Our "Second Dose" of "Fine Tuning" - A TOTAL Dynaco FM-3 reconstruction!

Bill Thomas · « **Reply #40 on:** 23 Aug 2010, 11:05 pm »

I think you're onto something, but first... "It's Philosophy Time!"

When attempting to evaluate a potential "improvement" in a unit's performance, you need to run a "baseline test" on the unit, but you NEED to make sure the unit is operating as well as it can be. (Of course, one could argue that a *true* "baseline test" would include running a test prior to alignment, but we have some "prior knowledge" about the FM-3's alignment.)

Throughout the entire Monaural section of the tuner, adjustments are fairly broad. (It is important to be as accurate as possible with the Discriminator alignment, but otherwise, things are pretty simple.)

When you get to the multiplex board, the adjustment to T-71 and T-72 is broad and well-pronounced. T-73 is a bit of a bear. EXTREMELY small movement of the slugs can make a BIG difference in the Stereo Separation and noise rejection.

So, before you go any further, I would STRONGLY recommend doing an alignment of the Multiplex board. I think you will find the separation will improve - even with the strip antenna.

As for your research, I think you are DEFINITELY on the right track. The earlier FM-3 that I modified for 50 microsecond response didn't seem to suffer from the same issues. Sure, it was "bright" when listening to US stations' 75 microsecond pre-emphasis, but it was no more pronounced than listening to a dolby B encoded tape with the dolby decoder off. (That's probably the closest I can "describe" a sound quality in print.)

By the way, I wouldn't bother aligning the rest of the tuner at this point, but if your Multiplex section is WAAYYY off, I'd consider doing at least a Discriminator alignment before aligning the Multiplex board.

Either way, it *does* appear that the 100 pF capacitor should *probably* be reduced to 68 pF for proper performance. Next time I do an FM-3, I'll try to do a comparison, but in theory, it looks like you're right on this.

I LOVE to learn!

Sincerely,

Bill Thomas

handsome · « **Reply #41 on:** 24 Aug 2010, 07:13 am »

thnaks for the reply bill.

I did try to realign the mulltiplex board but using a multimeter as described in the application note on replacing the eye tube with an EM84. There the instruction ask one to adjust T72 & T71 until one gets a as high a voltage on TP75 as possible. I started at 14V and ended off with 30V....but it didn't make a huge difference. Some fiddling with T73 made a very small difference. I will return to that. I will also try replacing the 6BL8. By the way my stereo indicator closes fully.

I am beginning to suspect the pull out switch as well. Looking at the schematic surely if one engages the mono switch the PECs are completely bypassed? Then shouldnt their contribution (brightness) be minimised? I briefly measured the resistance of the switch (in circuit) and it appeared a bit high perhaps this is the issue?

I cant say that there was a huge change from the 100pF to the 68pF but i feel more comfortable with it. Still it would be great if someone could work out a PEC layout that matched the 50uS time constant AND suppressed 38kHz.

I have a problem aligning the discriminator; where i live there are no mono stations! Any suggestions as to how i can proceed?

Thanks for the great assistance!
regards
johnny

Jampot · « **Reply #42 on:** 24 Aug 2010, 07:37 pm »

Quote

The earlier FM-3 that I modified for 50 microsecond response didn't seem to suffer from the same issues. Sure, it was "bright" when listening to US stations' 75 microsecond pre-emphasis,

No sign of 'brightness' here in UK Bill, sound's great

Jim

guzeev · « **Reply #43 on:** 19 Apr 2017, 04:04 pm »

Hi, I'm looking for files of Dinaco FM-3 circuit boards(Gerber files and drill file) for my project of restoring this receiver. Who can share the link?. Or buy ready-made

Thank you.

dB Cooper · « **Reply #44 on:** 19 Apr 2017, 10:09 pm »

The FM3 dates to decades before there was anything like Gerber files, so these probably don't exist.

If you are trying to maintain and/or restore an FM3, I strongly recommend checking out the following resources:

"Keeping the Dyna FM3 Working" By Frank van Alstine (he has a forum here). A MUST-read for anyone trying to, well, keep the Dyna FM-3 working. Article starts at the bottom of Page 4. There is another version with suggestions from a reader for additional "fixes". Not in the linked file or on the website as far as I can tell but I can email you a copy if you PM me.

Link for upgrade parts (EQ modules, power supply etc)

Another great source for parts ranging from substitute PEC de-emphasis modules and an LED pilot light that reduces the load on the power supply all the way up to a full CAD-designed replacement motherboard that replaces almost all point-to-point wiring.

I also have a copy of the Dynaco service bulletin detailing how to substitute the EM84 tuning-eye tube if anyone needs it.

If you really want everything you can get from the stock circuit, you might want to consider pulling the boards and replacing the ancient carbon-comp resistors with modern film types. They have probably all "cooked" out oof spec and there are several places where Dyna originally used tighter-tolerance parts (some in pairs) for performance reasons. If you don't mind spending a little time with a multimeter, you can match these parts much tighter than Dyna was willing to pay for. (Due to the cramped layout, many of these parts are hard to get to with the boards installed.)

guzeev · « **Reply #45 on:** 20 Apr 2017, 01:06 pm »

Thank you, this is very useful information!

dB Cooper · « **Reply #46 on:** 21 Apr 2017, 02:40 am »

One other thing, when I had mine, a little research turned up 'mil-spec' versions of many of the tubes, mainly in the RF and IF sections and the MPX switching tube. I lacked test equipment to validate possible performance improvements, but they worked well and didn't cost much more than the 'street' tubes you find.

guzeev · « **Reply #47 on:** 5 Jul 2017, 04:20 pm »

The values of the mica caps inside the I.F. Transformer, Diskcriminator transformer and T71,T72,T73 Transformer is not given on the schematic. My multimeter will measure capacitance, but have had no luck getting accurate values of the existing mica caps so far.
Who knows the exact values of these capacitors?
Thanks!

dB Cooper · « **Reply #48 on:** 14 Jul 2017, 11:22 am »

Since those caps are not replaceable/interchangeable, I'm not sure what help knowing those values would be, but if anyone would know, it would be this guy. He has offered parts and upgrades for the FM-3 (even a replacement motherboard that eliminates most of the wiring) for years.

guzeev · « **Reply #49 on:** 21 Jul 2017, 11:22 pm »

Yes, I saw this resource, thank you.
I want to say that the use of UHF blocks on one board is not desirable.
It is also not advisable to use two-sided mounting in devices with a power supply of more than 250 volts.
I made gerber files of PC-7, PC-8, PC-12 PCBs, leaving the correct installation but improving the screening between the conductors. After checking, I'll post these files here.

dB Cooper · « **Reply #50 on:** 22 Jul 2017, 02:46 pm »

Interesting; you're saying there are design issues with the 'uniboard'?
Only curious because I used to own an FM-3.
By 'UHF blocks' are you referring to the chokes on the boards? There are some there that are counterproductive?

guzeev · « **Reply #51 on:** 22 Jul 2017, 10:49 pm »

I meant that RF Filter, RF Amplifer, Mixer is better separated from IF Filter and IF Amplifer, which was done in the original receiver design.
There are industry standards for designing printed circuit boards and mounting densities.
Dynaco printed circuit boards are made in category A.
Therefore I think that it is not right to have all the elements of the circuit on one board.
Here are my thoughts on how to improve this receiver.
1.New printed circuit boards with improved shielding of conductors, for better elimination of parasitic capacitances.
2. Replacing the built-in capacitors in the coils and replacing the paper frames with polystyrene ones, this will increase the quality of the coils and selectivity along the adjacent channel.
3. Complete replacement of passive elements by more accurate ones.
4.Change the old capacitor C8

guzeev · « **Reply #52 on:** 22 Jul 2017, 10:54 pm »

New design of PEC 555001

guzeev · « **Reply #53 on:** 20 Nov 2017, 08:16 pm »

Hi. My project is moving, today I received a PCB.
As promised I post Gerber files.
Maybe someone from the community will come in handy.

DYNACO FM-3 PC-7 https://www.dropbox.com/sh/gsyg7av81wvm23o/AADBv_BRhmTJboJ37Zdh1KfTa?dl=0

DYNACO FM-3 PC-8 https://www.dropbox.com/sh/u2itpy3n9uwq1a6/AABSdYUF6hwC93mCNf1P5_B6a?dl=0

DYNACO FM-3 PC-12 https://www.dropbox.com/sh/p324rtdt1mspgkn/AAB4wuIYqH2UZw_S5h_-UI30a?dl=0

DYNACO FM-3 PEC 555001 https://www.dropbox.com/sh/wghz1qwtspxdra5/AADpZ-r2lbEalXj71nge4DINa?dl=0

DYNACO FM-3 PEC 555004 https://www.dropbox.com/sh/chamv2lnm108r7q/AACtqSOfsPXz08WF76UlLiZTa?dl=0

dB Cooper · « **Reply #54 on:** 21 Nov 2017, 02:03 pm »

Do your revised PEC modules incorporate the de-emphasis changes I've seen in some other offerings?

Thanks for resurrecting this. Bill Thomas is long gone but there are still some of these around. Back in my day (Pepperidge Farm remembers?), an FM tuner was considered an essential part of an audio system. Now, few seem to use one, there's never any threads on forums about them, and I have never seen one at any of the numerous audio shows I've been to.

guzeev · « **Reply #55 on:** 21 Nov 2017, 03:29 pm »

PEC 555004 standard
PEC 555001 is upgraded as in the article James Lin.
All PCB in Gerber files reproduce the original as much as possible.

dB Cooper · « **Reply #56 on:** 22 Nov 2017, 01:01 am »

I found one page on modifying the RF board; is there a complete-article link? Still interested in this classic tuner even though I gave mine away on freecycle a few years ago.

guzeev · « **Reply #57 on:** 22 Nov 2017, 05:34 pm »

vitsserg · « **Reply #58 on:** 29 Oct 2018, 07:58 pm »

How is the work going? Did you manage to restore the tuner?

guzeev · « **Reply #59 on:** 21 Jan 2019, 05:55 am »

Hi. Now I am working on new inductors made of modern materials. The goal is to increase the quality of the circuits.