Any Ideas For Anarchy?

Fatawan · « **on:** 14 Jan 2010, 07:20 pm »

Hi Danny--lots of these Anarchy midwoofers being sold, but no projects. You have any ideas for a nice 2 way monitor using this driver? Will it work with any of your tweeters?
http://www.diycable.com/main/product_info.php?cPath=24&products_id=538
Thanks

Danny Richie · « **Reply #1 on:** 14 Jan 2010, 09:07 pm »

That thing is built like a miniature sub woofer.

You can make any small woofer play really low if you give up sensitivity, and it looks like this one is less than 85db.

The XBL^ motor will give it increased output below the range where it would have baffle step loss. So if I did a small monitor with it and compensated for 3db of loss ( that is what I had to do with my M-165X woofer) then it will be setting at about 82db in sensitivity. That is pretty low for a mini-monitor.

Paralleling two of them would drop the impedance down to 3.2 ohms minus what any shunt caps might do to it. So it might see just less than 3 ohms. That would not be very versatile in its use with many amps.

Any other ideas?

Danny Richie · « **Reply #2 on:** 14 Jan 2010, 09:30 pm »

Okay just for fun I ran the numbers on one of these things.

For a ported enclosure it only needs .36 cubic feet and will hit a -3db of 41Hz. However, with an X-max of 12mm each way, it needs a port that is 3" in diameter and 30.5" long.

Talk about a woofer that needs a matching PR...

In a sealed box of .15 cubic feet and a Qtc of .702 it is -3db down at 80.7Hz.

So you say a lot of these have been sold huh? What are they doing with them. Are they using them in car audio? Because it would make a killer small sub for a car.

Fatawan · « **Reply #3 on:** 14 Jan 2010, 09:38 pm »

What are they doing with them? That's the problem! I haven't seen anything done with them yet. That's why I was asking you what magic you could work

Here is what Kevin Haskins has thrown out there previously http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=72681.0

or

http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/exodus-audio/21939-need-some-input-tweeter-choices.html

You are right on--it is a mini-subwoofer. Maybe use some of those adjustable CSS 10" PRs, or these 8" PRs http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=295-492 , or a slot port??? That would be an odd looking monitor--small mid, PR's, and a tweeter!

Danny Richie · « **Reply #4 on:** 14 Jan 2010, 09:57 pm »

I'd love to do something with Kevin regarding anything he wanted to work on, but honestly have a tough time figuring out what I'd do with these woofers.

An 82db sensitivity mini-monitor is a tough sale. One that needs a 3" diameter, 30" long port makes it even tougher.

If you found a really nice wave guided tweeter that would cross as low as 1kHz or so then you could series/parallel 4 of those woofers in an MMTMM design that might work well. The low crossover point would be needed because the acoustic centers would be so far away.

Or you could use them as small woofers in a three way design.

Or, they would actually work well using 9 of them in a line source application.

Fatawan · « **Reply #5 on:** 14 Jan 2010, 10:03 pm »

Quote from: Danny on 14 Jan 2010, 09:57 pm

I'd love to do something with Kevin regarding anything he wanted to work on, but honestly have a tough time figuring out what I'd do with these woofers.

An 82db sensitivity mini-monitor is a tough sale. One that needs a 3" diameter, 30" long port makes it even tougher.

If you found a really nice wave guided tweeter that would cross as low as 1kHz or so then you could series/parallel 4 of those woofers in an MMTMM design that might work well. The low crossover point would be needed because the acoustic centers would be so far away.

Or you could use them as small woofers in a three way design.

Or, they would actually work well using 9 of them in a line source application.

I do have LS6's.....would these be an improvement???

Danny Richie · « **Reply #6 on:** 14 Jan 2010, 10:11 pm »

Quote

I do have LS6's.....would these be an improvement???

I don't know that they would be any better than the LS woofers in that application. They are certainly not drop in replacements. The LS woofers are also an XBL^ motor woofer, designed specifically for that application.

The parameters of the Anarchy woofers do lend themselves to work well in a line source design though.

grubyhalo · « **Reply #7 on:** 17 Jan 2010, 09:07 am »

I understand, Qts might not be the only factor governing this, but how well would the anarchy fare in an OB, taking care of the bass duties in a design similar to the OB-5?

Danny Richie · « **Reply #8 on:** 19 Jan 2010, 12:22 am »

They may actually work pretty well in an open baffle,but I'd be afraid to push them much below 100Hz though unless the Qts were a little higher. Maybe Kevin might have some better feedback there.

Kevin Haskins · « **Reply #9 on:** 19 Jan 2010, 01:14 am »

If Danny wants to design you something that is his prerogative. I'll stay out of it though because two Chefs spoil the meal.

jtwrace · « **Reply #10 on:** 19 Jan 2010, 01:16 am »

Quote from: Kevin Haskins on 19 Jan 2010, 01:14 am

two Chefs spoil the meal.

not if they work together with the same common goal...

Danny Richie · « **Reply #11 on:** 19 Jan 2010, 01:30 am »

We just called one another and chatted about it.

A couple of good points Kevin made to me is that the sensitivity is rated on the conservative side. So it is possible that a mini monitor might wind up in the 84db range (not too bad).

Another good recommendation was to go with a 2" flared port. Regardless of what the numbers say that it needs (because of the huge X-Max), it will likely not ever be pushed to those levels, or those extreme X-max's. So the monster port may not really be needed.

I am looking at the numbers again right now.

Looking at the projected curves, it really looks good to me in about .4 cubic feet. This is a little bigger than optimal (by the numbers) of .351 cubic feet, but not as far as Kevin had in mind (,5 cubic feet).

Still, a 2" flared port needs to be 12.25" long (ouch).

.5 cubic feet of air space and tuned to 40Hz keeps it flat to about 45Hz then it really drops hard. It is not much of a gentle rolling curve.

Would you guys be apposed to building a box with a slotted port that folds once inside the box?

Kevin Haskins · « **Reply #12 on:** 19 Jan 2010, 01:30 am »

Quote from: jtwrace on 19 Jan 2010, 01:16 am

not if they work together with the same common goal...

Well... there is the rub.

Designing a crossover for them is pretty trivial. There are any number of people who can design a crossover for them as the response is pretty easy to work with.

Danny would have no problem. He doesn't need me to tell him what needs to be done. A couple measurements and a few hours and he should have something that is serviceable.

Kevin Haskins
Exodus Audio

jtwrace · « **Reply #13 on:** 19 Jan 2010, 01:36 am »

Quote from: Danny on 19 Jan 2010, 01:30 am

We just called one another and chatted about it.

A couple of good points Kevin made to me is that the sensitivity is rated on the conservative side. So it is possible that a mini monitor might wind up in the 84db range (not too bad).

Another good recommendation was to go with a 2" flared port. Regardless of what the numbers say that it needs (because of the huge X-Max), it will likely not ever be pushed to those levels, or those extreme X-max's. So the monster port may not really be needed.

I am looking at the numbers again right now.

Looking at the projected curves, it really looks good to me in about .4 cubic feet. This is a little bigger than optimal (by the numbers) of .351 cubic feet, but not as far as Kevin had in mind (,5 cubic feet).

Still, a 2" flared port needs to be 12.25" long (ouch).

.5 cubic feet of air space and tuned to 40Hz keeps it flat to about 45Hz then it really drops hard. It is not much of a gentle rolling curve.

Would you guys be apposed to building a box with a slotted port that folds once inside the box?

That's how it's done!

I've always said...it's only as hard as you make it.

Danny Richie · « **Reply #14 on:** 19 Jan 2010, 02:31 am »

I have some great tweeters that could be put with these woofers.

They are a low Fs design that can be crossed pretty low, and they have a great response.

I just hate to pad them down 10db.

An MMTMM is still a possibility with this tweeter as it will cross low. I can also play with some by-pass caps on the outer woofers to move the acoustics centers in the higher crossover ranges closer to the tweeter.

That would make a pretty serious little floor standing speaker and would need a long folded port.

For you guys wanting me to do something with these, your feedback is now needed.

poseidonsvoice · « **Reply #15 on:** 19 Jan 2010, 02:37 am »

Looks like a Peerless India tweeter. Similar to the ones used in the Xstatik, etc...

Anand.

Danny Richie · « **Reply #16 on:** 19 Jan 2010, 02:46 am »

Quote

Looks like a Peerless India tweeter. Similar to the ones used in the Xstatik, etc...

Yep, same tweeter just different face plate. It's a great tweeter!

poseidonsvoice · « **Reply #17 on:** 19 Jan 2010, 02:49 am »

Don't make me blush. I know, good things indeed come from India

We've had discussions on this tweeter. Better than SS 9500 performance, etc...a real value. Why not even consider the BD tweeter as well. 2 price points, etc...

Good luck,

Anand.

Danny Richie · « **Reply #18 on:** 19 Jan 2010, 02:53 am »

Are you doubting the performance of this tweeter?

BD tweeter?

poseidonsvoice · « **Reply #19 on:** 19 Jan 2010, 02:59 am »

No, not at all (Did you realize I am from India?). I meant BG tweeter (i.e. Bohlender Graebner). I think they are probably both great performers, however the BG tweeter last I heard it had better decay and snap than soft domes I have heard.

Anand.