Torus Recommendation

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JohnnyB

Torus Recommendation
« on: 20 Nov 2009, 08:57 pm »
I would appreciate your feedback, comments, and recommendations on the proper torus unit for my situation:

My amps are KSA-200S Krell and Bryston 5B (3X120), plugged into dedicated 20A outlets.

I desire to provide power conditioning for my 50 inch Plasma, OPPO BluRay player, Bryston SP2, Apple TV, Cable Box, and future upgrades.

My guess would be the Torus Power RM 10 AVR?  Your ideas?

Thanks, John Bruns

drummermitchell

Re: Torus Recommendation
« Reply #1 on: 21 Nov 2009, 04:18 am »
Hi,I forget what post on here(#)but James had gave out an out line on what you would need,also if you went to the Bryston website and look under amps I
believe you will see Torus and there also they give a good idea of what you will need.
For me I had upgraded a bit in the last couple of years from a Arcam 100 receiver (with Shunyata hydras)Then to a Arcam AV-8 prepro with Anthem amps
                            THEN I DISCOVERED BRYSTON
I started with a 4B-SST,then a 7B-SST and another 4B-SST and added another 2X7B-ssts,Then I checked out a Torus :o.
I think you can see where this is going,if you have even an incling that you might upgrade an amp,then I'd go for at least a 15a or 20a(that's just me)
As I upgraded I found out(thru James)that having the right Torus(that has enough reserve power)makes a HUGE difference.
I had a 15a with most of my gear in there,didn't really notice much,
BUT when I picked up another 20a,INSTANTLY it was SHOWTIME,a world of difference.The reason it made a huge difference the 15a with all my amps,
was a hurtin unit.When I gave them another Torus to feed them,the sound me,and the amps were totally satisfied.
I don't mean to drag this out,if you think you might upgrade then go for the
bigger Torus.
PS:as a few folks know on here I upgraded this year to a couple 28s,
and a 60a Torus.I figure now that I won't have to upgrade any of  my Torus(s)ever, or my 28s :scratch:,we'll maybe another 28 for the centre.
Still trying to ugrade my room,I guess if I slowed down with the gear,I could
actually have a decent room :o.Hope that helps you out.

 

JohnnyB

Re: Torus Recommendation
« Reply #2 on: 21 Nov 2009, 09:46 am »
Thanks for the input.  Your system is quite powerful!!

To head into a slightly different area, can anyone advise on using a TORUS feeding a power amp(s).  Both my Krell and Bryston Owners manual say that a power conditioner should not be used.  This is why I spent money on getting high quality power to my electrical outlets.

Under this assumption, my question then becomes which of the smaller Torus units should I purchase for the sources only?

But if Bryston endorses / encourages the use of power conditioners for their amps, then my question is moot.

drummermitchell

Re: Torus Recommendation
« Reply #3 on: 21 Nov 2009, 08:54 pm »
James will nail this one for you,I believe alot of conditioners restrict the power from the wall or with the Torus will give you way more than the wall will give.
Hep me James,I'm drownin here.

werd

Re: Torus Recommendation
« Reply #4 on: 21 Nov 2009, 11:51 pm »
Thanks for the input.  Your system is quite powerful!!

To head into a slightly different area, can anyone advise on using a TORUS feeding a power amp(s).  Both my Krell and Bryston Owners manual say that a power conditioner should not be used.  This is why I spent money on getting high quality power to my electrical outlets.

Under this assumption, my question then becomes which of the smaller Torus units should I purchase for the sources only?

But if Bryston endorses / encourages the use of power conditioners for their amps, then my question is moot.

hey JohnnyB

How did you accomplish getting better power to your outlets? I am guessing you mean by dedicated line. IF so the power on your line is still not a guarantee. Saskpower here in Sask gaurantees 115volts but it goes to 113volts very often. I own a mnstercable av2000 that reads volts in and out.

A good power supply like the Torus doesnt regulated the voltage but it never seems to run out of power either or sag(which is what i mean). It probably make a difference.

There are too many conditioners that nerf dynamics for Bryston or Krell to make anything other than a blanket ...(dont do it) statement. Only recently Bryston has endorsed the Torus as a unit that they can guarantee wont do that. From the sounds of it you take your power from the wall seriously so its worth it for you to check these units out.

James Tanner

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Re: Torus Recommendation
« Reply #5 on: 22 Nov 2009, 03:02 am »
James will nail this one for you,I believe alot of conditioners restrict the power from the wall or with the Torus will give you way more than the wall will give.
Hep me James,I'm drownin here.

The concern Bryston had with a lot of power line conditioners available in the market was that many of them could restrict the current available to the amplifier. An amplifier can draw very high peak current, and wants to 'see' a very low impedance high current source from the power line. In fact, we even stated in our owners manuals not to plug our amplifiers into power conditioners. The Transformer based line conditioners we tested were too small to supply the peak current required and many of them were just Filters and did not provide Isolation -(Isolation means there is no mechanical connection between the outside power grid and your inside system power supply).

Also most of the surge protection was done using MOV?s, which are sacrificial and eventually will be destroyed with repeated spikes. Other issues with these MOVs is that they allow much more voltage through before they reacted (typically 300 volts and higher) and they shunt the voltage spikes to ground.

So we decided to try and develop a powerline Conditioner, Isolation and Protection unit that would not have the restrictions of the many units currently on the market from an amplifier performance perspective.

Benefits of Torus Power Isolation Units:

Benefit #1: Very low source impedance and high current for the power amplifier

Torus power isolation units present low impedance to any electronic device that is connected to them. A Single 20 amp Torus PIU has an output impedance of 0.2 ohms and can deliver 400 amp peaks (instantaneous current). The 100 amp unit only has .04 Ohms of output impedance. A typical 200 watt audio power amplifier demands 10 amps RMS current from a 120 volt line (1200VA) but may demand up to 50 amp instantaneous peaks. The standard residential wall receptacle can't supply the 50 amp peaks because they typically have higher nominal impedance. A Torus 20 amp PIU plugged into the same wall plug can supply these peak current requirements quite easily.

Benefit #2: Power surge protection using Series Mode Surge Suppression rather than MOV's

The Torus power products use the finest, most elaborate surge suppression technology available. Series Mode Surge Suppression does not shunt the spike to ground like MOV's do, and therefore the ground is infinitely more stable in a Torus power device. Additionally, most MOV-based surge suppression units allow as much as 300 volts through to the protected components, easily enough to do substantial damage, where as Torus surge suppression has clamping voltage onset of around 2V above peak nominal voltage. Torus units are built to meet 6000 volts, 3000 amps at 1000 repeats standard.

Benefit #3: Total isolation from outside power grid:

Torus power products provide isolation through its finest designed toroidal transformer between the outside power grid and the devices being protected. Such isolation helps to reject external noise sources such as motors, lights, and dimmers commonly  found in the home environment. Torus power products provide noise filtering at a range from approximately 2000Hz to over 1MHz ? other regular transformer based products do not start operating until nearly 10,000 Hz.

Benefit #4: High Power Capability:

There are 15 models of Torus power products available ranging from 2.5 amps to 100 amps and 120/240 Volts.  Torus has recently introduced NEMA wall-mount units, which are typically placed at the hydro panel for whole-house or whole-room power line isolation and protection.

Benefit# 5: Low Noise:

Torus products utilize Plitron ?LONO? (Low Noise) transformer design technology that eliminates audible noise in the power transformer regardless of line conditions, DC offset and over-voltage.  Torus products perform at the NC10 level measured on the standard NC (Noise Criteria) ? which makes them suitable for use in very quiet environments such as professional recording and broadcast studios.

Benefit # 6: Cleaner Power:

Torus products utilize Plitron ?NBT? (Narrow Bandwidth Technology)  to attenuate differential and common-mode noise without external circuits or components, and starting at a lower corner frequency (2Khz) than other systems.  The Torus result is startling ? see press and user comments! 

Benefit # 7: AVR (optional automatic voltage regulation):

The new feature is Automatic Voltage Regulator (AVR). The AVR would make sure that the output voltage of the unit stays uniform within an acceptable range when the input voltage is either increased from or dropped below the acceptable range.The purpose is to keep the output voltage uniform when the input voltage varies over a wide range from 130V to 95V for the North American models and 260V to 190V for the International models and to shut the system down if the input voltage goes above 135V or below 90V for North American models and above 270V or below 180 for the International models.

JohnnyB

Re: Torus Recommendation
« Reply #6 on: 22 Nov 2009, 10:07 am »
James,

Thank you for the terrific response!!

My plan is to tell the electricians to install the following system:

- 10 gauge wiring
- 2 separate outlets, a 20A (Torus RM20) and an 15A (future expansion), each fed directly off distribution box with separate circuit breakers
- Hospital grade outlets
- Verify Distribution Box wiring connections and tightness

Your help was very beneficial.

Sincerely, JohnnyB