New All-Poly crossover option

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Daedalus Audio

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Re: New All-Poly crossover option
« Reply #20 on: 9 May 2010, 06:04 pm »
David,
 I agree with Rob, the Atmasphere M-60s are a great match with my speakers, if I were to use all tube amps they would be my choice. what really impressed me about them was the control, dynamics and exceptional clarity.  it looks like we'll be doing a bi-amp setup at this years RMAF combining the Modwright 150's with Atmasphere.
thanks,
lou

Daedalus Audio

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Re: New All-Poly crossover option
« Reply #21 on: 9 May 2010, 08:16 pm »
David, I started a new thread with this question, so we can get some dialogue about stands etc...
thanks,
lou


zybar

Re: New All-Poly crossover option
« Reply #22 on: 9 May 2010, 08:20 pm »
David,
 I agree with Rob, the Atmasphere M-60s are a great match with my speakers, if I were to use all tube amps they would be my choice. what really impressed me about them was the control, dynamics and exceptional clarity.  it looks like we'll be doing a bi-amp setup at this years RMAF combining the Modwright 150's with Atmasphere.
thanks,
lou

I will be very interested to hear that combination Lou.

George

Randy

Re: New All-Poly crossover option
« Reply #23 on: 9 May 2010, 09:54 pm »
Randy,  steel stands would work but I would use them with the maple bases under the speakers. the maple bases couple with the cabinet and act as a resonance 'sink', the stands wood, metal, whatever... need to isolate the speakers from the floor and provide a stable foundation.

thanks,
lou

Lou, thanks for the info. I came within an eyelash of buying a pair of DA-RMas in Denver a few years ago. They were in maple. You were going to give me a good deal, but in the end I declined. I had an extensive listen to both that model and the Ulysses which were just new at the time and was pretty much blown away, with those sparkling tweeters, in particular. Four years later, I think its been, I am still looking and still very interested in Daedalus. (I move at a slow pace.)

Randy

Daedalus Audio

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Re: New All-Poly crossover option
« Reply #24 on: 11 May 2010, 05:17 pm »
Lou, thanks for the info. I came within an eyelash of buying a pair of DA-RMas in Denver a few years ago. They were in maple. You were going to give me a good deal, but in the end I declined. I had an extensive listen to both that model and the Ulysses which were just new at the time and was pretty much blown away, with those sparkling tweeters, in particular. Four years later, I think its been, I am still looking and still very interested in Daedalus. (I move at a slow pace.)

Randy
Randy,  glad you're still looking at these! as you can see there have been some changes since you heard them. I'll have a pair of ebonized walnut DA-RMa with the AP option in Dan Wrights room at the RMAF and will have the Ulysses with the new bass modules in my large room there (1030).
if anyone knows of a really good tube amp manufacturer looking for a speaker to mate with I'd like to get a pair in another room as well?  particularly if it were with an SET amp.

thanks,
lou



Randy

Re: New All-Poly crossover option
« Reply #25 on: 11 May 2010, 11:55 pm »
Randy,  glad you're still looking at these! as you can see there have been some changes since you heard them. I'll have a pair of ebonized walnut DA-RMa with the AP option in Dan Wrights room at the RMAF and will have the Ulysses with the new bass modules in my large room there (1030).
if anyone knows of a really good tube amp manufacturer looking for a speaker to mate with I'd like to get a pair in another room as well?  particularly if it were with an SET amp.

thanks,
lou

Thanks, Lou. I plan to be there. One of your rooms will be my first stop.
Regards,
Randy

jriggy

Re: New All-Poly crossover option
« Reply #26 on: 14 May 2010, 07:55 pm »
   you're right about getting anything done. I thought they would be good, but the sound is stunning. As for the amp, well there are watts and the Solista has WATTS. My room is 20 by 20 foot, but the sound is roomfilling. As a matter of fact, an LSA Statement is available second here and I am going to listen to it tomorrow, just to see what 150 watts will do.

Hey david12,

Are you just loving your new speakers?

Was curious of your placement in a 20 x 20 room... How far apart are they and how far do you sit from them? Hard to tell from your photos, but they look about 2 feet or so from the front wall?

Jason

 

david12

Re: New All-Poly crossover option
« Reply #27 on: 14 May 2010, 09:08 pm »
   Jason
   you are right, they are about 2 feet from the front wall. I am pretty limited about placement. The room may be 20 by 20, but it is pretty crowded. They are about 7 feet apart and need to be further into the room. That has to be in very small increments, so my wife does'nt notice. Pathetic is'nt it and she'll notice anyway.

   Have you ever noticed, that wives and partners always notice, it must be a female skill we lack.

    David

jriggy

Re: New All-Poly crossover option
« Reply #28 on: 15 May 2010, 03:27 pm »
Yes David, they do always notice... And they are the great finder of lost things too... Fortunately mine seems to enjoy the benefits of this hobby. All I had to do, to get a 58" high pair of towers in the house was to stand next them smiling when she came home. So at least she could see they were a tad shorter than me!

As far distance from the front wall... You could use a set of gliders from Herbie's Audio Lab and scoot them out for  critical listening every once in a while...

How far do you sit from them now? (I am considering these and have a 14x20 room)

david12

Re: New All-Poly crossover option
« Reply #29 on: 16 May 2010, 06:06 pm »
 I sit about 8ft from the speakers and that seems fine. If you look at the Positive Feedback on line review of the Ulysses, the reviewer says that they were the first large speakers he had used that worked well in the small room he uses for his 2nd system. So i think too, that the speakers work well in small rooms.

  Thats a good idea of yours to use Herbiies gliders. I have used some of his accesories before, they really are good value.

    David

Berto

Re: New All-Poly crossover option
« Reply #30 on: 18 May 2010, 04:12 am »
Just got my pair of A/P Ulysses.  :drool:

To sum it up, just really enjoying them, think there beautiful. On a mere but powerful 50 watt class a tube amp and a BENT passive set at 16 out of 61 steps , my 21x16 room starts to fill with a very engaging full body sound.  Hours are goin by quick (7 to be exact). Gonna be hard to go to go to bed early.

Try to follow up with a pic of the setup but my camera is garbage so no closeup would be worth it.  In process of major amp upgrade to ma-1s, thinking that will seriously raise the bar along with my electric bill this summer :duh:

david12

Re: New All-Poly crossover option
« Reply #31 on: 18 May 2010, 11:01 am »
 berto
   perhaps yours are the first upgraded Ulysses. Just for interest, had you had or heard for a prolonged period, the Ulysses with normal crossover. I was'nt able to compare on my Da-Ra mas. I wonder if you were able to give an opinion on the difference.

   I suspect Lou is the only one who has really been able to do an A/B comparison. Perhaps at RMAF, he may bring both to compare. Having said that, it would be too much to bring both all the way from Washington state.
   David

Berto

Re: New All-Poly crossover option
« Reply #32 on: 18 May 2010, 02:42 pm »
Hi David,
             You are goin to have to take Lou's comments and word in regards to the differences.
             I heard the non poly DA-RMs about a month ago in a totally different room with a different system.  I recall loving them and they surely had same house sound as my Ulysses.
             IMO I would have to have a non-poly pair of Ulysses in my room to swap for a true A/B, and then tell David (Author of DA-MA Stereo times review) that I have some hot models at my pad , so he can come over and put it into the proper words. :thumb:       

Daedalus Audio

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Re: New All-Poly crossover option
« Reply #33 on: 18 May 2010, 07:51 pm »
berto
   perhaps yours are the first upgraded Ulysses. Just for interest, had you had or heard for a prolonged period, the Ulysses with normal crossover. I was'nt able to compare on my Da-Ra mas. I wonder if you were able to give an opinion on the difference.

   I suspect Lou is the only one who has really been able to do an A/B comparison. Perhaps at RMAF, he may bring both to compare. Having said that, it would be too much to bring both all the way from Washington state.
   David
I'll only have the AP @ RMAF but in the next month two customers who have had both DA-1's and DA-1.1's will have their DA-1.1's outfitted with the AP crossovers. since they are very familiar with the standard I'm sure what they write about these will be of interest to all. 
one nearby customer stopped in a couple of weeks ago and heard the Ulysses with the AP, he agreed with my description and was amazed at the sound. unfortunately he doesn't tend to post in the forums.

btw, in a couple of months I'll do the swap in Dan Wrights pair of Ulysses and I'm sure he'll have comments to share...
thanks,
lou


dodgealum

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Re: New All-Poly crossover option
« Reply #34 on: 22 May 2010, 01:54 pm »
Just popped on to follow recent developments as I am getting ready to box up my DA-1.1's to send them out west.  I'm looking forward to the A-P upgrade and am grateful to you Lou for continuing to press the envelope with your designs.  Once I get them back and broken in I'll be happy to share my impressions--though with the caveat that I'll be in a new room and with several system changes that will undoubtedly also contribute to the changes I hear.  Really excited to see what the upgrades will bring!  :eyebrows:

vinyl_lady

Re: New All-Poly crossover option
« Reply #35 on: 27 Jun 2010, 04:22 am »
Last Monday I drove over to Bellingham/Ferndale and dropped my DA-1.1s off to have the crossovers replaced with the all poly corssovers and the binding posts replaced with the Cardas posts.

A little background --I bought my first pair of Daedalus speakers (DA-1) after hearing them at RMAF in 2005 & 06 (I bought the 2006 show speakers). After hearing the DA-1.1s at RMAF in 2007, I ordered a pair and sold the DA-1s to a friend. In the spring of 2009, I had Lou upgrade the internal wiring in the DA-1-1s. Each step up or upgrade has been more than worth the money and has brought increased pleasure from my system. More clarity & detail, greater bass extension & slam and better imaging. So when Lou told me about the AP crossover and what they would do for my DA-1.1s, all I needed to do was find time to drive across the state and have Lou change out the crossovers and posts.

After unloading the speakers at Lou's shop, Lou took me upstairs to listen to Mark D.'s 1.1s which Lou had just finished the crossover upgrade. They had less than 15 hours on them and I was blown away by the clarity, detail, imaging and bass extension & slam. The imaging was especially amazing since the room was filled with 3 pairs of speakers (Ulysses & DA-1.1s) sitting in the middle of the space between Mark's speakers we were listening to and where we were sitting. The sense of space or air around each instrument was not subtle. BTW, Mark's are quartersawn oak and they are absolutely gorgeous. :drool:

Since returning home I have about 90 hours on the new crossovers. The first couple of hours I could tell that the highs were a little harsh and bright. Then I went to bed with a CD playing all night with the volume very low, but not off. Wednesday morning after about 10 hours I could tell that the upper end was starting to smooth out. Definition was good and bass was tight with good extension. The next night I cranked it up and was impressed with the bass slam and the speakers ability to reproduce the lowest note on the Hammond B3 (the Introduction track to The Decemberists The Hazards of Love). The speakers had about 20 hours and I was hearing good separation between the instruments and the imaging is better than I expected after 20 hours. Female vocals are very clean. I played Lindsay Buckingham’s Out of the Cradle and was impressed with the clarity of the guitar and the sense of space around each note. The bass slam was impressive when the percussion kicked in. Also, the bass lines on She & Him’s Vol II was detailed and precise; and Zooey's vocals very clean and natural--When I closed my eyes it was easy to imagine her and M. Ward in my room playing & singing just for me. :D

Today after a round of golf I had a chance to do some serious listening, which for me means vinyl. I listened to a lot of familiar music--Neko Case Middle Cyclone, U2 The Joshua Tree, The Moody Blues Days of Future Passed and Chicago Transit Authority (Rhino remastered reissue on 180g vinyl). I hear very precise imaging, better than I remember before the upgrade. Bass is more extended, tight and controlled. More clarity and detail and the instruments have a greater sense of space surrounding them. This was particularly noticeable on CTA. It was very easy to pick out each horn, Peter Cetera's bass, the percussion and Terry Kath's guitar work. The instruments sound very natural, cymbals are crisp and the vocals are, as Lou describes, full-bodied. Great dynamics too and I can't remember hearing better bass.

Listening to music through the DA-1.1s has always been emotionally engaging and non-fatiguing, and still is--very much so. I believe the AP crossover upgrade has taken the sound of these speakers to a whole new level, a level I would expect to pay a lot more money for compared to what I have invested in the DA-1.1s. As I mentioned above, I have about 90 hours on the AP crossovers and Lou tells me it will get better as the Modwright capacitors fully break in (Dan says about 400 hours). All I can say is WOW! I highly recommend the AP crossover upgrade for anyone with DA-1.1s or Ulyesses. The improvement in clarity, detail, bass extension and slam, imaging, and the sense of space around each instrument is not subtle. :thumb: :thumb:
« Last Edit: 2 Jul 2010, 04:37 am by vinyl_lady »

vinyl_lady

Re: New All-Poly crossover option
« Reply #36 on: 28 Jun 2010, 04:24 am »
This will update yesterday's post re my impressions of the AP crossover.

I had a friend over for dinner tonight and we listened to lot of music including Natalie Merchant-Leave Your Sleep, Monsters of Folk; She & Him Vol 2; The New Pornographers-Together; Mark Knopfler & Emmylou Harris-All the Roadrunning; M. Ward-Post War and U2 360 at the Rose Bowl DVD. My friend, who is very familiar with my system, commented that the instruments were more defined than she remembered and it was easy to hear each instrument. Imaging was supurb and with this variety of music I really noticed improved dynamics, faster transients and tight bass plus everything I posted yesterday.

The AP crossovers really do take thses speakers to a whole new level of performance.

Laura

figcon

Re: New All-Poly crossover option
« Reply #37 on: 2 Jul 2010, 03:27 am »
Just a quick word for now, but I wanted to follow up on Laura's comments regarding the AP crossover. I have now taken possession of my second pair of Ulysses speakers, although they are only about 30 hours old here.

I will write again about these incredible speakers, once I have more hours on them, but suffice it to say that my favorite speakers of all time are better and not by a little.

I received my new pair of Maple Ulysses with the AP option yesterday. If you are into natural woods, the look of this particular pair of speakers is stunning with Lou's unique and superlative craftsmanship.

After about 30 hours of breaking in, these loudspeakers, which were the best loudspeaker I had heard before the AP option, have, as Laura said, taken Lou's speakers to a whole new level of performance.

Out of the box, I didn't find them bright, but a little lean and dynamically constrained. They are no longer like that now and this is after only about 30 hours of play.

Compared to the "standard" Ulysses, the AP option allows greater sensitivity, which is now at about 98db, tighter and better defined bass which will have your room growling and your pants or skirts flapping if you listen to the right music loudly enough. They also have a clear and present midrange like I haven't heard since I owned a pair of of Beauhorn's many years ago driven by a Supratek 45/300B amp.  Of course, they aren't colored like the horns, but they do have the same clarity, dynamic range and room filling air and  presence.

By the way, I use and sell Herron Audio gear, including the VTSP-3A, VTPH-2 and Keith's M1's. TT is a Well tempered Amadeus GTA and Dynavector Te Kaitora Rua, courtesy of Mike Pranka. Digital source is a PS Audio Perfect Wave Transport and DAC. The M1's, with 150 watts a side, sound like 500 watts a side with these speakers. I wish I could be a dealer for Daedalus speakers, but Lou has chosen the correct route for his line, at least for now, and they offer incredible value for what he charges.

The imaging is also more precise, drawing comparisons with the best mini monitors I have ever heard, but with incredible size and scale. Everything I listened to this evening was precise, but with great depth and a wide lateral spread.   

Tonality, which is one of the Daedalus calling cards, is still a little on the lean side, but decidedly not lean. Given the great change after just 30 hours and knowing Lou's track record as a speaker builder and guitar player, I am not worried about this. I understand from Lou that the speakers will continue to improve with a lot more hours on them, but if they didn't and stayed right where they are, I would be content with them.

One other thing I want to mention is the incredible beauty of Lou's cabinetry. This is my third pair of Daedalus speakers and I have indeed been taken off of the speaker merry go round, which presents a challenge for someone like myself who sells audio gear. I will try to post pictures soon, but they are so beautiful and each pair is handmade and unique. There are no two Daedalus speakers alike and to me, this and the beautiful, life like sound they produce, makes them a high end audio classic.

More to come later.

david12

Re: New All-Poly crossover option
« Reply #38 on: 2 Jul 2010, 07:56 am »
  You raise a point of interest to me, figcon. That is, the improved sensitivity with the new All poly crossover. I wonder if Lou has accurately measured that, for the various speakers yet. I know it is only of academic interest, your amp is powerful enough to drive the speakers as you wish, or it is'nt. I would still be interested in the figures though, Lou.

figcon

Re: New All-Poly crossover option - Update
« Reply #39 on: 19 Jul 2010, 01:07 am »
I have about 300 hours on my new pair of indescribably beautiful Maple Ulysses with the AP crossovers. I marvel at both the sound quality and the look of these loudspeakers.

For those that don't know, I have owned Lou's speakers for several years now beginning with the original DA1's and then a pair of Ulysses in Cherry and now these.

I wrote after about 30 hours on these and now have closer to 300 hours. Surprisingly, there has been no major changes after the initial break in period, but subtle ones, especially with respect to the high frequencies. Instead of trying to describe the changes taking place as the speakers break in, I will just post a few comments about the sound, in general.

The speakers remind me of the transparency of a $100k+ speaker I hear at RMAF last year that have been advertised in major publications as the best speakers on earth. This was on a cut entitled "Morrison" written by David Crosby as a tribute to Jim Morrison, off of the CPR's self titled debut album, which is a great piece of music. There seems to be nothing going on that you can't hear on this cut as it is a pretty well recorded piece of pop. I remember being very impressed with the transparency of the system being used that day, but somehow was left a bit cold by the musical experience. Listening to the same cut in my home system, granted using totally different electronics, the same transparency was there, but with greater dynamics of the micro and macro variety and a more natural tone that makes you feel like you are listening listening to a live musical event. In terms of tonality and dynamics, the Ulysses are so much more realistic to me ears than these very good and very expensive speakers. In terms of soundstaging and imaging Ulysses was  at least as good and in saying this, I am perhaps being generous to these best on earth speakers. As a friend said last week, after a few hours listening to Ulysses, the listening experience with these speakers, was goose bump time. He got goose bumps listening to this very cut.

Listening to the Living Stereo reissue of Borodin's Symphony #2 on my Well Tempered Amadeus GTA/Dynavector Te Kaitora Rua/Herron VTH-2 analog system, the transparency, dynamics and especially the imaging on this LP, is music to die for. Absolutely hair raising.

I can't say enough about how good these speakers sound, let alone look. It is a shame that none of the major publications have picked up on these speakers. The combination of looks, which I know is subjective, but in this case unique, the sound quality and the high sensitivity of these speakers is unparalleled in my experience. They can be driven with SET's and can take just about whatever you can throw at them, power wise. They sound great at low levels and even better at high levels.

My speaker search is over.