Eastern Electric DAC

roscoeiii · « **Reply #460 on:** 1 Apr 2010, 01:54 pm »

Very much looking forward to your comparision to the NorthStar

nature boy · « **Reply #461 on:** 1 Apr 2010, 02:59 pm »

Me too!!!

NB

Quote from: roscoeiii on 1 Apr 2010, 01:54 pm

Very much looking forward to your comparision to the NorthStar

Gopher · « **Reply #462 on:** 2 Apr 2010, 01:04 am »

Maybe I'm losing my hearing, but I've left the 4003s cooking since Tuesday evening and they just aren't doing it for me. From what I'm hearing, the midrange is a lot more solid but also a little harsh. It gets a little silibant at times and the frequency extremes aren't handled as well as stock.

I think the Siemens Bill recommends for clarity may be more up my alley. I'll give it another day or two to cook before ordering anything else up though.

rpf · « **Reply #463 on:** 2 Apr 2010, 01:38 am »

Quote from: Gopher on 2 Apr 2010, 01:04 am

Maybe I'm losing my hearing, but I've left the 4003s cooking since Tuesday evening and they just aren't doing it for me. From what I'm hearing, the midrange is a lot more solid but also a little harsh. It gets a little silibant at times and the frequency extremes aren't handled as well as stock.

I think the Siemens Bill recommends for clarity may be more up my alley. I'll give it another day or two to cook before ordering anything else up though.

On all the time with a signal running through them? I'd give them at least 60-70 hours to burn in.

satfrat · « **Reply #464 on:** 2 Apr 2010, 01:51 am »

I'm presently demo'ing an EE Dac thanks to the generosity of Bill@LakeGeorge. I've also got Mullard and a couple Siemens tubes to roll. I am using the EE as a Dac with an Empirical Off Ramp 3 w/Ultraclock & Paul Hynes SR3-12 power supply and a Locus design Nucleus USB cable.

Now I've been doing comparisons between the Off-Ramp 3 and the EE USB Dac,,,, gotta say that it's mighty damn close comparisons here. If this Dac had been around a year sooner, I could have saved over $2G on a needless transport. The EE USB Dac is that good.

But my 1st day wasn't so positive. My system is highly dynamic with solid 3D imaging sound stage. These are all highpoints of the EE Dac and I found it a little overwhelming. In comparing this Dac with a TDAC while at Bill's, I found out that the gain on the EE dac is significantly higher (volume knob at full). While this wasn't an issue in Bill's Salk HT-3 system, it was with mine. But simply turning down the volume on the EE Dac cured that issue for my system. 5:00 being the max volume, simply going to 3:00 tempered the dynamic issue for my system and while it's still a bit too much of a good thing for me personally, if I hadn't found the Havana Dac which just works better for what my system needs, I'd be all over this Dac. It does so many things good that I could easily live with this Dac and be both happy and a little more richer from the money UI would have saved. In Bill's Salk system, the EE Dac w/Mullard ECC82 tube provides an incredible 3D sound stage depth with nice tight bass. We both agreed that the EE Dac was the preferred Dac over the TAD TDAC or the AVA insight+ Dac.

(I will be bringing my Havana w/Bendix Red Bank 6385 tube over to Bill's in the near future after it's had it's cold bath)

During my demo, I have been using a Herbies Ultrasonic RX-9 ring on the tube (it's for my Havana tube) and I found a positive clarity improvement with it's use. I would highly recommend an EE owner try this tubetweak out with Herbies 90 day money back trial. Trust me, it's cheaper shipping than a CD.

As tubes go, I really like the Mullard ECC82 for it's 3D sound stage presentation but the Siemen tube has a higher clarity but with a punchier bass. I had to turn down the Bass 2db but it could be that this NOS tube simply needs some miles on it. I've only been using it 1 day now and I'm loving the clarity gain with it. I think I still prefer the Mullard ECC82,,, still too early to be sure. I like I love tubes.

I need to agree with Levi, the Eastern Electric USB Dac is a true giant killer, especially in a PC audio system.

Cheers,
Robin

roscoeiii · « **Reply #465 on:** 2 Apr 2010, 02:02 am »

Thanks for the great review Robin. If the OffRamp isn't making a big difference, it would seem like the jitter claims of the Sabre chip are the real deal. Impressive. Spend any time with the op-amp output?

satfrat · « **Reply #466 on:** 2 Apr 2010, 02:20 am »

Quote from: roscoeiii on 2 Apr 2010, 02:02 am

Thanks for the great review Robin. If the OffRamp isn't making a big difference, it would seem like the jitter claims of the Sabre chip are the real deal. Impressive. Spend any time with the op-amp output?

Nope, not one inota of a second,,,, it's all about the tubes baby.

I will say I like my Off Ramp 3's inner details slightly better but the EE's USB Saber chip is pretty damn good. I'm really curious to hear what Rim has to say with his comparisons.

Cheers,
Robin

rpf · « **Reply #467 on:** 2 Apr 2010, 04:12 am »

Levi was kind enough to bring over his EE to my house a couple of weeks ago and I have to agree with both he and Robin that it is an impressive DAC and a great value. We compared it with my Havana (with upgraded output caps). The rest of my system now consists of a Marantz SA15V2 as transport, a Rogue Cronus (with Black Treasure 6CA7s and upgraded NOS signal tubes) and Aural Acoustics Model B speakers. Wires were: Jena Labs Spkr. and analog IC cables, KCI Pegusus digital IC, and Black Sand and Kaplan PCs.

Although I preferred the Havana overall, the EE produced highs the likes of which I don't think I've ever heard before. I love the virtues of NOS DACs but they do roll off the highs a touch. All other up-sampling DACs I've heard, while more extended than NOS types, have something fatiguing going on in the treble; sort of an "out of phase quality" that I can no longer tolerate. I did not hear this quality in the EE. Perhaps the couple of hours we listened were not enough but it did seem that the highs were more cohesive than the other up-samplers (over a half dozen $2k+ DACs and $3k+ CDPs) I've heard have produced in my system. They were certainly very sweet, extended and resolving. The sound as a whole was very smooth, cohesive and spacious, with excellent tonal accuracy (using the Mullard CV4003; the RCA cleartop was solid stateish sounding), although the MHDT had a touch more texture. The EE's deficits relative to my Havana were a lack of macro dynamics and powerful bass. These were things that were significantly improved in the latter piece by the upgraded caps and an upgraded fuse, so perhaps similar improvement can be wrought upon the EE (although its transformer is smaller than the Havana's toroid). Surprisingly to me, the micro dynamics of the EE matched the NOS MHDT's and were superb.

It, of course, needs to be remembered that a new Havana with replaced output caps costs a few hundred dollars (at least 25-30%) more than the EE. I would love to hear an upgraded version of this new DAC.

Edit: I forgot to mention that the EE also has a deeper soundstage than the Havana. (Thanks Robin, for reminding me

).

satfrat · « **Reply #468 on:** 2 Apr 2010, 04:21 am »

If you don't mind my asking Rob, what tube are you using in your Havana? You've really got me looking forward to getting my Havana back next week from Cryoparts.

Hopefully I'll still have the EE Dac so I can do some comparisons of my own in my system before I head back to Bill's. Levi needs to try a Siemens tube if he's like more clarity with punchy bass.

Cheers,
Robin

rpf · « **Reply #469 on:** 2 Apr 2010, 04:33 am »

I'll PM you so as not to hijack this thread. I also told Levi to upgrade the fuse in the EE: that made a significant difference in dynamics with the Havana.

Something I did not expect.

R

Levi · « **Reply #470 on:** 2 Apr 2010, 04:40 am »

I have yet to try a Siemens tube, Thanks Robin. Rob has great tweaks for the Havana.

Likewise, many thanks to Rob (rpf) for inviting me to his house and to sort out the tube for the EE

Rob has lots of good tubes in the house. I will definitely be back to his place for more listening and learning experience.

I am sure it is system dependent but I am digging the CV4003 in my EE DAC. Your mileage may vary.

Levi · « **Reply #471 on:** 2 Apr 2010, 04:45 am »

Congrats Woodsyi.

Just remember it takes 2-weeks++ non-stop to breakin. The EE DAC will open up as Bill suggested.

Quote from: woodsyi on 1 Apr 2010, 01:00 pm

Got mine yesterday. I didn't splurge for the air freight shipment. I have not had much time to do anything but I am looking forward to getting it fired up. I have to go through my tubes to see what I got that would work with it.

I am curious how this will stack up against my Northstar/Pacecar. The jitter reducing circuitry of the Sabre chip versus the asynch reclocker. It will be fun.

mfsoa · « **Reply #472 on:** 2 Apr 2010, 01:10 pm »

A few comments about what I heard re the EE DAC at the last Rave-
(Overall I did not like the sound of the system we listened on - way too bright for my tastes)

Someone said it was the only DAC to compete w/ BobM's modded Ayre and I agree.
We heard several DACs then Bob's AYRE was put in and was a noticable step up in SQ.

The EE had a wonderful high end and good flesh on the bones, as far as I could tell in this unfamiliar room/system.

We heard a Museatex DAC that was ear-bleedy forward, way more foreward than any other which worked against it in the bright system.

The Bryston BDA-1 was placed in and after only a few seconds it was apparent that it sounded worse than the other DACs - A weird hollowy/synthetic sound. It was taken out of the chain after a few minutes (this was a real rapid-fire swap-fest) and was not put back in. I was bummed in that I thought it would sound great and it was on my short list but now I'll really have to give it another serious try before considering it again.

I thought the VanAlstine that was there sounded about the worst of all the dacs. My immediate impression was "where did the bass go and who put horn speakers in?" It was flat and shouty.

The Maverick was nice 'n smooth but very lacking in resolution vs. the EE. Sounded good for the $$ for sure.

In short, I definitely heard enough good things about the EE to keep my interest up. I hear there may be a "hot-rod" version made sans volume control, which is what I'd want.

Anyway, all of the above is IMHO w/ my ears etc., and was gleaned from brief listens on an unfamiliar system, so don't listen to a thing I have to say

-Mike

Levi · « **Reply #473 on:** 2 Apr 2010, 02:01 pm »

Quote from: mfsoa on 2 Apr 2010, 01:10 pm

A few comments about what I heard re the EE DAC at the last Rave-
(Overall I did not like the sound of the system we listened on - way too bright for my tastes)

Someone said it was the only DAC to compete w/ BobM's modded Ayre and I agree.
We heard several DACs then Bob's AYRE was put in and was a noticable step up in SQ.

The EE had a wonderful high end and good flesh on the bones, as far as I could tell in this unfamiliar room/system.

We heard a Museatex DAC that was ear-bleedy forward, way more foreward than any other which worked against it in the bright system.

The Bryston BDA-1 was placed in and after only a few seconds it was apparent that it sounded worse than the other DACs - A weird hollowy/synthetic sound. It was taken out of the chain after a few minutes (this was a real rapid-fire swap-fest) and was not put back in. I was bummed in that I thought it would sound great and it was on my short list but now I'll really have to give it another serious try before considering it again.

I thought the VanAlstine that was there sounded about the worst of all the dacs. My immediate impression was "where did the bass go and who put horn speakers in?" It was flat and shouty.

The Maverick was nice 'n smooth but very lacking in resolution vs. the EE. Sounded good for the $$ for sure.

In short, I definitely heard enough good things about the EE to keep my interest up. I hear there may be a "hot-rod" version made sans volume control, which is what I'd want.

Anyway, all of the above is IMHO w/ my ears etc., and was gleaned from brief listens on an unfamiliar system, so don't listen to a thing I have to say

-Mike

Mike I am impressed, this confirmed my notes of the March 2010 NYAR meeting. BobM's Ayre CD Player is no slouch. We listened to the same cut over-and-over again. It was an unfamiliar music but well recorded. However, even if it was just one cut the difference in sound between gears were easily identifiable.

Just make sure to truly audition the EE Dac in your own system before buying.

BTW, Those Alon IV tweeters needs careful matching of gears and room acoustics.

Audioclyde · « **Reply #474 on:** 2 Apr 2010, 02:03 pm »

Not to derail this thread re the EE DAC, which I am still very interested in, but by PM or otherwise I'd love to hear about the mod's to Bob's Ayre DAC.......

Thanks,

Randy

carusoracer · « **Reply #475 on:** 2 Apr 2010, 04:25 pm »

There are some very good writeups in this thread.

I'm glad others have inserted the Caveat of system synergy. Too bad here in Ohio we do not have anything organized to hear new gear etc. It certainly limits the scope of products that can be heard firsthand in your own personal gear. AKFESt is still always a nice Midwest Show to hear products.

With that said, and with Bill's kindness, I will post my impressions as well over the next week. I have a pretty good assortment of 12AU7's from my Minimax Pre, too bad I don't have pairs to run at the same time as the preamp

My premonition would be for a nice, Bendix Red Bank type tube in the mix. Too bad they did not make a 12AU7 variant. I'm running a early 60's Valvo Hamburg right now. Pretty nice so far.

satfrat · « **Reply #476 on:** 2 Apr 2010, 06:27 pm »

Quote from: Levi on 2 Apr 2010, 04:40 am

I have yet to try a Siemens tube, Thanks Robin. Rob has great tweaks for the Havana.

Likewise, many thanks to Rob (rpf) for inviting me to his house and to sort out the tube for the EE Rob has lots of good tubes in the house. I will definitely be back to his place for more listening and learning experience.

I am sure it is system dependent but I am digging the CV4003 in my EE DAC. Your mileage may vary.

I couldn't take it anymore Levi, after close to 50 hours on the Siemens tube, the bass was simply too overbearing which made the clarity gains worthless imho. I just went back to the Mullard and it was instant relief. I returned the -2db back to the bass and I now have back the taunt bass, detailed 3D sound stage that's very balanced with the bass. I can't recommend the Siemens,, at least not the one I tried.

Mullard it is!

Cheers,
Robin

ctviggen · « **Reply #477 on:** 2 Apr 2010, 08:16 pm »

Anyone think there should be a shoot out between the dB Audio Labs Tranquility DAC and the EE DAC? It seems these two DACs get the most coverage on this board. dB labs I believe is over twice as expensive, though.

satfrat · « **Reply #478 on:** 2 Apr 2010, 08:55 pm »

Yeah that would be interesting,, but just not in this Eastern Electric Industrial Ad thread.

Cheers,
Robin

roscoeiii · « **Reply #479 on:** 2 Apr 2010, 08:59 pm »

Agreed. There is an Eastern Electric DAC review thread here on AC as well.