Any Ideas For Anarchy?

poseidonsvoice · « **Reply #120 on:** 14 Mar 2010, 08:29 pm »

Sounds like from a power standpoint, the Class D Audio kits are right up this minimonitors alley. 250w into 8 ohms should take care of it just fine.

No SET triodes at 8 watts for this one! Unless you plan on listening in a cubicle!

Thanks for guiding us through the motions of some of the challenges in crossover design.

Best,
Anand.

avionic · « **Reply #121 on:** 14 Mar 2010, 09:14 pm »

Great work Danny! Thanks again for doing this

Danny Richie · « **Reply #122 on:** 17 Mar 2010, 03:00 am »

Okay, I finally crunched the numbers on this stuff.

Keep in mind that the network needed to make these drivers work well together required 4 inductors, 4 resistors and 7 capacitors.

These totals are just what the parts cost and no more. I added ZERO for my design time and labor. I figured in the tweeters for $25 each (a real bargain for what they are).

I will offer you guys a kit on two levels.

The budget version comes with the tweeters, PSP 2" flared ports, Vampire binding posts, high quality wire, solder, screws, heat shrink, Erse perfect lay XQ inductors, Erse Pulse X poly caps, Gen.2 Sonicap by-pass caps for the tweeter circuit, and Lynk resistors. All of this comes to $275 for the pair.

The top level version will be exactly the same but will include Mills resistors (instead of the Lynk) and all Sonicaps (instead of the Erse). The total for this kit is $486 for the pair.

Also highly recommended is a sheet of No Rez. You need one sheet and it's $38 a sheet.

Everything is in stock.

elves1111 · « **Reply #123 on:** 22 Mar 2010, 09:57 pm »

Would it be possible to get this woofer into the N2X kit? i'm only asking because i would like to have this woofer, but have wanted to get a monitor with a ribbon type tweeter. am getting ready to order the N2X, but would much rather have this woofer instead!

Danny Richie · « **Reply #124 on:** 22 Mar 2010, 10:05 pm »

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Would it be possible to get this woofer into the N2X kit? i'm only asking because i would like to have this woofer, but have wanted to get a monitor with a ribbon type tweeter.

That would take some work to get to match well with the Neo. Which BTW is not a ribbon, but a planar magnetic driver.

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am getting ready to order the N2X, but would much rather have this woofer instead!

I can't imaging any reason anyone would want to do that.

critofur · « **Reply #125 on:** 23 Mar 2010, 12:39 am »

Quote from: Danny on 29 Jan 2010, 08:10 pm

I got a great deal on the tweeters so I will pass those on at $20 each.

Is there a web page for those? Model/name/spec sheet?

Danny Richie · « **Reply #126 on:** 23 Mar 2010, 12:51 am »

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Is there a web page for those? Model/name/spec sheet?

See some info on page 1.

These were used in some speakers that won several awards including Editors Choice award in The Absolute Sound.

They are on pair with the best Scan Speak or Seas Excel tweeters.

elves1111 · « **Reply #127 on:** 23 Mar 2010, 07:27 pm »

doesn't the anarchy woofer put put more bass? does the anarchy handle mids better than the M165X?

cujobob · « **Reply #128 on:** 23 Mar 2010, 07:34 pm »

The Anarchy woofer will put out nice bass, but likely will not have as smooth a sound as the M165X in the upper part of it's range

Danny Richie · « **Reply #129 on:** 23 Mar 2010, 09:57 pm »

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doesn't the anarchy woofer put put more bass?

By the numbers: In this box (ported) the Anarchy woofer will hit a -3db of 38.9Hz. Optimal ported box for the M-165X woofers will give you a -3db of 38.6Hz.

However, the M-165X needs a much larger box. Think small floor standing model.

The penalty to the Anarchy woofer pulling that off in a very small ported enclosure is really low sensitivity. It has 3db less sensitivity than the M-165X woofer.

The Anarchy and the M165X both have an XBL^ motor structure, but the Anarchy has more X-max. However, before getting near the X-max on the Anarchy, you are going to start getting some serious port noise. The X-Max on the M-165X is limited really by the surround. But on both woofers you get a very linear BL curve over a really wide range.

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does the anarchy handle mids better than the M165X?

Handle mids better? I'd say "handle" is a bit vague. I can answer this mid-range question only with a subjective response. I played the Anarchy woofer for about a day and gave it a good listen, but it still may not have been near any fully settle level. I controlled the nasty's with the crossover so it has no glaring problems of any kind. But to me and my ears, it does not have the same natural, smooth, lush, and transparent sound to it in the mid-range area. This is pretty much a cone material issue. I have yet to find any material that I preferred to a paper cone.

So for mid-range, hands down, I'd go for the M-165X.

Now using four of them for sub 200Hz range in a three-way, especially for home theater, and keeping the box size reasonable, I'd go for the Anarchy.

poseidonsvoice · « **Reply #130 on:** 23 Mar 2010, 11:29 pm »

Quote from: Danny on 23 Mar 2010, 09:57 pm

Now using four of them for sub 200Hz range in a three-way, especially for home theater, and keeping the box size reasonable, I'd go for the Anarchy.

Reminds me of the RAW acoustics loudspeaker series. Many of them had side mounted 6-7 inch woofers that were great for that application. RA-8, HT3, HT8, etc...I've often wondered if they would have an application as the lower woofer(s) in the OB5/7, O-3, OB-7+ etc...

The Anarchy would also be nice for small subwoofers, with emphasis on the word small. Add EQ, a large Class D amp and you are in business. There are competitors though, like the CSS SDX7, however, the Vas is considerably larger and so will be the enclosure size. The Anarchy is very inexpensive too.

Anand.

cujobob · « **Reply #131 on:** 24 Mar 2010, 12:39 am »

Wow, wasn't expecting the price to rise that much.

fcraven · « **Reply #132 on:** 24 Mar 2010, 03:47 pm »

Quote from: Danny on 23 Mar 2010, 09:57 pm

However, the M-165X needs a much larger box. Think small floor standing model.

And wow do they sound good in that configuration. Still loving mine.

woofersus · « **Reply #133 on:** 24 Mar 2010, 07:02 pm »

Quote from: poseidonsvoice on 23 Mar 2010, 11:29 pm

The Anarchy would also be nice for small subwoofers, with emphasis on the word small. Add EQ, a large Class D amp and you are in business.

That's an interesting thought. I wonder how small a sealed cube you could stick 4 of them into, and what kind of extension it would have. I'm always looking for the holy grail of small musical subs for 2.1 and the like.

Danny even mentioned it being used in a car. I've got a pair of 12's in a sealed box in my trunk, and they sound decent, but I'd loooooove to get some trunk space back without giving up performance.

Fatawan · « **Reply #134 on:** 24 Mar 2010, 07:26 pm »

I have two sub designs I am going to build with the Anarchy. One will be using three 8" passive radiators in a 6th order bandpass. The other is a tapped horn that littlemike over at AVS has designed.

By the way Danny, got my kit yesterday! I'll tear into it soon, so be ready for questions.

Danny Richie · « **Reply #135 on:** 26 Apr 2010, 09:55 pm »

Okay I had an e-mail earlier that lead me to believe that there is some confusion out there regarding this kit.

The optimal air space for this woofer (ported) is .35 cubic feet and it requires a 3" diameter port that is 30" long to tune it properly and avoid port noise (chuffing).

I fudged it slightly to work in this box from Parts Express: http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=302-721

It is actually listed at .477 and minus the air space of the woofer and port tube then you are pretty close, and give or take around .44 to .42 cubic feet.

Their .75 cubic foot box is way to large and adds additional surface area around the drivers causing additional surface reflections that will adversely effect imaging. Do NOT use the larger box with this kit or with this woofer.

Using a 3" diameter port 30" long is not real practical and you are just barely getting by with the 2" flared port from Precision Sound Products that is supplied in the kit. It is just fine until you really start cranking it then you do get a little chuffing noise from it. At least it is in the back of the speaker so as not to be too obvious. The flared ends really help too, but this woofer is a real stoker and can really move some air.

The other question I had was regarding the dampening material from Parts Express called Sonic Barrier. Do NOT, I repeat, do NOT, put this in your speakers. This product is being sold for but was not designed for a loudspeaker application. This product has no other benefit than absorbing standing waves with its foam layer. It has no damper to control cabinet resonances. It only has a barrier layer suspended between foam layers. It is designed to absorb sound waves and keep them from passing from one side of the barrier to the other. However, with no damping layer, the cabinet walls resonant almost as if there is nothing controlling it at all. Plus the suspended barrier layer can mass load the driver to some degree and tends to muddy up the mid-range.

The No Rez product that we carry was designed specifically for the loudspeaker application and for controlling resonances of the cabinet. Plus it is about the same price as the cruddy stuff that PE sells. We can ship it out with your order. One sheet of it is all that you need for the Anarchy kit.

Thanks,

critofur · « **Reply #136 on:** 1 May 2010, 07:17 pm »

Quote from: Danny on 29 Jan 2010, 08:10 pm

I got a great deal on the tweeters so I will pass those on at $20 each.

I'd like to get a pair of those. Also, could you post a link to the kit please?

With a 2" port like this one:

Do you really think chuffing will be audible over the music? (Don't care whether it chuffs when doing sin sweeps)

Quote from: mkb on 9 Feb 2010, 06:10 pm

So is this MT going to be vented in the front or back of the box? It would be nice to be able to hang these on the wall with the vent on the front.

If there's enough clearance behind the brace, I don't see any harm putting a port on the bottom of the cabinet? I guess I'd have to take a look at the cab to know if it would fit easily, but I don't have any P.E. cabs, just some I built to the same dimensions.

Danny Richie · « **Reply #137 on:** 2 May 2010, 01:26 am »

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Also, could you post a link to the kit please?

All information, measurements, and pricing is listed in this thread.

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With a 2" port like this one: Do you really think chuffing will be audible over the music?

The kit comes with an even better port from PSP with flares on both ends:

http://www.psp-inc.com/products.html

A better pic here: http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=268-348

And yes, even with music program material it can start to chuff if played too hard. That woofer has a huge X-Max and a low sensitivity so you get it to really moving before you know it. It really needs a 3" diameter port but that is just not practical at all.

persisting1 · « **Reply #138 on:** 9 Jun 2010, 07:42 am »

Has anyone built this? If so, what are your impressions?

Fatawan · « **Reply #139 on:** 10 Jun 2010, 06:29 pm »

I have everything here ready to go, except I lack the "crossovers for dummies" book to interpret that sheet of heiroglyphics.