[James Romeyn]

Granted my phono system is close to state of the art.  I've auditioned the best digital including original 24/192 master hard drives (same recording & playback hard drive) by Andrew Jones on TAD Ref speakers in multi-channel w/ about 10 Pass monster amps (Boz Scaggs' My Funny Valentine) at CES a few years ago.  This digital had it's magic, fer sure; in fact IIRC I cried.  It was just before closing that day & a very quiet uninterupted experience.   

But comparing my phono to similarly excellent Red Book, Red Book is a joke, silly, a cartoon.  As someone who has a phono system similar to mine said today, "And CD exists exactly why...?"  I'm thinking the only answer is convenience & to sell a bunch of different stuff than what was already flooding the market. 

Vinyl sales didn't double last year for no good reason. 

[Bob in St. Louis]

Vinyl sales doubling is a great thing! Do you think it's due to the audiophile/forum guys, or do you think it's sneaking it's way back into mainstream?
I was very surprised to see a USB turntable make its way back on the shelves of Walmart (type stores) a year or so ago.
You think just maybe the general public is after this?
Also, do you have a link to the sales numbers? Just for curiosity sake?

Bob

[TheChairGuy]

It's no joke, Bob: http://abcnews.go.com/OnCampus/Story?id=7270049&page=1

While it is starting from a small base of support in units sold....if it has healthy increases for a few years it might be a factor in music sales again.  Clearly it cannot be just nostalgia alone driving this trend.  Sonic quality must be at some point a driving force in it...as it certainly isn't convenience or even cost the factor here (with reasonably good quality playback on DVD players for $59 thes days)

Right now there are not many pressing plants about (they were shuttered in/by the 90's), but once a few more mass-oriented plants and built, we may have a real revival in swing.

I KNOW we're nudging you ever closer to your vinyl future, Senor Bob aa

John

[launche]

Everytime I read these threads I seriously want to go and hear a top notch vinyl system.  Been awhile since I've really listened to one.  Definitely haven't been apart of any A/B comparisons.  Only problem is it's hard for me to think of investing so much into a format that may not allow for flexibility like digital.  But I sure would like to put together a system but don't like hearing I need to invest $5K to get the magic of vinyl.

[rajacat]

I bet that it's the widespread compression used by the recording engineers in most popular music that's causing many to take a second look at vinyl.

-Roy

[ecramer]

Vinyl sales doubling is a great thing! Do you think it's due to the audiophile/forum guys, or do you think it's sneaking it's way back into mainstream?
I was very surprised to see a USB turntable make its way back on the shelves of Walmart (type stores) a year or so ago.
You think just maybe the general public is after this?
Also, do you have a link to the sales numbers? Just for curiosity sake?

Bob

Defintly sneaking its way back into mainstream I haunt three local record stores who sell new and used vinyl and for every old audiophile looking for that classic album theirs three kids culling through the wax. Its comming back hard and fast

ED

[Bigfish]

Everytime I read these threads I seriously want to go and hear a top notch vinyl system.  Been awhile since I've really listened to one.  Definitely haven't been apart of any A/B comparisons.  Only problem is it's hard for me to think of investing so much into a format that may not allow for flexibility like digital.  But I sure would like to put together a system but don't like hearing I need to invest $5K to get the magic of vinyl.

I also would like to hear a top notch vinyl rig but I have no plans to invest in one.  I will keep my ModWright Transporter until a better streaming player comes along!

Ken

[Bob in St. Louis]

That's cool to see it's hitting the main stream media. Very good news indeed. If nothing else, it may be a sign people are looking for higher quality (READ: less compression) regardless of the playback format.

Launche - I'll tell you what man, the first time I'd heard a REAL vinyl rig was totally a surprise. It was a couple years ago at a local STL audio meet. The guy owned a SqueezeBox (everything was super-uber modded to the "inth" degree). of course it all sounded awesome. Well, there I sit with my eyes closed wondering who the artists was that was singing to ME. I look over at the SqueezeBox and low and behold the damn thing was turned off. 
I look over at the turntable and the needle is doin' it's magic. 
Now remember, I've not heard a quality TT in my entire life up to that point. And I hadn't heard vinyl in 25-30 years prior to that. So, needless to say I was totally blown away. SOLD, right then and there. Bingo... that's what it's all about!

John, the day a phono pre falls in my lap, I'll have vinyl spinning. I've already got a AR-XA that's been "tuned up". I've even got a few pieces of black round things bought from ebay. They've even been cleaned up.
I'm ready, it's just there's no pre in the rig.

Bob

[TheChairGuy]

But I sure would like to put together a system but don't like hearing I need to invest $5K to get the magic of vinyl.

You do not need to invest that....if you dip your toes in the used market, you can invest 1/3 of that and get much of the flavor.  Deck, modeling clay (and 2 hours of your time), record cleaning machine/inexpensive chemicals, cartridge and phono stage (or, preferred for me, a full featured preamp w/phono).

My current deck cost me $400...a top notch direct drive unit from 1985 from JVC.  I probably won't (clearly) top it until I reach $2500 in the new market today...and, it is fully automatic so it takes much (not all, tho ) of the bother from vinyl spinning.

Nirvana is closer than you think it would be  (nudge, nudge)

John  aa

[ecramer]

I really have to agree with John, if your not  sure about jumping into vinyl a a nice DD TT with a at440 cartridge or a grado longhorn to see if you can put up with all  the nuances of vinyl is a good way to start  Before warned thought if you get the vinyl bug its devious slope to audio Nirvana. When its dune right there is nothing better YMMV

ED   

But I sure would like to put together a system but don't like hearing I need to invest $5K to get the magic of vinyl.

You do not need to invest that....if you dip your toes in the used market, you can invest 1/3 of that and get much of the flavor.  Deck, modeling clay (and 2 hours of your time), record cleaning machine/inexpensive chemicals, cartridge and phono stage (or, preferred for me, a full featured preamp w/phono).

My current deck cost me $400...a top notch direct drive unit from 1985 from JVC.  I probably won't (clearly) top it until I reach $2500 in the new market today...and, it is fully automatic so it takes much (not all, tho ) of the bother from vinyl spinning.

Nirvana is closer than you think it would be  (nudge, nudge)

John  aa

[TheChairGuy]

I look over at the turntable and the needle is doin' it's magic. 
Now remember, I've not heard a quality TT in my entire life up to that point. And I hadn't heard vinyl in 25-30 years prior to that. So, needless to say I was totally blown away. SOLD, right then and there. Bingo... that's what it's all about!

John, the day a phono pre falls in my lap, I'll have vinyl spinning. I've already got a AR-XA that's been "tuned up". I've even got a few pieces of black round things bought from ebay. They've even been cleaned up.
I'm ready, it's just there's no pre in the rig.

Bob

Ooooo Bo-b....I gotta' fully refurbished Advent 300 receiver here with completely redone guts.  It can be used as a standalone phono stage if you like by running IC's from the tape outs (it bypasses the volume control this way so you can use your volume control on your preamp)

It's a receiver, 15 watter, and (reportedly) glorious at that. You run very efficient speakers, it's all you likely need and can use as a standalone with everything you need.

From tape outs, you can use as either or both your phono stage or FM tuner.

The poor guy is just sitting here in it's shipping box looking for someone to keep it warm and happy for a few months (gratis) until you catch the vinyl fever and buy that $5,000 preamp w/phono

If you PM me with your address, it'll show up next week in St. Louis

Here's a little on it:

http://www.soundofthewood.com/preamptuners.html
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=58995.20

(ps, I don't use it as it is plagued by RF issues here so close to San Fran...but you're in the boonies, as was modder David Plummer, who had no such issues at his shop in the New Hampshire woods).  I never tried it as receiver, but the line, FM and phono stage is exemplary.  It even has dial-a-load...so you can properly load any MM cartridge from 0 to 100K ohms )

John

[Bob in St. Louis]

  Wow John. You're cool, that's awesome. You'll be receiving a PM containing the good, the bad and the ugly here shortly. 

Bob

[Bob in St. Louis]

Hey John,
Your offer is most generous. Thank you very much. However, I must reconsider receiving the unit.

In the interest of full disclosure, I was laid off on Friday. With the way things look so far, the chances for paychecks anytime soon seem doubtful. Money for "toy stuff" is zero... That being said, finding the money for shipping might be hard to do. Knowing someday you'll send a message saying, "Ok Bob, send it back now". My level of integrity dictates that the item must be boxed and shipped within a day or two upon your request. I'm not sure I could promise a speedy return of the preamp. That being said, I feel I would sleep better at night knowing I'm not in possession of equipment I can't return immediately. 

So if you would, think pleasant thoughts for me while you're spinning vinyl.
Instead of the preamp, maybe you could send me some telepathic positive Mo-Jo.  aa

In the mean time, my SqueezeBox has been getting a serious workout the past few days while my job search continues. That's what I need to be concentrating on right now, not integrating another piece of equipment in the system.
Besides, if the wife came down here while I'm playing with yet another new audio toy instead of looking for a job....... 


Thank you my friend,
Bob

-- Sorry for the OT gentleman, back to your regularly scheduled programming.

[turkey]

I know the question is a loaded one in a Vinyl Circle, but it doesn't fit really anywhere else these days at AC.

You're just out to cause trouble these days with these loaded questions.

Yes, given the same recording, I greatly prefer CDs over vinyl.

[turkey]

I bet that it's the widespread compression used by the recording engineers in most popular music that's causing many to take a second look at vinyl.

-Roy

Why? Because recordings mastered to LP already have less dynamic range so the extra compression producers and record executives are demanding these days is less noticeable?

[James Romeyn]

Follow the way, Little Grasshoppers (budget-conscious audionutz thinking about jumping into vinyl)...follow the way.....

I heard John the facilitator's TT/arm/cart at my house.  It had the magic.  I'd follow exactly whatever was John's advice.  I think you can get it up & running by spending some time shopping for probably under a grand.

John if you haven't heard Bill Berndt's phono preamp please do whenever possible.  (BTW he also got the latest arm kit up & running, being Jeff Spall's Audio Mods/Rega from the UK).  Bill says parts about $150 for the phono preamp but Peter T. said lots of work assembling parts suppliers (maybe you or I can get the parts supplier list from Peter T. & publish).  This phono preamp is the cat's meow for chump change, about 5 tubes IIRC, all easy point to point.  I'll probably build one myself later.         

[TheChairGuy]

In the interest of full disclosure, I was laid off on Friday. With the way things look so far, the chances for paychecks anytime soon seem doubtful. Money for "toy stuff" is zero... That being said, finding the money for shipping might be hard to do. Knowing someday you'll send a message saying, "Ok Bob, send it back now". My level of integrity dictates that the item must be boxed and shipped within a day or two upon your request. I'm not sure I could promise a speedy return of the preamp. That being said, I feel I would sleep better at night knowing I'm not in possession of equipment I can't return immediately. 

So if you would, think pleasant thoughts for me while you're spinning vinyl.
Instead of the preamp, maybe you could send me some telepathic positive Mo-Jo.  aa

Bob, I totally understand...and operate much the same.

It's a fairly small unit, cheap to ship (12 lbs + box).  You could put it on my UPS bill back to me.  Seriously, no strings at all attached - I just want you to enjoy vinyl life a bit. Just let me know whenever you'd like to (or if you want to) try...don't be shy.  Really.

But, I understand if that still does not sway you.  I ditched my stereo for 5+ years (1994-thru almost 2000) as I got married, bought a house, a opened my first two businesses.  Audio has always been a distraction for me...tho the music is so soothing to the soul. I used a Panasonic boombox for almost 6 years and didn't remember being so unhappy

That might just be because of my tin ears 

20 potential suitors for SAAB I've read....I'm pleasantly surprised.  Too bad the gracious deal with the Volvo guys didn't work out.  It's probably because one of those guys is getting the axe, too soon

John 

[DTB300]

Last night I was listening to a beautiful LP by Ella Fitzgerald recorded on one my favorite labels, Verve. It was the first time I'd ever heard it, and it had already gone through my usual cleaning process. Ellis voice was deep and rich, yet something didn't sound right... there is some sort of veil over the music which made it less involving, less emotional. This wasn't the Verve sound I was accustomed to, so I put on the reading glasses and read the liner notes to find that indeed it was a digital recording.

Thanks for your input.   But I am more interested in NEWLY recorded for vinyl, not a remaster of some original source, and how they sound to the vinyl group - Telarc label is one who has done it for a bit if I am not mistaken.

[Alonski]

DTB300,

Thanks for clarifying. So far IMO, the most impressive digital recording music label has been Chesky. Unfortunately, they have stopped producing LPs and now only produce CDs. Although I say the sound is impressive, it's a bit "in-your-face" and to me it still sounds digital and not as involving.

[lonewolfny42]

Bob in St.Louis...

In the interest of full disclosure, I was laid off on Friday.

Sorry to read that Bob...good luck with the new job search...

(Since you will have some time on your hands...I'd take John's offer of the equipment loan....give it a listen... )

                     Chris