What does the measurements on a common $152 pair of speaker look like?

DanTheMan · « **Reply #20 on:** 8 Jul 2010, 10:20 pm »

As to avoid an internet war with someone I respect and hurt feelings of many others, I cannot tell what the second ones are. These are well received and appreciated by many of their owners/builders. I'd say if your going to do one of the available DIY designs around on the web, make sure you get measurements if accuracy is important to you. I'd say Zaph is pretty safe and his WG TMM looks more than interesting! His polar graph of them out to 60 degrees in 15 degree steps:

I knew something was off on the sound of those measured above, but couldn't peg it until I measured. I was expecting to see something totally different b/c of the design and designer. the directivity wasn't a surprise, just the response and the impulse. Life is full of surprises.

I never knew Behringer made an active sub in that line. Thanks for that. I'd sure like to see how those measure up. Unfortunately I can't do decent measurements for subs. For its response I could, but not excursion/distortion and max output stuff.

Many in the pro audio world talk about these Behringer monitors needing plenty of power and also their ability to take it. My HK 3390 makes them boogie and I don't know that's putting out all that much juice. Then again, I rarely listen louder than 80dB avg. Many in the pro world seem to think at least 130watts to make these happy. My receiver isn't rated that high so I doubt it's capable of it. Or maybe it is. It says 100watts into 4 Ohm +-42amps. I don't know if that's considered a lot of current or not?

Dan

JDUBS · « **Reply #21 on:** 9 Jul 2010, 01:32 am »

The active version is intriguing at approx. $300 for a pair. Would be interesting running it from a single, balanced, volume-controlled source. I can see pairing these up with my EMU 0404 USB and using that setup with my computer. I love my current computer system, built around Diycable KIT61s driven by a B1 buffer into a UCD400 amp, but simplifiying it is an interesting proposition.

Nice find on the speakers!

Jim

DanTheMan · « **Reply #22 on:** 9 Jul 2010, 03:06 am »

Thanks Jim! I too use the EMU 0404 USB and love it. I run it into my receiver. Great minds must think alike.

Dan

JDUBS · « **Reply #23 on:** 10 Jul 2010, 03:24 am »

The active version has a "230-Watt Bi-amp module with enormous power reserve" built in. I also saw mention of being able to do 116db peaks. That's pretty solid for a speaker its size!

I might try to go hear them at Guitar Center, but I'm really thinking about buying a pair.

-Jim

srb · « **Reply #24 on:** 10 Jul 2010, 03:50 am »

Quote from: JDUBS on 10 Jul 2010, 03:24 am

The active version has a "230-Watt Bi-amp module with enormous power reserve" built in. I also saw mention of being able to do 116db peaks. That's pretty solid for a speaker its size!

The "230W Bi-amp" module is actually 80WRMS @ 4ohm and a 25WRMS @ 4ohm for the woofer and tweeter. Still good specs on paper for the money, but I'm not sure how the 230W spec was derived, as the peak power is specified at 320W/100W.

And the 116dB peak rating is for a pair of speakers.

Steve

JDUBS · « **Reply #25 on:** 10 Jul 2010, 03:59 am »

Quote from: srb on 10 Jul 2010, 03:50 am

The "230W Bi-amp" module is actually 80WRMS @ 4ohm and a 25WRMS @ 4ohm for the woofer and tweeter. Still good specs on paper for the money, but I'm not sure how the 230W spec was derived, as the peak power is specified at 320W/100W.

And the 116dB peak rating is for a pair of speakers.

Steve

Yes, the amplifier specs are somewhat bizarre. I still think its pretty decent in the context of a ~$300 per pair monitor.

-Jim

DanTheMan · « **Reply #26 on:** 10 Jul 2010, 06:28 am »

There has been reported reliability issues with Behringers internal amps. Many people say they pick up local radio stations with them.

Dan

DanTheMan · « **Reply #27 on:** 12 Jul 2010, 08:50 pm »

Here's the vertical polars.

first is toward the woofer, on axis, 11.25 degrees off axis, and 22.5 degrees off axis:

Then toward the teeter, on axis, 11.25, 22.5, 33.75, and 45 degrees off axis:

So if the tweeter's mounted on top, the mid point between the drivers should be at or a little below your ear ideally. This feature may actually make them well suited for a center channel.

Dan

DanTheMan · « **Reply #28 on:** 14 Jul 2010, 01:39 am »

A couple links with a lot of speaker measurements just so people can see how well a $152/pair delivered speaker can compete with whatever is out there fairly well:
http://www.soundstagenetwork.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=16&Itemid=18
http://www.stereophile.com/standloudspeakers/

These are no joke. I'm amazed. I'd sure like to see what soundstage and stereophile's protocol would do with these. Too bad I can't do everything these guys do.

Dan

DanTheMan · « **Reply #29 on:** 17 Jul 2010, 11:04 pm »

OK, so I went a little wild today on making graphs. I used my own B2031P speakers and another's that just came in. Both are claimed to be matched pairs. Well, let's just see.
First "matched pair":
A) average response:

B) average response:

A)polar response:

B)polar response:

That's closer than any 2 I've built.

Next "matched pair"
C) avg response:

D) avg response:

C) polar response:

D) polar response:

Maybe not perfect, but you can tell they are making an earnest effort. Pretty impressive really.

Here's what one of these polar responses would look like with 1/3 octave smoothing:

Dan

wushuliu · « **Reply #30 on:** 18 Jul 2010, 01:35 am »

Yeah, but how do they sound?

DanTheMan · « **Reply #31 on:** 18 Jul 2010, 02:06 am »

A picture is worth a thousand words.

Dan

satfrat · « **Reply #32 on:** 18 Jul 2010, 03:09 am »

JDUBS · « **Reply #33 on:** 18 Jul 2010, 03:14 am »

Flat frequency response is pretty awesome to hear. I used my DEQX to produce a flat on my Yorkville Unitys and I love it.

-Jim

DanTheMan · « **Reply #34 on:** 18 Jul 2010, 03:50 am »

Here's more detail about how they sound

:
A

B

C

D

Actually how they sound mostly depends on the recording. They'll put that into your room very well compared to most.

Dan

Wind Chaser · « **Reply #35 on:** 18 Jul 2010, 04:26 am »

Quote from: wushuliu on 18 Jul 2010, 01:35 am

Yeah, but how do they sound?

Good question. Back in the 90's I had a pair of speakers (Mission?) that measured very flat but they were so lifeless, dull and boring. IMO a flat response doesn't guarantee good or even acceptable sound.

srb · « **Reply #36 on:** 18 Jul 2010, 04:57 am »

Quote from: wushuliu on 18 Jul 2010, 01:35 am

Yeah, but how do they sound?

Quote from: Wind Chaser on 18 Jul 2010, 04:26 am

Good question. Back in the 90's I had a pair of speakers (Mission?) that measured very flat but they were so lifeless, dull and boring. IMO a flat response doesn't guarantee good or even acceptable sound.

So tell us Dan, how do they sound? Are they lifeless, dull and boring? Or full of life, captivating and exciting? I'm hoping it edges toward the latter. With an 8-3/4" cast frame woofer, 25 lb. LFE E1 MDF cabinet and only ~$150/pair?

Sounds incredible on paper.

Steve

satfrat · « **Reply #37 on:** 18 Jul 2010, 05:00 am »

DanTheMan · « **Reply #38 on:** 18 Jul 2010, 06:50 am »

Sorry gents. I'm just not the type to wax on about my opinion.

There's info in my signature and in http://www.amazon.com/Sound-Reproduction-Acoustics-Psychoacoustics-Loudspeakers/dp/0240520092
After listening, I bought a pair.

Dan

tubesguy2 · « **Reply #39 on:** 18 Jul 2010, 06:36 pm »

Quote from: DanTheMan on 18 Jul 2010, 06:50 am

Sorry gents. I'm just not the type to wax on about my opinion.

After listening, I bought a pair.

Dan

Well, by referring those who are asking how they sound to a book you are making clear that your opinion is that any speaker that measures this good, by the criteria that you deem important, must sound good, if not close to perfect.

So was it listen-buy-measure-post, or was there something else prior to the listening that predisposed you to think they would sound, well, good?