wall outlets. At least these are engineered to have excellent connection with spring loaded blades as well as other features of material, plating and resonance dampening.. A good read if not interested. Very well executed IMO. Expensive yes worth it cannot tell until I try one.
  They sell from $149 to $211. Try one with a money back guarantee and THEN offer comments. Talk from experience not out of the hat.


charles

[Letitroll98]

As always with these topics, several posters who can only see 100% black or white, i.e. you must either buy the .39 cent outlets or you are agreeing that $149 outlets are the best.  Any comments of moderation, like installing a nice $3-$10 hospital grade outlet, immediately puts you in the camp of audiofools spending vast sums on useless products.  Like the person who shouts loudest in an argument wins or something.

 

[TheChairGuy]

As always with these topics, several posters who can only see 100% black or white, i.e. you must either buy the .39 cent outlets or you are agreeing that $149 outlets are the best.  Any comments of moderation, like installing a nice $3-$10 hospital grade outlet, immediately puts you in the camp of audiofools spending vast sums on useless products.  Like the person who shouts loudest in an argument wins or something.

Amen on that

In my case, I found the jump to $36 and $49 to be barely noticeable, if at all, from the $10 spent on a hospital grade outlet. 

I didn't try just a better built $3 one...perhaps that was sufficient to hear a benefit - dunno' I use the $36 one cause, I think, it was better than the $10 one.  In any case, I own it so I use it instead of the $10 one (the $10 one will go in the video system eventually - I simply don't put the efforts in my video system that I do the audio system)

I have the $49 PS Audio outlet still...but, that made me grit my teeth a bit (nickel plating, maybe?) when listening to it

John

[Wayner]

No, but you constantly belittle people who spend more money than you do. I think you and a few other people here have a chip on your shoulder. Get over it.

Let me assure you that I have zero chips on my shoulder. And because one of my AC pals decides he loves the $149 outlet, doesn't mean that I still don't love or have respect for him. I disagree with John lots of times, but he is still near and dear to me, as are almost all of you.

But I cannot, with clear conscience, recommend to anyone a product that I think is a waste of money. I get lots of PMs everyday from fellow ACers, looking for solid recommendations on things from TTs to cartridges to electronics.

When it comes to topics like this one, there is never any evidence offered on the claim, other then "I've heard it, and it's better". OK, then I start asking myself some questions. So you did a receptacle swap. Did you record the before and after voltage, did you scope the incoming sine-wave? Perhaps not. And maybe indeed, you thought you heard improvement, but was it really just different? I've done many tweaks others have suggested here on AC. When I first did them, I thought there was an improvement, but the next day, the tweak was removed.

Now so far on this thread, some have tried their best to put some meat to the claims. The first was the plating material. Well, how many different materials do you think the current has passed thru before it got to your precious electronics? I'm sure the path had copper wire, aluminum wire, back to copper wire, thru nickle plated brass parts in a circuit breaker, back thru some copper then to the outlet that has some other plating on copper. Then it goes thru the plated prongs on the plug of the component, thru the copper wires of the the powercord, thru a fuse element, then a switch, then a power supply with caps, diode and a transformer. Not to mention the tracings on a circuit board and other hook up wire used. This was the path just to get your stuff power. So for this theory (and it's just a theory) I just can't find a connection (sorry for the pun).

Now if you want to claim a better mechanical connection, I can buy this (kind of), but my house was built using Leviton receptacles, and they all seem to have a nice, snug fit.

My computer never has any errors that I can relate to a poor socket, files download as they should, so I still am missing the point?

On another note, I'm sorry if I offended John on my off the cuff remark. No I didn't do any research on the lowest possible price on outlets, but I've seen outlets in the stores that I frequent, and they are not $0.39. I also think it is not the case that every or almost every contractor uses cheapy outlets when they build a house. Leviton was one of the choices when when I built my house and the dollar adder was peanuts. I suppose that there are contractors that use the cheapest possible materials when they build the house, but then I'd think that every material that they used was of poor quality from 2 X 4s to mill work to flooring and appliances.

I also know lots of newbies read these threads, and they need to see the opposing point of view.

Wayner

[mgalusha]

For those wishing to be more adventurous, the Hubbell HBL5262 industrial grade have no plating at all, just raw brass. They are $13 each from stayonline.com. Until recently they were $12.00 but they went up a buck. The 20A versions are $16. Much more than a cheapie from orange depot but they are "Extra Heavy Duty Industrial Series" and really well made.

Info Here

[werd]

  Just wondering why hospitals use hospital grade outlets and not your lowly home depot types?. Because they do.... even in the waiting rooms.

[Mike B.]

Well I sell a line of AC outlets, so won't get into the fight. Just a couple observations that might help the buyer going to Lowes or Home Depot. Pass and Seymour switched to stainless steel screws a few years back on their industrial grade outlets. Other manufactures might have done a similar thing.  Stainless and nickel plating add a brightness or sheen to the sound IMO. So take a magnet with you while shopping. The better commercial outlets will have a excellent grip so take a connector off the shelf and insert it to check this. Any plated outlet will suffer surface damage if you install or remove the AC plug while the component is on. Any arcing will damage the surface.

[Berto]

Just wondering why hospitals use hospital grade outlets and not your lowly home depot types?. Because they do.... even in the waiting rooms.

Hey Werd this is what I found:

" They are subject to special requirements contained in Medical equipment standards"

  My logic tells me there is some really expensive equipment monitoring the most important thing in the world > our health. So makes sense not to cut corners with cheap contractor grade outlets, etc.

[etcarroll]

Perhaps he just doesn't shop at Home Depot.  I noted a few posts before yours about $0.35 receptacles for the same reason.  I wasn't looking to get it down to the penny.  I was just making the point that the standard builder's grade stuff is cheap and crap.

Having just replaced the outlet my fridge is on, I can state that buying contractor grade, 1 at a time, in PA, at a Lowes, is 0.59 cents per. I live in a home built in last decade, a McMansion, with all the good, and bad, that name implies.

Needless to say, once I settled on the location of my 2 channel rig, I popped out the existing outlet and put in a Leviton hospital grade I got for $10.

And as bad as the outlets were, I've replaced 2 inside door handles, name brand I found replacements for at Lowes, bought the cheapest one on the shelf, (pantry handle), and found it was still better made than the handles I was replacing - they had plastic in them, which was what broke. At least the replacement handles had stamped steel where the broken handle had plastic. Again, both from same manufacturer.