[storman]

I slowly getting back into vinyl and want to record some of my favorite albums onto my iMac so that I can declick and depop them and burn them onto DVDs using Toast Titanium 9.
I want to know if any of you have had experience with this and if you've found that using an external USB or Firewire phono preamp improves the sound quality of the import versus using the iMac's built-in microphone mini-jack.

Thanks in advance,
Bill

[bunnyma357]

I found that using a USB converter was much better than using the Mini jack on the Mac, if you are looking for good quality without going into audiophile equipment - here is what I use.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16829998002&nm_mc=OTC-Channel&cm_mmc=OTC-channel-_-Accessories+-+Sound+Cards-_-ADS+Technologies-_-29998002&srccode=cii_6570588&cpncode=21-3332939&DEPA=0&refer=channel&CMP=OTC-

It is limited to 44.1 sampling and needs a line level input, so you need to have a phono pre-amp. If you want higher quality there are a ton of options, but they tend to be more costly.

Jim C

[Crimson]

Hello and welcome to AC.

In either instance, you'd need an external phono preamplifier as the analog input on a mac does not provide adequate gain for a MC/MM cartridge. That said, I've ripped quite a few albums by plugging the output of my phono pre into an RME Fireface which acts as a FireWire ADC. I'd rate the analog-to-digital conversion of a mac's line input at about par wth it's d-a quality which is not so great. You'd get much better results with an external USB  or FireWire a-d device.     

[bunnyma357]

For more serious archival of recordings I plan on using Pure Vinyl software & setting up a Firewire ADC and use its Mic pre-amps instead of a phono pre-amp and apply RIAA equalization in software. I'm in the process of piecing together the equipment, so I haven't had a chance to actually do any digitizing yet.

Jim C

[storman]

Thanks for the replies guys.  Yes, I realize the output from a TT is not high enough and needs to be boosted and have RIAA EQ applied. That's why I'm primarily looking for a USB or Firewire phono preamp. If I had to, I could pass the TT output through an old Sony ES Digital preamp for MM gain and RIAA EQ.  But that is big and bulky and I'd rather have it all in one box.  Are there any devices that offer higher resolution ADC than just 16/44.1 ?  I've been doing a little bit of research on archiving LPs and noticed some were recommending that the initial recording be done at something higher before declicking and other noise reductions were done, with a final save downrezed to standard Redbook CD.
Here's something I found at what I thought is a reasonable price, however the ADC operates at 16/44.1:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=cart_accessories&A=details&Q=&sku=381598&is=REG#reviews

Thanks,
Bill

[bunnyma357]

It seems that most USB/Phono Pre combos are targeted at making CD resolution copies or at most 48kHz (Hagtech Ripper, Bellari VP530, Pro-Ject USB Pre's, ART). Maybe there are some others that I'm not aware of.

That's one of the reasons that for higher resolution recordings I plan on using a Pro-Audio Mic Pre-Amp, and apply the RIAA in software. I have a Focusrite 24/192 interface, but I still need to get a MC cartridge, impedance matching cables and purchase Pure Vinyl, I'm still playing with the demo. You could also use the pro-audio interface's line inputs with a regular phono pre-amp in order to get higher sample rates.

http://www.channld.com/pure-vinyl.html

I found that most of my LP's are in good enough shape that I don't need to do any click removal - I've done about 20-25 with the lower resolution 44.1kHz set-up and they sound pretty much just like they do when played on the TT. I just figured before going through the effort to do several hundred of them, that I would upgrade my cartridge and make the best recordings possible at higher resolution.

One really nice benefit of Pure Vinyl is that it also improves your iTunes output similar to Amarra, and you can use the high resolution pro audio interface as a computer DAC, my Focusrite sounds quite nice in that capacity.

Jim C

[storman]

Thanks Jim.  I can see where this could end up costing a lot of $$.  I want to keep the investment in this to the minimum.  I don't have a lot of LPs.  Some of them are not in excellent shape and are noisier than I'd like them to be. Clicks, pops and the resulting raised noise floor takes me sooo out of the listening experience. My hope is to clean them up, remove as much of the objectionable stuff as I can (and not suffer damage to the musical info) on the computer using what I have or with just a small investment in additional equipment, store them in a lossless format and burn them to optical media.   I have a Bluray player with really decent Wolffson DACs and a good analogue output stage. I figure by going this route I can bypass the suspect DAC stages present in most computers.

You've mentioned  Pure Vinyl software.  The price is much higher than what I can spend for this project.  You mentioned you are demo'ing the software.  Do they offer a free download for demoing ?  Otherwise I'll stick with with Spin Doctor from Roxio.  Other than ease of use, how can one piece of software create a better sounding copy than another once the music has been converted into 1's and 0's ? 
Thanks,
Bill

[srb]

Other than ease of use, how can one piece of software create a better sounding copy than another once the music has been converted into 1's and 0's ? 

The click and pop removal is an algorithm that varies from software to software.  It is impossible to remove this noise without removing or affecting some part of the music as well.  Some programs perform this function better than others.
 
Steve

[bunnyma357]

You definitely don't need the Pure Vinyl software, for me it makes sense as it allows me to use a pro audio interface as a MC phono preamp and a ADC and a DAC, so it ends up cheaper in the long run.

For the 20 or so LP's I've digitized at 44.1 just to get on my iPod, I used software I had on hand or that came bundled with the Instant Music Now ADC, and the results were very good.

As SRB noted, different program's noise/click removal quality varies, I tried a few and found that for some, the artifacts were worse than what they were removing, or it was too time intensive to be worth it for me. It seems like if you are trying to stay on budget something like the ART would be fine. If you have noisy records that is probably the limiting factor in quality rather than the resolution of the digitized file.

You'll just have to experiment with the software to see if you find a setting that removes enough of the offensive clicks and pops without effecting the music too much.

I was very happy with my results just using my regular phono pre-amp and the cheap  Instant Music Now ADC - I think that you are looking at fairly subtle improvements for a lot more money as you move up in price.

Jim C