My New Songtowers

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cacophony777

Re: My New Songtowers
« Reply #20 on: 3 Jun 2010, 10:30 pm »
I continue to be in awe of my new Songtowers.  :thumb: The separation of instruments is quite phenomenal, which leads me to wonder how it is done...

What is most responsible for a speaker's ability to exhibit a clear, almost 3D separation between instruments/voices?

Crossover?
Drivers?
Cabinet design?

jsalk

Re: My New Songtowers
« Reply #21 on: 4 Jun 2010, 02:38 am »
I continue to be in awe of my new Songtowers.  :thumb: The separation of instruments is quite phenomenal, which leads me to wonder how it is done...

What is most responsible for a speaker's ability to exhibit a clear, almost 3D separation between instruments/voices?

Crossover?
Drivers?
Cabinet design?


All three to a certain extent.

First of all, the drivers are high quality...very accurate and detailed.  The midwoofers are smaller, so off-axis response is very good.  This, combined with the narrow baffle, results in a frequency response at 30 degrees off axis that is almost exactly the same as the on axis response.  The result is a very wide and deep sound stage with a lot of separation and detail.

As is the case with any Dennis Murphy-designed crossover, the phase relationship in the crossover region is spot on.  This results in utterly seamless integration of the drivers.  It is as if the sound is emanating from a single full-range driver.

The cabinet is responsible for the bass extension that would not be present in a normal ported design.

In the case of the SongTowers, the total is definitely greater than the sum of the parts.  The drivers are great, but would not perform this well without an extremely well executed crossover design.  The cabinet rounds out the design.  The sum is more than you should realistically expect looking at the individual components.  In a very real sense, it is the "Perfect Storm" in that speaker designs rarely come together this well.

When Dennis Murphy first approached us about this design, we had relatively little interest.  We had worked with these drivers in other designs and I thought I knew exactly what to expect.  But Dennis stuck with it for 8 months and I finally agreed to build a pair and have a listen.  When I fired up that first pair, it took no more than 30 seconds to realize I was listening to a very rare speaker indeed and one that deserved an audience.  Once I heard it, I knew we had absolutely no choice but to bring it to market.  I can only thank Dennis for being persistent.

- Jim

cacophony777

Re: My New Songtowers
« Reply #22 on: 4 Jun 2010, 03:49 am »
Thanks for the explanation Jim!

sarge_in

Re: My New Songtowers
« Reply #23 on: 4 Jun 2010, 07:26 am »
For me personally the extra cost is definitely worth it. I really loved the RS6 overall, but was always a bit envious of my friend's B&W 805's because they seemed to present more detail and a larger soundstage. I would easily hear things on his 805's that I would struggle to hear on my RS6. I also felt the RS6 was a bit bloated in the bass area. It was hard to follow the bass line on many tracks because it just blended in with the rest of the instruments.

For me the Songtowers have solved those two drawbacks. They are much more detailed (without being fatiguing), and they also have more definition across the entire frequency range. The soundstage feels larger to me as well with a clearer separation between the instruments.

Also, aesthetically the Songtowers are spectacular. The fact that they are handcrafted with pride really shows. The RS6s were really nice, but you could tell they were built in a large factory in China.

Hope this helps.

Thanks for your response - this is very helpful!  So, who wins the battle of the ST vs 805's?! :) 
Btw, I have already ordered the ST's (quite recently), and already can't wait to lay my hands on them!
Enjoy your bliss!

cacophony777

Re: My New Songtowers
« Reply #24 on: 4 Jun 2010, 03:35 pm »
So, who wins the battle of the ST vs 805's?! :) 

Tough call without a side by side comparison. My Songtowers are in a relatively small room with lots of windows and are hooked up to pretty inexpensive electronics (~$800). My friend's B&W's are in a large room with few windows and hooked up to $5k in electronics (he also recently upgraded to the 805 Diamonds, which are a $5k speaker). The fact that I'm not sure which setup sounds better speaks volumes about how good the Songtowers must be (or perhaps it's just wishful thinking  :wink:)

sarge_in

Re: My New Songtowers
« Reply #25 on: 4 Jun 2010, 04:31 pm »
That sure is big points for the ST's!  I did listen to the 805 Diamonds at a dealer with Rotel amps and such - they were AWESOME! The closer the STs get to that the happier I will be :)

cacophony777

Re: My New Songtowers
« Reply #26 on: 7 Jun 2010, 11:25 pm »
Is there a simple and cheap (< $200) way to improve the acoustics of the room in a noticeable way? Maybe putting something behind the speakers that doesn't go up high enough to block the windows?

As you can see in this picture there are windows more or less behind the Songtowers. There are also windows on both sidewalls that you can't see in the picture. The wall opposite the speakers has no windows. There is also a large carpet in front of the speakers.


coke

Re: My New Songtowers
« Reply #27 on: 8 Jun 2010, 12:38 am »
Curtains on all the windows would be a simple solution.  Even leaving them open would still help.

Nuance

Re: My New Songtowers
« Reply #28 on: 8 Jun 2010, 02:57 am »
Thanks for your response - this is very helpful!  So, who wins the battle of the ST vs 805's?! :) 
The first time I met TJHUB (Terry), he brought his 805's over to my house and we directly compared them to my SongTower RT's.  In short, the SongTower's destroyed them, and I think Terry will agree.  After all, he sold them very soon after and ordered a pair of HT2-TL's (his room is larger and he needed the extra bass extension). 

YMMV, of course.

cacophony777, 

Curtains will help a ton.  Another option is stand mounted room treatments (I think Gik and Realtraps sell them).  That way you can easily move them out of the way when they aren't needed; no wall mounting necessary.

sarge_in

Re: My New Songtowers
« Reply #29 on: 8 Jun 2010, 08:28 pm »
The first time I met TJHUB (Terry), he brought his 805's over to my house and we directly compared them to my SongTower RT's.  In short, the SongTower's destroyed them, and I think Terry will agree.  After all, he sold them very soon after and ordered a pair of HT2-TL's (his room is larger and he needed the extra bass extension). 

Sweet! That's very encouraging indeed!

albireo13

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 104
Re: My New Songtowers
« Reply #30 on: 10 Jun 2010, 11:11 am »
those look awesome!!
What stain was used with the curly cherry??

Rob

cacophony777

Re: My New Songtowers
« Reply #31 on: 10 Jun 2010, 04:07 pm »
those look awesome!!
What stain was used with the curly cherry??

Rob

Thanks. There's no stain, though the original order requested a darker cherry sample.

albireo13

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 104
Re: My New Songtowers
« Reply #32 on: 11 Jun 2010, 12:48 pm »
Impressive looking.
Good form!

billmcc

  • Full Member
  • Posts: 367
Re: My New Songtowers
« Reply #33 on: 11 Jun 2010, 08:48 pm »
cacophony777,

Do your ST's have the satin finish or the high gloss finish? I am still trying to decide between the medium or dark stain in curly cherry. Now I see there is an option for satin or high gloss. Oh boy these will be some tough choices :?.

Bill

cacophony777

Re: My New Songtowers
« Reply #34 on: 11 Jun 2010, 08:56 pm »
Do your ST's have the satin finish or the high gloss finish? I am still trying to decide between the medium or dark stain in curly cherry. Now I see there is an option for satin or high gloss. Oh boy these will be some tough choices :?.

They just have the regular satin finish. Lots of fun choices  :D

mark funk

Re: My New Songtowers
« Reply #35 on: 11 Jun 2010, 09:06 pm »
May 31st (my birthday)  I ordered a pair of HT2-TL in cherry. I hope they look as good as your STs.  :thumb:


                                                                               :smoke:

cacophony777

Re: My New Songtowers
« Reply #36 on: 11 Jun 2010, 10:05 pm »
May 31st (my birthday)  I ordered a pair of HT2-TL in cherry. I hope they look as good as your STs.  :thumb:

I'm sure they'll be stunning, congrats!  :D

billmcc

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  • Posts: 367
Re: My New Songtowers
« Reply #37 on: 11 Jun 2010, 10:28 pm »
They just have the regular satin finish. Lots of fun choices  :D

Thanks :). That makes my decision much easier as I will go with the satin finish. From your pictures (which are excellent) the finish looks like it has just the right amount of gloss. It was your pictures that gave me the push I needed to order the STs :D.

Bill

cacophony777

Re: My New Songtowers
« Reply #38 on: 11 Jun 2010, 10:42 pm »
Thanks :). That makes my decision much easier as I will go with the satin finish. From your pictures (which are excellent) the finish looks like it has just the right amount of gloss. It was your pictures that gave me the push I needed to order the STs :D.

Nice, glad to hear I helped facilitate a sale  :thumb:

floresjc

Re: My New Songtowers
« Reply #39 on: 11 Jun 2010, 11:21 pm »
Satin really is a nice finish.  Its not matte. The high gloss is really high gloss, like its encased in glass. Some people like the look, others don't. I find the satin is a great look, and a heck of a lot easier on the ole pocketbook.