Thinking about a pair of Salks...

chargedmr2 · « **on:** 29 Sep 2009, 12:52 am »

I'm pretty new to audio, and would like to set up a nice 5.1 system in several stages.

Stage one will be the two front speakers, center speaker, and a receiver (or maybe separate processor and amp?) and this is what I would like to get some advice about (Subs and surrounds will come later). Here is some info that might help out:

Budget for stage one: about $3,000
Primary use: Home theater (90% movies, 10% music)
Room Size: 18'x23'x10' that opens into an attached kitchen
Distance between speakers: minimum would be about 9'
Distance from seating to Plasma: 9'

But here's the catch. This is our main living space so my flexibility with the room is very limited and the speaker placement must work around the existing furniture layout. I may be able to talk my loving wife into towers, but as you can see in the pic below, their is a chair that may impede upon the placement of the left tower. If we go with bookshelf speakers they would probably have to go in the media center.

What would you recommend for this situation? I'm very interested in the Song Towers (and the new HT1-TLs look interesting) and may be able to hear them in my area, but in the end, I'm not sure what's the best way to go with the current room that I have to work with.

Any recommendations...and remember, I'm a bit new to this.

DMurphy · « **Reply #1 on:** 29 Sep 2009, 01:27 am »

Hmmmmm. Can't you just lose the plant? It would be happier near a window anyhow. If it's real. Then you could easily fit two ST's. I wouldn't sweat the chair.

Nuance · « **Reply #2 on:** 29 Sep 2009, 01:41 am »

Its tough to say, because in that room the only way to know for sure would be to try some SongTower's.

As Dennis said, move the plant and don't sweat the chair. The ST's woofers may very well be above the arms anyway. I think SongTower's will work out, but there is only one way to find out.

What receiver are you thinking about going with?

chargedmr2 · « **Reply #3 on:** 29 Sep 2009, 02:09 am »

I should have mentioned...the plant is just filler and will disappear, but the rest needs to stay about the same. Do you think the STs will work OK for the room size? I am open to other suggestions as well (I guess that is stating the obvious, but oh well). Also, a sub will not be added for a while--do you guys think the low end will be desperately lacking for HT purposes in the interim?

Finally, might the HT1-TLs be a better option for low end with two channel listening (once they are available)? Sorry for the barrage of questions.

Nuance - I'm not sure about the receiver as of yet. I was thinking generally about Marantz or maybe HK. I want to dedicate the large majority of the budget to the speakers and get the best receiver (maybe used?) in the $600 range or so. I may end up just using it as an preamp eventually and going with a separate amp if need be.

DMurphy · « **Reply #4 on:** 29 Sep 2009, 02:20 am »

The Songtowers start to lose it below 40 Hz. The HT1 TL's are pretty solid down to 32 Hz or even a little lower. The trade-off is sensitivity. You will need over 100 clean watts per channel for the HT1 if we're talking explosions and prehistoric animals on a rampage. HK receivers are very conservatively rated--they drive all channels simultaneously. So an 80 watt rating from them is probably better than a 120 watt rating from the typical receiver that's only driving at most 2 channels at the same time.

K Shep · « **Reply #5 on:** 29 Sep 2009, 02:34 am »

Quote from: DMurphy on 29 Sep 2009, 02:20 am

...if we're talking explosions and prehistoric animals on a rampage...

I log on to this site to learn, share, interact with others and to read Dennis Murphy's one liners. Mr. Murphy you are one funny dude!

Kirk

Nuance · « **Reply #6 on:** 29 Sep 2009, 02:35 am »

^ Yeah, what those two said. I concur.

oneinthepipe · « **Reply #7 on:** 29 Sep 2009, 02:46 am »

Would you post photos of the rear of the room and describe the room's dimensions? There isn't any way to tell how much space is behind the sofa, which might be significant regarding placement of surrounds and room acoustic issues.

Your budget for Stage 1 is too low for the HT1-TL speakers, a center, and amplification. I believe that the HT1-TL will be 3000.00. The ST, a center, and a receiver might fit the budget, however.

BTW, I don't know anything about multichannel audio.

DMurphy · « **Reply #8 on:** 29 Sep 2009, 02:55 am »

Quote from: K Shep on 29 Sep 2009, 02:34 am

Quote from: DMurphy on 29 Sep 2009, 02:20 am
...if we're talking explosions and prehistoric animals on a rampage...

I log on to this site to learn, share, interact with others and to read Dennis Murphy's one liners. Mr. Murphy you are one funny dude!

Kirk

A lot of people have said that. But it's always been based on photographs.

chargedmr2 · « **Reply #9 on:** 29 Sep 2009, 03:34 am »

Quote from: oneinthepipe on 29 Sep 2009, 02:46 am

Would you post photos of the rear of the room and describe the room's dimensions? There isn't any way to tell how much space is behind the sofa, which might be significant regarding placement of surrounds and room acoustic issues.

Your budget for Stage 1 is too low for the HT1-TL speakers, a center, and amplification. I believe that the HT1-TL will be 3000.00. The ST, a center, and a receiver might fit the budget, however.

BTW, I don't know anything about multichannel audio.

I'll try to get a picture up tomorrow for the rear of the room. As of now, there is nothing behind the couch but empty space that my wife will soon fill with furniture of some sort. There is 7" between the back of the couch and the rear wall.

The two of us have recently crawled up out of the "poor graduate student" lifestyle, so we finally have a new home and really nothing to fill it. As a result, the walls are all empty at the moment--making horrible acoustic conditions that will need to be rectified in the near future.

Yes, the HT1-TL option is unlikely given the cost, so if Salk is the answer, it will be the STs. I guess I'll have to wait for the addition of a sub to get to experience "prehistoric animals on a rampage."

If the STs still get a solid recommendation for this application, I'll have to see if anyone in the Houston area has a pair that I can listen to.

chargedmr2 · « **Reply #10 on:** 29 Sep 2009, 03:36 am »

Oh...regarding the space behind the couch...it's actually 7 feet, not inches. That would have been really small furniture going back there

oneinthepipe · « **Reply #11 on:** 29 Sep 2009, 03:47 am »

Quote from: chargedmr2 on 29 Sep 2009, 03:36 am

Oh...regarding the space behind the couch...it's actually 7 feet, not inches. That would have been really small furniture going back there

Whew. Seven inches would not have given much room. Diffusors can look very nice behind sofas, BTW.

K Shep · « **Reply #12 on:** 29 Sep 2009, 04:44 am »

Quote from: DMurphy on 29 Sep 2009, 02:55 am

Quote from: K Shep on 29 Sep 2009, 02:34 am
Quote from: DMurphy on 29 Sep 2009, 02:20 am
...if we're talking explosions and prehistoric animals on a rampage...

I log on to this site to learn, share, interact with others and to read Dennis Murphy's one liners. Mr. Murphy you are one funny dude!

Kirk

A lot of people have said that. But it's always been based on photographs.

You're also abstract at times. Photographs in you head?

St_PatGuy · « **Reply #13 on:** 29 Sep 2009, 05:03 am »

Quote

I log on to this site to learn, share, interact with others and to read Dennis Murphy's one liners. Mr. Murphy you are one funny dude!

Kirk

Quote

A lot of people have said that. But it's always been based on photographs.

Quote

You're also abstract at times. Photographs in you head?

No, I think he means funny looking dude!

xls7 · « **Reply #14 on:** 29 Sep 2009, 10:58 am »

Okay, we have a lot of parallels (recent graduate student lifestyle, new house, similar-sized room, patient but slightly nervous wife, $3k budget). However, we also have a few differences - I listen to a greater % of music, and I already have a subwoofer and the electronics to drive everything. For the record, I have ordered a Salk Song surround system (SongTowers, SongCenter, SongSurround I's).

Personally, I think you should audition some more, and (heresy alert) maybe just hold off entirely and save up. For your applications, I'm not sure that I would recommend buying 2-3 speakers and a receiver now. You will be missing a lot when watching movies if you do not have surround speakers and a decent subwoofer. There certainly are systems including a receiver and subwoofer that you could get into for $3k, but that budget is a squeeze for Salks.

In a nutshell, go listen to the Salks if you can, and see if (like many of the people on this forum) you personally think that they are incredible speakers, a great value, and worth your money for your uses. Make sure you're playing the type of stuff you want to listen to through them - smooth jazz is not a good proxy for the primal bellow of a Tyrannosaurus. Maybe you (again, like many of us here) are willing to wait and save up for a full Salk surround system, a receiver, and a sub (~$5k would be a good approximation). Then again, you may find that you are not willing to alter your budget, in which case another set of equipment may make you quite happy.

In any event, doing your homework on what's out there is fun and helps to avoid the buyer's remorse that leads so many people in this hobby to "upgraditis."

Best of luck!

K Shep · « **Reply #15 on:** 29 Sep 2009, 01:12 pm »

Quote from: St_PatGuy on 29 Sep 2009, 05:03 am

Quote

I log on to this site to learn, share, interact with others and to read Dennis Murphy's one liners. Mr. Murphy you are one funny dude!

Kirk
Quote
A lot of people have said that. But it's always been based on photographs.
Quote
You're also abstract at times. Photographs in you head?

No, I think he means funny looking dude!

Thanks St_Pat,

I didn't get it until you spelled it out.

Kirk

K Shep · « **Reply #16 on:** 29 Sep 2009, 01:28 pm »

Quote from: xls7 on 29 Sep 2009, 10:58 am

Personally, I think you should audition some more...

In a nutshell, go listen to the Salks if you can, and see if (like many of the people on this forum) you personally think that they are incredible speakers, a great value, and worth your money for your uses. Make sure you're playing the type of stuff you want to listen to through them - smooth jazz is not a good proxy for the primal bellow of a Tyrannosaurus. Maybe you (again, like many of us here) are willing to wait and save up for a full Salk surround system, a receiver, and a sub (~$5k would be a good approximation). Then again, you may find that you are not willing to alter your budget, in which case another set of equipment may make you quite happy.

In any event, doing your homework on what's out there is fun and helps to avoid the buyer's remorse that leads so many people in this hobby to "upgraditis."

This is good advice. However, in my opinioin $3k will get you on your way. You will be able to enjoy your HT setup and research more gear while you have gear to compare. I find a sub to deliver more bang in an HT setup than a center channel (speaker) pun intended. If you are squeezing into a budget I recommend a sub over a center channel. You can pick a great used receiver and a sub on Audiogon and be in great shape. The voicing on the STs is out of this world at their price point. You can't go wrong. IMO purchase a pair of towers new and log on to Agon and check out used Subs and receivers.

$0.02

Kirk

DMurphy · « **Reply #17 on:** 29 Sep 2009, 01:39 pm »

[/quote]
No, I think he means funny looking dude!

Thanks St_Pat,

I didn't get it until you spelled it out.

Kirk
[/quote]

Well, you obviously haven't seen the photographs.

grantc79 · « **Reply #18 on:** 29 Sep 2009, 02:32 pm »

I would contact Jim if I were you.

I know he very recently had a pair of Song Towers and a Song Center with the upgraded ribbon tweeter that someone had traded in. It was a custom done set that he was going to refinish and sell.

The price was very reasonable.

fishinbob · « **Reply #19 on:** 29 Sep 2009, 03:11 pm »

I would go for the best sounding pair of speakers.. within budget of course, and build from there. ( Psst ...the Songtowers)

Subwoofers are the icing for the cake but not a necessity. Most important IMO is the spacial effects surrounds can produce. 99% of the films' soundtrack will not require a subwoofer and a decent center can be had w/o a center speaker.
For theater use, the surrounds don't necessarily have to be great shakes either, you could go and buy a pair of cheap bipoles for under $100 and you are in business.