[BikeWNC]

Digital Front End - 22%
Analog Front End -  2%
Speakers           - 20%
Amp                  -   8%
Pre                    - 17%
Cables                - 16%
Power Cond.       -   8%
Tweaks/Room     -   7%

[Sa-dono]

Are people posting by the MSRP prices of their systems, or what they paid? I know the two GREATLY vary for me

And I agree with Phil. The fact that there can be such great buys out there, that exceed the sound of even more expensive options definitely scews the percentage values.

[Daniel]

This is an intriguing thread.  I like the simplicity of the question but I find it hard to know what the percentages mean.  Systems that have a mix of new and used stuff like mine may have distorted percentages.  My system is a random assemblage of pieces put together over many years by happenstance and wild impulse.  Most of the time I didn't know what I was doing.  I love it anyway.

I don't mind being crass.  Here is what I have and what I payed:

Total cost: $16235
Speakers: $8800 (54%) new
Amp: $3700 (23%) used
Pre-amp: free (0%) used
Digital source $1265 (8%) refurbished and new
Cables and interconnects: $2000 (12%) new
DIY power conditioner/cable and room treatment $470 (3%)

[JohnR]

In other words, perhap it would be interesting to list the total system cost as well

I think you're right that the appropriate allocations might well be different for an entry-level system vs. a cost-no-object one.   But it COULD be a bit intimidating to post the details of a modest system in the midst of the 10K-25K
gear.

Hey, I'd be proud to do that! There's not much point in listing "my system" since ATM it's changing every week, but here's a configuration I was listening to the other day (with % added afterwards)

Speaker -- "Rat Coffins" -- $50 -- 7%
Amplifier -- Aksa 55 -- $340 -- 47%
Preamp -- DACT passive -- $240 -- 33%
Source -- old CD player -- who knows, basically "free" but let's say $100 -- 14%

However, that isn't really my point I think speakers, if well-designed, can be enjoyable to listen to even at low price points, if driven by good electronics. Yes, you lose out on transparency, detail, and in particular dynamics and bass, but they can still be part of an enjoyable listening experience. I don't think that cheap electronics have this property: they sound bad, period. For some reason, shortcomings in electronics are more objectionable than shortcomings in speakers.

[Tonto Yoder]

Phil,

Isn't the whole point of this thread to see where everyone actually put their $? I don't recall anyone mentioning any set or standard $ ratios.

bubba,
I started the thread after reading a question on AA like "How SHOULD I budget my $$?" Those questions often get formulas like 25% source/25% electronics/50% speakers/25% cables (OK, I wasn't a math major ).
I just thought it would be interesting to see how people have actually spent their $$$.  Maybe some newbie could use these posts as a guideline for his own purchases or maybe he'll just be reassured that there's a wide variety of opinions.

[TheChairGuy]

Vinyl Playback (TT/Cartridge) - 6%
Main Speakers/Passive Sub/Stands - 7% (modded small Optimus' work and N.E.A.R Boom-2 sub work great for me)
CD Playback(Transport/DAC/PS) - 23%
Power Conditioning - 15%
2 MultiAmps(w/active XO)/sub amp/preamp - 21%
FM Tuner - 3.5%
IC/PC/SC Cables - 18.5%
Accessories(stands, isolation blobs and cones, foam room treatment) - 6%

Without a lot of thought into it, I've figured about $10,000 is in my system.  As I went thru it piece by piece (actual cost) and mods, I came up with about $9000.00 total.  I'm not sure I'm 9x happier than JohnR with his system   , but I've got appealling tunes going on here.

Not counted (nor counted by anyone) are the couple old pieces lying around as backup (in my case, 2 preamps and a set of Vandys with a cost in the $1000.00 range) or the few pieces I used on a previous set-up that are now being enjoyed by my Dad in his system I set up a couple years ago (give or take, $2000.00 or so).

So, maybe I spent $9000, $10,000 or $12,000, but I'm pretty damn pleased.  The pieces stretch back over 16 years of buying, but I had the system closet'ed for 6.5 years to focus better on my business and family 1994-late 2000.  So, I'm pleased to be back into it and satisfied with the tunes AND my bank account.

[soliver]

Well after surfing the forum for many months, I guess this post finally got me to register and post.

I am a believer in the balanced approach to system building.  However if you do underspend or overspend I think there are two specific areas to do so in.
underspend - sources (more technological upgrades going on here)
overspend - speakers

Here is my system allocation based upon MSRP

Speakers - 25%
Amp - 20%
Preamp - 16%
Surround Processor - 12%
Digital source - 4%
Analog source - 14%
Cables/Accessories/Tweaks - 10%

Total - 25.5K

Interestingly, the few areas that I want to upgrade - digital source and cables, etc. are the two areas that are furthest out of whack from my balanced approach.

[Cens]

Based on list price figures, which I did not pay for any piece, here's my rough breakdown (the percentages are rounded and end up equaling 101%, but...):

CD Player:       17%
Preamp:          14%
Amplifier:        24%
Mains/sub:      19%
Cables/cords:  18%
Power Cond.:    9%

I'm having a local modify an amp to see how it performs compared to my current main amp.  If if it works for me, the amp as a percentage of total system cost would go down (as would overall system cost).

I'm considering a change of speakers, but not sure that if I did I would spend a greater amount than the list price of my current pair, although I would likely end up paying more in real terms.  

Oddly enough, I learned while doing this that my single-run speaker cables represent 59% of my total cable/cord cost (again, using list price, not what I actually got them for).  Two pairs of interconnects and four power cords made up the rest.

Regards,

Chris

[mb]

Interesting thread....

BD:

Speaker: 26%
CD: 13%
Power amp: 35%
Preamp: 24%
misc: 3%

AD:

Speaker: 56%
CD: 10%
Power amp: 12%
Preamp: 5%
misc: 7%
Room eq: 6%
Room treatment: 6%

Total cost: AD / BD = 46%

BD = Before DIY
AD = After DIY (only the speaker remains)

IMO, the sound has improved, so I'm very pleased. However, if time and effort were calculated into the equation, it's highly unlikely that there were any "savings".

[ekovalsky]

Lets just say that, after cables and a power conditioner, the VMPS RM/X are the least expensive part of my system  

[michael w]

I say forget any allocation formulae and go for what sounds good.

 

However I am biased towards getting the best source and amps before spending the big bucks on speakers.

In the past I've used mega expensive front ends and amps with cheap speakers and gotten great results but rarely got satisfying results the other way 'round.

cheerio

[rlm]

The more I improve my digital source, the better my system sounds.  I am running used SS preamp and amp ($1700 total), used Dynaudio T2.5 speakers ($3000), and an ever improving source (used transport, I2Digital cable, Modwright level II Perpetual Tech P-3A--$1750).  Any upgrading I do will involve further mods to my transport and the P-3A.  These source improvements are readily apparent in this system.

Bob

P.S.  I am about ready to apply a final balancing act by changing ICs from DAC to preamp (currently using Wireworld Polaris).

[John B]

Amp ($6.5K)
Speakers ($5K)
Pre-amp($4K)
Wiring ($4K)
Source ($3K)

[DVV]

The question is good, the thread is good, but is unfortunately limited for reasons beyond our control. Quite simply, two same systems, purchased in two places, will yield different percentages.

Case in point 1 - my own Karan KA-A180i integrated amp. I paid 1,800 euros for it (app. US$ 2,160) locally, where it's made, but you guys in the US would have to pay around $5K for it.

Case in point 2 - my Yamaha CDX-993 CD player. It is not available in North America, no idea why.

Ferdi, who is Dutch, can run down the street and buy an Ah!Tjoeb tube equipped modded Marantz CD player much cheaper than you or I can buy it.

So, with that in mind, here goes:

Amp - Karan Acoustics KA-180i - $2,160                              - 28,61 %
CD - Yamaha CDX-993 - $ 480 new, about $ 600 after mods -   7.95 %
TT/cartridge - app. $ 400 (estimated present value)              -   5.30 %
Headphones - Grado SR-60, app. $100                                -    1.32 %
Tuner - Marantz ST6000, $270                                            -    3.57 %
Line filter - DeZorel AR Senior, $1,080                                 - 14.30 %
Cassette - Sony TC-K 808 ES, app. $300 now                       -   3.97 %
RtR - Philips N4520, app. $500 now                                      -   6.62 %
Accessories - app. $200                                                      -   2.65 %
Cables - van den Hul, app. $500                                          -   6.62 %
Speakers - B&M 1041, $1,440                                              - 19.07 %


Note that some items have been estimated, as they have been purchased long ago (Dual CS604 turtable in 1978, Philipn RtR in 1981, etc).

Cheers,
DVV

[WerTicus]

from the shoppe:
39% denon dvd2900  $1650

diy:
3.5% cables   $150
38% speakers  $1600
19% amp  $800

interesting no? no not really

grande total of $5kish... oh so cheap compared to most people here... but then again everything is diy'ed cept the player

- and I skipped the preamp stage totally.
- simplicity my friends simplicty.

[DVV]

...
- simplicity my friends simplicty.

... can be as destructive as overcomplexity. With simplicty on their lips, many manufacturers participated in killing many a good idea, notably the balance or individual channel gain controls. Are all our spekars truly equidistant from us? Are they all ideally gain matched? Are they each sitting in ideally same location as regards the room acoustics?

Methinks not. Me bets mucho dolores that not.

Try this small test, Ferdi, if you have the time: play your system as you normally do, then insert a tube preamp in between the CD machine and the power amp, listen again. Kinda different, yes? More often than not, actually better, at least subjectively.

You may have been smart and/or lucky to have a CD machine with a small output impedance connected to an amp with a reasonably high input impedance, but don't forger that this is not always possible - and impedance matching is also a job of the preamp.

But this is another topic.

Cheers,
DVV

[rosconey]

50% on amps- odyssey-2  extreme monos  and 2 standard-all used
35% on speakers-diy3.5way and vmps large sub-new
15% on rxv1 reciever used and dvd player new
a little over 4 grand total


have a tempest on order

[TG]

Interesting thread - for me not so much because it really matters how the budget is allocated but because I'm a die-hard DIYer and consequently I havn't really added up totals or percentages for years - so you've got me interested now  

Let's see - the current preamp cost about $1,200 (these are all Australian dollars BTW) in parts.  Can I count labour & design time? Hmm.  Let's add about 60 hours of work, including the circuit and layout design, etc. and I'll charge myself $40/hour (I'm cheap - call it "mate's rates").  That makes $2,400 for construction, so about $3,600 in total.

The current amps cost about $2,500 in parts, and labour and design I'd say was around 200 hours ($8,000) so about $10,500 total.

CD player is commercial and cost $1,200.  Speakers are commercial and cost $6,000

Interconnects and speaker cables are all DIY - say $200 in parts and about 10 hours work ($400) for a total of $600.

So - what's that work out at?  Grand total of $11,100 for parts and the commercially produced items, or $21,900 if I include labour and design costs (but that's all a bit arbitrary - if I charged myself $120 / hour for labour the total would be over $40k)

Without labour costs that's approximately:

preamp - 11%
amps - 22%
speakers - 54%
CD player - 11%
wiring - 2%

and factoring in "mate's rates" labour it becomes:

preamp - 16%
amps - 48%
speakers - 28%
CD player - 5%
wiring - 3%

with the proportion spent on the amplification side increasing depending on how much a DIYer considers his (or her) time to be worth).

What's interesting about this is that I'd consider my setup fairly balanced.  I'd not spend any more on the CD player, although I am considering building an outboard DAC which will probably cost around $300 in parts.  If I were to change the speakers I'd probably spend around $3,000 in parts and devote about 100 hours of labour to the project, so they would still end up costing about the same as my current speakers.

So my bottom line is:

Before you start, first divide your budget in half.  Take the first half of this amount and spend:
half on the amplification,
a quarter on the speakers,
a quarter on source devices, wiring and tweaks.

Then take the second half and spend:
half on going to hear live music
half on buying recordings

and leave a little left over for a good bottle of red  

Cheers

[Rob Babcock]

50% bills & food
10% beer & spirits
the rest for gear!

[TheChairGuy]

from the shoppe:
39% denon dvd2900  $1650

diy:
3.5% cables   $150
38% speakers  $1600
19% amp  $800

interesting no? no not really

grande total of $5kish... oh so cheap compared to most people here... but then again everything is diy'ed cept the player

- and I skipped the preamp stage totally.
- simplicity my friends simplicty.

Werticus,

$5ish is US or Oz dollars?  Either way, it's reasonable and simplistic.  

$1.00 Australia = $0.77 US or US$1.00 = Aus$1.30 as of Friday afternoon, more or less.