Review: take SACD and BlURay Hirez directly to your DAC!!!!

Brandon B · « **Reply #280 on:** 16 Mar 2011, 01:33 am »

Has anyone used the monoprice box to capture the 24/88.2 or 176.4 to a computer file yet, or is everyone just streaming it to their DAC?

I have a launch model PS3, and will probably nab one of these if I can rip my SACDs' 2 ch stuff to my computer.

ted_b · « **Reply #281 on:** 16 Mar 2011, 02:40 am »

Quote from: Brandon B on 16 Mar 2011, 01:33 am

Has anyone used the monoprice box to capture the 24/88.2 or 176.4 to a computer file yet, or is everyone just streaming it to their DAC?

I have a launch model PS3, and will probably nab one of these if I can rip my SACDs' 2 ch stuff to my computer.

Mike (mgalusha) has, I believe.

Robin Hood · « **Reply #282 on:** 16 Mar 2011, 03:21 am »

I seem to have lost the video from my Oppo 970HD thru the Monoprice and to my monitor. All I see now is snow but I still have audio. Hopefully the Monoprice HDMI cables will clear up this problem since changing the Oppo settings is not possible without a monitor. I prefer not to drag this setup upstairs just to get a video handshake again. Audio works fine as long as the Monoprice and monitor are connected by HDMI.

Quote

Has anyone used the Monoprice box to capture the 24/88.2 or 176.4 to a computer file yet, or is everyone just streaming it to their DAC?

Yes, I am capturing my SACDs to my Korg MR-2000S recorder. My initial impression is that I prefer capturing the 24/88.2 PCM output at 24/176.4. The higher resolution just seems to provide more air and superior musical tone. Initially I thought I would just capture SACDs at 24/88.2 but the higher resolution sounds better. I'm not sure why the higher resolution sounds better but perhaps it's just upsampling like using a dCS Scarlatti Upsampler.

todd95008 · « **Reply #283 on:** 25 Mar 2011, 07:54 pm »

I have a brand new Oppo BDP-93 and a monoprice box on the way.
I'm curious if anyone has ever confirmed that the latest gen Oppo players really output 24bit data (coax or HDMI) ??
Earlier Oppo players would truncate 24bit data down to 16 bits.
I have already confirmed that the BDP-93 will output 96/192k data (even from copy protected DVD-A's) over coax but I have no way of knowing the bit depth.

Anyone have a DAC that shows bit depth with Oppo and/or the HDMI de-embedder ??

Thanks
Todd

Robin Hood · « **Reply #284 on:** 28 Mar 2011, 05:39 pm »

This is the information posted on the Stereophile website a few years ago:

"DSD is converted to 24-bit/88.2KHz. This is the nominal cycling rate for a DSD to PCM conversion. This signal can't be passed over digital coaxial or optical.

DVD-Audio is truncated to 16-bit/192KHz at 2.0 Stereo when outputting over optical or coaxial. This is a hardware limitation. HDMI will support 24-bit/192Khz multi-channel over HDMI. The multi-channel analog is also performed at the same bit and cycling rate.The hardware is not designed for 24-bit over optical or coaxial. The physical ability to drive the signal is not present in the hardware transmitter. It will be 16-bit maximum."

So assuming you plan to use a HDMI splitter you should still get 24-bit audio from the newer Oppos.

ted_b · « **Reply #285 on:** 28 Mar 2011, 05:48 pm »

Quote from: todd95008 on 25 Mar 2011, 07:54 pm

I have a brand new Oppo BDP-93 and a monoprice box on the way.
I'm curious if anyone has ever confirmed that the latest gen Oppo players really output 24bit data (coax or HDMI) ??
Earlier Oppo players would truncate 24bit data down to 16 bits.
I have already confirmed that the BDP-93 will output 96/192k data (even from copy protected DVD-A's) over coax but I have no way of knowing the bit depth.

Anyone have a DAC that shows bit depth with Oppo and/or the HDMI de-embedder ??

Thanks
Todd

This is not exactly true. Earlier Oppos would ONLY truncate to 16 bit DVD_Audio from optical/coax so as to get around the MLP protection issues. That's history. Furthermore, Oppos never truncated to 16 bits via HDMI 1.1+, which is the vehicle that this thread is about. Yes, the latest Oppo's do 24/192 via HDMI (SACD at 24/88.2k)

mgalusha · « **Reply #286 on:** 28 Mar 2011, 06:08 pm »

Quote from: Brandon B on 16 Mar 2011, 01:33 am

Has anyone used the monoprice box to capture the 24/88.2 or 176.4 to a computer file yet, or is everyone just streaming it to their DAC?

I am doing this. I use the Atlona 577 to break out the spdif from hdmi. My first batch were done using the coax spdif inputs on an ESI Juli@ card and recording that with Audacity. As the box that card was in went away I had to buy a new one, which doesn't not have a PCI slot for the Juli@ card. In place of this I bought a TC Impact Twin IEE 1394 (firewire) box and a PCI-E 1394 card for the computer. I switched to using Reaper for the recording, I like it much better than Audacity and it's very inexpensive for what you get.

With this setup I've found the Toslink connection between the Atlona and the TC better than the coax connection.

As I'm using an Oppo BD83 as the source I'm limited to 88.2Khz but the results are pretty good and am finally getting some use out of my 60 odd SACD's, most of which have not been played in years.

mike

todd95008 · « **Reply #287 on:** 28 Mar 2011, 10:08 pm »

Quote from: ted_b on 28 Mar 2011, 05:48 pm

This is not exactly true. Earlier Oppos would ONLY truncate to 16 bit DVD_Audio from optical/coax so as to get around the MLP protection issues. That's history. Furthermore, Oppos never truncated to 16 bits via HDMI 1.1+, which is the vehicle that this thread is about. Yes, the latest Oppo's do 24/192 via HDMI (SACD at 24/88.2k)

Thanks Ted.
I'll just have to give it a try (soon) since my de-embedder will be waiting for me when I get home and see ho it sounds Vs the Oppo's internal DAC.
BTW: to anyone interested, the BDP-93 will play stereo 24/96/192k FLAC files on a data disc (CD or DVD), USB or SATA hard drive !!
I downlaoded some test files from Linn music and burned to DVD (works perfectly).

Todd

jamesg11 · « **Reply #288 on:** 28 Mar 2011, 10:50 pm »

So, is it true that the current Oppo (& CA) Mediatek chip outputs less than 24bit via its spdif co-ax with dvd-a? My dac is certainly displaying 96 & 192 sample rate, but doesn't show bit depth (how many do?).

jamesg11 · « **Reply #289 on:** 31 Mar 2011, 12:22 am »

Bump! Just checking I read earlier post correctly:

So, is it true that the current Oppo (& CA) Mediatek chip outputs less than 24bit via its spdif co-ax with dvd-a?

My dac is certainly displaying 96 & 192 sample rate, but doesn't show bit depth (how many do?).

ted_b · « **Reply #290 on:** 31 Mar 2011, 01:42 am »

Current Oppos (mediatek chip) do 24 bit via coax. Oppo confirmed it and it is why I posted it a few posts earlier here. However, this thread is about HDMI.

todd95008 · « **Reply #291 on:** 13 Apr 2011, 02:12 am »

O.K. so I borrowed my brothers Cambridge audio 840C CD player/DAC.
It shows not only sample rate but bit depth also.

With the coax output from the Oppo BDP-93, the DAC inputs (2 of them) read 24bit/96k or 24bit/192k when playing a DVD-A (used Steely Dan Gaucho for 96k & Eagles Hotel california for 192k).
When I connect the mono price box via HDMI to the same DAC inputs.
I could only get the 24/96k disc to lock. I suspect that the monoprice box/HDMI has too much jitter or poor signal quality to lock (same was true for any optical connection direct from Oppo or thru Mono box).
I tried all combinations of audio settings on the oppo and it will not work @ 192k sample rate with Monoprice sw box.

Next came the surprise and what I think will be argued a bit but I popped in a stereo SACD (Time out by Dave Brubeck) and I got 20bit/88.2k for input from the Monoprice box...
Again, no comination of setttings on the Oppo would change this.

I would gather that the Oppo does not convert SACD to 24bit/88.2k but only 20 bit/88.2k and for myself see no reason to continiue with the monoprice box !!

Todd

Phil A · « **Reply #292 on:** 13 Apr 2011, 03:08 am »

I am not sure which Monoprice box you are using. I also have not had the time to try the BDP-93 but have already tried the BDP-83 and it does pass 192kHz with the Monoprice box. I also have the Port-ta box (PET4000) who makes the unit for Monoprice. I used the Eagles Hotel California for one of my tests too. It had no trouble locking on 192kHz.

Phil A · « **Reply #293 on:** 13 Apr 2011, 03:15 am »

Below are the links for the Monoprice and Port-ta boxes. The Port-ta has been confirmed all over to pass more than 96kHz as in the link below. Also below is a picture of the Porta and Monoprice boxes together.

http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=101&cp_id=10110&cs_id=1011002&p_id=5557&seq=1&format=2

http://www.port-ta.com/products/203.html

http://www.stereo.net.au/forums/showthread.php/32607-SACD-playback-into-Generic-2ch-DAC/page4

Phil A · « **Reply #294 on:** 13 Apr 2011, 03:28 am »

Quote from: todd95008 on 13 Apr 2011, 02:12 am

O.K. so I borrowed my brothers Cambridge audio 840C CD player/DAC.
It shows not only sample rate but bit depth also.

With the coax output from the Oppo BDP-93, the DAC inputs (2 of them) read 24bit/96k or 24bit/192k when playing a DVD-A (used Steely Dan Gaucho for 96k & Eagles Hotel california for 192k).
When I connect the mono price box via HDMI to the same DAC inputs.
I could only get the 24/96k disc to lock. I suspect that the monoprice box/HDMI has too much jitter or poor signal quality to lock (same was true for any optical connection direct from Oppo or thru Mono box).
I tried all combinations of audio settings on the oppo and it will not work @ 192k sample rate with Monoprice sw box.

Next came the surprise and what I think will be argued a bit but I popped in a stereo SACD (Time out by Dave Brubeck) and I got 20bit/88.2k for input from the Monoprice box...
Again, no comination of setttings on the Oppo would change this.

I would gather that the Oppo does not convert SACD to 24bit/88.2k but only 20 bit/88.2k and for myself see no reason to continiue with the monoprice box !!

Todd

The Cambridge Audio is apparently also known to show incorrect bit depths - http://www.whathifi.com/forum/computer-based-music/24-bit-music-popcorn-hour-and-cambridge-audio-840c

todd95008 · « **Reply #295 on:** 13 Apr 2011, 05:54 am »

Quote from: Phil A on 13 Apr 2011, 03:08 am

I am not sure which Monoprice box you are using. I also have not had the time to try the BDP-93 but have already tried the BDP-83 and it does pass 192kHz with the Monoprice box. I also have the Port-ta box (PET4000) who makes the unit for Monoprice. I used the Eagles Hotel California for one of my tests too. It had no trouble locking on 192kHz.

I have the same monoprice box that you have (clone of the porta box).
It does pass 192khz into another DAC that I have as I reported in an earlier post on this page. I was mainly interested in what bit depth the monoprice box was passing along (and no one on this forum could confirm) ? As I stated it does pass 24bit data (96k sample DVD-A) but the cambridge unit will not lock @ 192k suggesting poor signal quality or very high jitter from the de-embedder??
Why would the Cambridge circuit show 24bit for DVD-A (96k) and 20 bit/88.2k for SACD both from the same output of the monoprice box??
I thought the Oppo players were converting DSD to 24/88 ??

Phil A · « **Reply #296 on:** 13 Apr 2011, 10:43 am »

If you look at the previous link and read the posts it will explain that the bit depth readout is not always accurate on the Cambridge. I have a modded BDP-83 and all I can say is that going through the DAC I prefer the PCM vs. the SACD in most cases with an exception here or there. I have a BDP-93 but it is in the bedroom system. It's on my to do list to try it with the box as I might want to the 2 HDMI outs at some point (I swap cables to play movies in the main system).

ted_b · « **Reply #297 on:** 13 Apr 2011, 12:57 pm »

I know of a few folks who record the stream from the Monoprice, and it is definitely 24 bit. Your Cambridge may be having issues with 192k due to voltage issues and the sensitivity of the DACs clock. Of the many DACs I've eval'd over the past year at least 3 of them had problems with 192k signals from my Atlona, but the majority are very stable and sound great. Of the 3 that didn't pass, 2 of them were fine with coax at 192k, one wasn't...

todd95008 · « **Reply #298 on:** 13 Apr 2011, 07:56 pm »

Quote from: ted_b on 13 Apr 2011, 12:57 pm

I know of a few folks who record the stream from the Monoprice, and it is definitely 24 bit. Your Cambridge may be having issues with 192k due to voltage issues and the sensitivity of the DACs clock. Of the many DACs I've eval'd over the past year at least 3 of them had problems with 192k signals from my Atlona, but the majority are very stable and sound great. Of the 3 that didn't pass, 2 of them were fine with coax at 192k, one wasn't...

Again, I'm not saying the monoprice box does not do 24bit (read my posts and you will see it does) !!
On SACD however I do NOT get the same bit depth with monoprice box (all else the same) ?? I guess the Oppo's DSD to PCM conversion could be missing the status bit needed to tell the Cambridge DAC's what the bit depth is (if in fact it is really 24bit/88.2k)??
As far as 192k goes, since I have no problem with that coming right out of the Oppo's coax, the fact that the HDMI de-embedder won't lock is just a measure of quality for the monoprice box !!

ted_b · « **Reply #299 on:** 13 Apr 2011, 08:11 pm »

Quote from: todd95008 on 13 Apr 2011, 07:56 pm

Again, I'm not saying the monoprice box does not do 24bit (read my posts and you will see it does) !!
On SACD however I do NOT get the same bit depth with monoprice box (all else the same) ?? I guess the Oppo's DSD to PCM conversion could be missing the status bit needed to tell the Cambridge DAC's what the bit depth is (if in fact it is really 24bit/88.2k)??
As far as 192k goes, since I have no problem with that coming right out of the Oppo's coax, the fact that the HDMI de-embedder won't lock is just a measure of quality for the monoprice box !!

Todd, sorry I wasn't clear; I was referring to Oppo SACD captures (the above recording being done from the SACD-HDMi-Monoprice feed).