[jimdgoulding]

I'm fishing for opinions cause of the design of these speakers.  Seems to me three things make them pretty unique:

1)  the drivers are physically time aligned so their forward output would be time coherent
2)  the drivers are mounted on heads no bigger than they need to be to eliminate cavity resonance
     and diffraction effects
3)  the low bass can be user tuned and has its own amplifier

I may not have that exactly right.  And the low bass driver IS enclosed, I believe.  Now, I think some speaker makers use their enclosures to add sound in support of their drivers.  Makes me think of Magico, for example, and that this can add some euphony to the sound- feel free to correct me cause I may wrong about that regards Magico, or any speaker, for that matter.  But, Harbeth, too, comes to my mind.

Harry Pearson loves Scaena speakers.  I think I get those.  An array of very small acoustic suspension drivers along side of ribbons to match their speed with hardly any enclosure.  I imagine that they propagate only short waveforms (making them more room friendly) that add up to deep bass.  But that's a big think.  These puppies are very expensive and baffleless in common with 5A's.

The 5A's new are around 16k.  Wilson's Sophia appears to be a direct competitor.  From around there, with a few exceptions, contenders to SOTA go up, up, and away.  So, how do the 5A's stack up in that world and why?  I'm very interested in the why as I identify with their design.  How much louder and whatever does a speaker need to be?  I know already that they won't fill a real big room like Rockport's, for example, and don't care.  Those exceptions would include the fine full range speaker makers who participate right here in our club, bless you  .

Thanks.  I will appreciate your knowledge, experience, and insight.

[Wind Chaser]

Are you looking to buy a pair?  If so, I think George (Zybar) would consider selling his.  He'd most likely be among the most knowledgeable, if not the most knowledgeable one here on the Vandersteen 5A.

[zybar]

Are you looking to buy a pair?  If so, I think George (Zybar) would consider selling his.  He'd most likely be among the most knowledgeable, if not the most knowledgeable one here on the Vandersteen 5A.

Nope, not for sale.

Thankfully I came to my wits and never sold them.

I don't have time to go into what makes the 5A's so special right now, but IMHO, I have heard very few speakers that I would rather have (regardless of price).  I have heard the Sophia II's a lot at a local friend's house and while it is a nice speaker, I honestly can't think of a single area where it betters the 5A's.

This review pretty much sums things up nicely (from a technology, function, and sound perspective):

http://www.vandersteen.com/pages/Pdffiles/Model%205A%20Reprint.pdf

George

[jimdgoulding]

Thanks, George, Wind.  Some more reading tells me that the thin walls of Harbeth's enclosure is intended to better dissipate unwanted internal energy.  They seem to be unique in this approach.  Wind, I'm looking for a pair only in my dreams.  Actually, the speakers I have do very well for me in my room.  They are actively/electronically time aligned in the crossover to achieve that time coherence between drivers like Vandersteen does passively by staggering the modules that house his top end, midrange, and mid bass drivers.  George didn't have time to tell us much (altho the link he provided does*) and I am hoping some others will or tell us what is unique about the design of their speakers and how they think that translates to their end game.

*Now THAT's what I'm talkin about.

[Ericus Rex]

Having heard Zybar's 5A's not long ago I can wholeheartedly say they are pretty friggin' sweet!  Tight bass out the yin-yang!

[poseidonsvoice]

Indeed Zybar's system is one of the few I would love to come listen to. And I haven't heard the Vandersteen Model 5's which from my reading has a very serious level of engineering. Even though I've heard a few other manufacturers of 1st order crossover based loudspeakers (claimed), I never was blown away (Theil, Dunlavy, etc...). Vandersteen is one I should audition.

Best,
Anand.

[Mariusz]

Yes, 5a are very, very good.
Some love these and some think they can do ( or own ) better.
I heve heard mixed opinions. Negetive or mixed impresions usually came from those who couldn't  afford them or haven't heard an appropriate setup which these speakers deserve.

They sound great, are easy to dial in (most rooms).

Mariusz 

[lowtech]

Indeed Zybar's system is one of the few I would love to come listen to. And I haven't heard the Vandersteen Model 5's which from my reading has a very serious level of engineering. Even though I've heard a few other manufacturers of 1st order crossover based loudspeakers (claimed), I never was blown away (Theil, Dunlavy, etc...). Vandersteen is one I should audition.

Best,
Anand.

I doubt you'd like them.  They are not considered high-effeiciecy speakers and they will not make your ears bleed.

[Mariusz]

I doubt you'd like them.  They are not considered high-effeiciecy speakers and they will not make your ears bleed.

They are not Fostexs - true.
But you can get away with 80-100wpc.
I drove my Quatros ( 5a smaller brother) with quality 78wpc (tube monos-el34 push/pull) and Supratek preamp. No complaints.


Mariusz

[satfrat]

I doubt you'd like them.  They are not considered high-effeiciecy speakers and they will not make your ears bleed.

While I will agree that they might not make your ears bleed, they might very well make your ears drip honey. I have heard louder volume producing loudspeakers that will play crystal clear but the 5a is one of the sweetest sounding loudspeakers I've ever heard, period. It was a captivating  micro/macro dynamic experience for myself but all the time, I kept having to remind myself that the 16k range is unfortunately unattainable.   
 
This is definitely a loudspeaker that will make one dream what if,,,,, 

Cheers,
Robin
 

[TRADERXFAN]

I doubt you'd like them.  They are not considered high-effeiciecy speakers and they will not make your ears bleed.

Oh Lowtech...

We can always count on you for a snarky comment. 

[lowtech]

Maybe I should have mentioned that the 5A is among the best speakers I have heard.  YMMV.

[satfrat]

Maybe I should have mentioned that the 5A is among the best speakers I have heard.  YMMV.

I never would have thought that from your post but I couldn't agree more with ya. 
 
Cheers,
Robin

[TONEPUB]

I wouldn't go as far as to say the best etc etc. but they are a very good speaker in their price range.  And I've certainly heard them play much louder than I need to listen to music, so with the right amplifier, they are very dynamic.

I've always found the 5A slightly on the warm/musical side rather than the super analytical side and that suits me just fine.

I've heard the 5A's in a couple of very good systems and they've always been a great experience.  Iv'e heard quite a few speakers certainly do a lot more wrong than the 5A.  The comparison to the Sophia is interesting, because the Sophias are more sensitive and will definitely play louder than the 5A's but for most users, probably not quite as musical.

It's definitely a speaker you could live with for a long time!

[jimdgoulding]

Jeff, hi.  They are a very good speaker in their price range?  I would have thought, am thinking, that they are a very good speaker in any price range.  And that is what I am suggesting at the same time looking to validate (I have heard them at a friend's pad).  George has the advantage of being able to go over to a bud's house and listen to speakers with enough commonality to make his comments meaningful.  You, being a reviewer, do, too, I should think.  You probably have even more experience and with ancillaries you are familiar with.  I'd like to encourage you if I can to tell us more.  Thanks.

[Zero]

While I do not feel that there is any one particular aspect of reproduction that the 5A's excel at, they are nonetheless well rounded loudspeakers that are super easy to enjoy. Best of all, it doesn't take much to get them to sound good, unlike the aforementioned Wilson Sophia's, which can be a bear to set up.

[poseidonsvoice]

I doubt you'd like them.  They are not considered high-effeiciecy speakers and they will not make your ears bleed.

You have a pm.

Anand.

[zybar]

Jeff, hi.  They are a very good speaker in their price range?  I would have thought, am thinking, that they are a very good speaker in any price range.  And that is what I am suggesting at the same time looking to validate (I have heard them at a friend's pad).  George has the advantage of being able to go over to a bud's house and listen to speakers with enough commonality to make his comments meaningful.  You, being a reviewer, do, too, I should think.  You probably have even more experience and with ancillaries you are familiar with.  I'd like to encourage you if I can to tell us more.  Thanks.

Jeff has more experience with the very expensive stuff than I do, but I still stand behind my comment on hearing few speakers (in a proper environment, not a show or a very short demo) that I would prefer over the 5A's.  Jeff was right when he said they are musical and present a different picture than the Wilson speakers.  Neither is right or wrong, but I am not sure I could be happy with the Wilson speakers long term.

In terms of spl's, my Atma-Sphere MA-1's have gotten the 5A's over 100db's when measuring from 15-17' away, so no problems with playing loud enough. 

While there are many aspects of the 5A's that I really love, the best is probably in the bass area.  First off, having built in subs is a real blessing when it comes to choosing amplification.  With the 5A's, I don't have to worry about my main amp handling anything under 100Hz or so.  Secondly, each speaker has an 11 band eq system built in.  This allows me to position the speakers for best soundstaging, imaging, depth, etc...and fine tune the bass.  While the bass is powerful, it's strongest attribute is the texture, detail, and tone that is produced.  Listen to a piano or stand up bass on a well setup pair of 5A's and you are in for a real treat.  In fact, this system is so good, that Vandersteen used it in exactly the same configuration on his new flagship Model 7 speaker!

While no part of the 5A's performance is weak or even average, I would say that a tad more sparkle and air in the top end and maybe a slightly more spacious and open midrange (areas that are supposed to be substantially improved upon with the Vandy 7's) would be my wish.

To use a baseball analogy, the 5A is a five tool player with hall of fame credentials.  While it isn't the  Babe Ruth of speakers, it certainly could be Stan Musial, Ted Williams, or Lou Gerhig.

George

[jimdgoulding]

Good post, George.  Thanks.

You gotta know that RV could have brought his 7's out for less dinero than he has, with certainty.  It doesn't sadden me that I can't afford them, I wouldn't in any case knowing what I know; it saddens me that the high end of audio has become like watches and exotic automobiles.  The goddamn Sheiks, obsessive/compulsives, and investment bankers (on the taxpayer dole)* are the target market.  I should care.  Why wouldn't you make a high priced product for them, I suppose.  You know it was guys with no pedigree that started this in audio.  I'm personally gonna take the price of the 7's as tongue in cheek.

*courtesy of my state's favorite son (sic)

[jimdgoulding]

Oh shite, I may have kilt my own thread.  Ignore my sentiment above.  I remain interested in your opinions and experience on the subject, totally.