[werd]

While I certainly enjoy all of the formentioned formats and in my case, I'm on a long vinyl trip, the ratio of vinyl to CD playback is about 100 to 1.

Call me an old fuddy-duddy, but I would have a great fear of having all of my music as a "download". Working in the hard-drive industry, I know that drives crash. All of them (eventually). And while solid state drives have a small footstep in the doorway, they are still relatively new and unproven.

What will you do when you crash? Or will you have several drives as back up?

My backup sits on the shelf, waiting for it's turn to spin in something.

Wayner

Hey Wayner

The format is really new, all those issues are being addressed even now. In the not so distant future that post will look ancient. You will look back go 

[zybar]

While I certainly enjoy all of the formentioned formats and in my case, I'm on a long vinyl trip, the ratio of vinyl to CD playback is about 100 to 1.

Call me an old fuddy-duddy, but I would have a great fear of having all of my music as a "download". Working in the hard-drive industry, I know that drives crash. All of them (eventually). And while solid state drives have a small footstep in the doorway, they are still relatively new and unproven.

What will you do when you crash? Or will you have several drives as back up?

My backup sits on the shelf, waiting for it's turn to spin in something.

Wayner

Wayner,

I simply backup all my music (2GB and growing).  Not exactly hard, challenging, or expensive to do.

Also, I can move the backups off-site for increased protection and safety.

BTW, let's not forget that records can be scratched, can get warped, etc...  Once I rip my cd, my physical media is protected and stays pristine.

George

[ecramer]

I can't understand why there is still discussion of CD players. It's old technology that will soon disappear like cassette players did in the past. Computer based audio is the best playback currently available aside from very expensive vinyl systems.  Soon most serious audiophiles will be downloading High Rez audio files for storage and playback. I like both vinyl and computer based audio and for the near term both will have a place in my system. I haven't used my CD player for three years. It is no longer in the audio rack. I keep it on hand just in case my modded Squeezebox turns belly up.

If you investigate this thread it's not difficult finding various posts describing the rapture they've experienced while listening to their Modwright Transporters. You'll find similar expressions of ecstasy in the Empirical Audio circle.   

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=56360.msg617985;topicseen#new
-Roy
 

Totally disagree about computer playback which i find very soulless i would take a $50 dvd player over most computer system. the one's i heard that i liked were mostly highly modded unites that you could buy a very good TT or CDP and cut out all or most of the digital manipulation.

ED

As far as the future and hi speed downloads of  High Rez audio files unless they do a major over haul  of the web bandwidth constraints will kill  that along with High Rez video/ movies

Ed,

I think you are a little off on this one.  

While I won't make the sweeping statement that all computer based audio is great sounding, I can assure you that my computer based digital front end is not soulless and sounds killer.  I use a Modwright Transporter in my computer setup.  While it isn't cheap, I think it will be challenging to find an analog setup that equals or surpasses it for the same amount of money.

As for downloading hi-rez music...it is fast and easy.  Don't confuse downloading/streaming 30-50GB Blu-ray hi-rez movies with downloading 500MB-1GB hi-rez music albums.  With my Verizon FIOS account, I am able to hit download speeds of 20 Mbps.  Speeds will continue to go up and prices come down as more and more time goes by.

George

I'm sure your system is killer and if you ever get that get rave going you were talking about i plan to find out for myself I love the sound of the Vandersteen 5A's. $3800 Modwright transport and say $1500 to $2000 for a computer with a 4 tetra bit raid setup  would be getting me a pretty good TT setup I will give you the ease of use as vinyl is a pain in the backside to do right but i am willing to spend the time to do it. As far as bandwidth goes i see more and more providers limiting band width YMMV

ED

[TheChairGuy]

Some of you that have a top-notch CD system and profess to it being great, should have a very good vinyl system and clean records nearby to compare.

I wrote this a couple pages ago and now want to rescind it.

If what you have in your place sounds great to you - than you need nothing more nor any need to please anyone but yourself.

Seriously, that's ALL that matters.  Sorry about that line above...I left it in for posterity, but it really is errant blather of an excited vinylphool

John

[Wayner]

George,

I know you are of sound mind and certainly would back up all that music, especially if you didn't own the hard copy. I do the same, believe it or not I have some stuff on hard drive.

However, I'm certain there are a few folks that have had the crash and are totally screwed. Yes, I know records can get worn, or damaged. That is one reason I take painful steps aligning my cart and setting the table correctly. A poorly installed cartridge will do great harm to any valuable collection.

I'm certainly not going to record and load 2,000+ lps and put them on a hard drive.

Have a good one

Wayner

[zybar]

I'm sure your system is killer and if you ever get that get rave going you were talking about i plan to find out for myself I love the sound of the Vandersteen 5A's. $3800 Modwright transport and say $1500 to $2000 for a computer with a 4 tetra bit raid setup  would be getting me a pretty good TT setup I will give you the ease of use as vinyl is a pain in the backside to do right but i am willing to spend the time to do it. As far as bandwidth goes i see more and more providers limiting band width YMMV

ED

Ed,

Met with Michael yesterday and we are looking at June, not May.  BUT, there could be an even bigger surprise for everybody.  Once Michael and I work some things out, we will get a firm date published and everybody will have plenty of time to make plans.

I put together a new computer system for under $1k in Nov/Dec that has 3.5 TB of storage, two optical drives, tons of memory, etc...  I think raid is overkill for this application and adds a lot of unnecessary cost, but YMMV.

If you want to count the cost of the computer into the equation, you also need to count the cost of a nice phono stage and all the accompanying equipment for the vinyl setup.

Since this is the vinyl circle, what does $5k get you in terms of table, arm, cartridge, and phono stage these days?

George


 

[zybar]

Some of you that have a top-notch CD system and profess to it being great, should have a very good vinyl system and clean records nearby to compare.

I wrote this a couple pages ago and now want to rescind it.

If what you have in your place sounds great to you - than you need nothing more nor any need to please anyone but yourself.

Seriously, that's ALL that matters.  Sorry about that line above...I left it in for posterity, but it really is errant blather of an excited vinylphool

John

No worries John...it is the VINYL CIRCLE after all.

George

[zybar]

I'm certainly not going to record and load 2,000+ lps and put them on a hard drive.

Wayner

I am in full agreement on that!  My lp's are sitting in boxes and I have had no thoughts of ripping them. 

I plan on keeping my meager collection (2-300lp's) just in case.   aa

George

[woodsyi]

I listen to whatever format the music I like is on.  I prefer vinyl for the music that were mastered before CDs came out.  Some remastered to CDs are good but I listened to a lot of music that never made to CD.  So I run both.  Newer ones don't exist on vinyl either although it's changing somewhat. 

[Bob in St. Louis]

If what you have in your place sounds great to you - than you need nothing more nor any need to please anyone but yourself.

That's it right there Brother. Amen.
My collection is 25,615 tunes stored in FLAC taking up 697GB on an external USB RAID drive that totals 1.5TB. So I've got room left (when the money starts coming back again).
Screw CDs, those are a PITA. Wouldn't mind having some vinyl in the house just for that 'ultimate sound' occasionally, but that's a long way off. But as you said, it all boils down to what our individual "flavor" and tolerance level happens to be.
At the end of the day, what makes us close our eyes and float off to that "other place" is what counts.

Bob

[Browntrout]

I think a computer is the worst sounding source available today. Masses of noise, limited bandwidth, tonally devoid, emotionally sterile, dynamically flat, compressed to hell, usually overloaded and the material is designed to be played through 5.1 computer speakers.
  How can you expect a good sound from something with a CPU in it? Or three fans spinning, or several whirring hard drives? Or a computers power supply? It does not compute.

[bummrush]

They said vinyl was going to disappear to.

[zybar]

I think a computer is the worst sounding source available today. Masses of noise, limited bandwidth, tonally devoid, emotionally sterile, dynamically flat, compressed to hell, usually overloaded and the material is designed to be played through 5.1 computer speakers.
  How can you expect a good sound from something with a CPU in it? Or three fans spinning, or several whirring hard drives? Or a computers power supply? It does not compute.

A post like this just shows you don't understand what computer based audio is.

I personally don't care if you like it or not, but I really wish people who say they don't like something, at least understand what they don't like.

George

[Bob in St. Louis]

Mr. Trout,
The tunes don't go through the PC, kmixer, and all the EMI/noise created by the fans, power supply, PCI cards etc...
The files are transmitted (wired or wireless) in digital form to a SqueezeBox (or similar devise).
Any "screwing up of the music" will be done with the typical two channel components. ie; DAC, Pre, amp, speakers. etc....

There's quite a few highly respect individuals here that love their PC based sources. Not just little 'ol me.

Bob

[Rocket]

Hi,

I have sunk a lot of money into my vinyl system of the years.  Its painful so many things have gone wrong with the turntable it isn't funny.  A major problem I had was working out how to stop a 'ground loop' from making a really unpleasant hum when playing vinyl.

Cd is much easier to use and sounds great these days.  Btw I currently use a second hand bel canto dac 2 and modified pioneer cdp.

I haven't totally given up on vinyl but for now its just sitting in my system unused.  Perhaps, if I hadn't had so many issues with the bluenote turntable I wouldn't feel this way.

Regards

Rod

[TheChairGuy]

A post like this just shows you don't understand what computer based audio is.

I personally don't care if you like it or not, but I really wish people who say they don't like something, at least understand what they don't like.

George

Well, I am no dummy at the 'puter (I am on them for hours each day, normally 7 days a week), but I admit to not knowing, or keeping up with, computer audio.

Those that I have heard sound the same as good CD playback decks with damped discs (Herbies mat or other damping mats).  Which is not to say bad at all...just not as wholesome and fulsome as the vinyl I hear

Tho I may at times sound close-minded, I am not really and look forward to being wrong (almost) as much as I delight in being right

George/zybar...dunno' if you're earlier request for a US$5k vinyl system was rhetorical or not, but $5k in deck, cartridge, and record cleaner (and cleaning chemicals) are out there that would blow most digi-philes minds.  But, I've found that until you get to the high bucks phono stages, it doesn't overcome the drag of the extra IC length, solder and rca joints it adds to the analog chain.  All these extra joints drain the sonic energy away...it's only until you get to the (typically) really high-priced phono stages do these parasitic losses get made up by other sonic purities.

So, when you add a high-buck phono stage to the mix, you may not reach the $5K point any better than a well-configured digital playback.  I'm talking new components...used would put you well in the hunt

John

[zybar]

A post like this just shows you don't understand what computer based audio is.

I personally don't care if you like it or not, but I really wish people who say they don't like something, at least understand what they don't like.

George

Well, I am no dummy at the 'puter (I am on them for hours each day, normally 7 days a week), but I admit to not knowing, or keeping up with, computer audio.

Those that I have heard sound the same as good CD playback decks with damped discs (Herbies mat or other damping mats).  Which is not to say bad at all...just not as wholesome and fulsome as the vinyl I hear

Tho I may at times sound close-minded, I am not really and look forward to being wrong (almost) as much as I delight in being right

John

And I didn't see you make silly statements John on something you don't know much about. 

George

[Browntrout]

LOL.   You tell me I don't know what I'm talking about and that the tunes don't 'go through' the computer. I spent the last five years fixing computers and all the component parts that make up a PC as that was my job as an electronics technician. I built the PC I write this on which uses a compresor and refrigerant to cool the CPU to minus 56 degrees centigrade to enable an overclock to just below 4ghz from my Pentium D dual core.
    The tunes do go through the computer, from the hard drive to northbridge to ram to northbridge to CPU to northbridge to ram to soundcard and through southbridge to USB/firewire/wireless card to the air to the 'squeezebox' and through the same junk then to your speakers then the air then your poor ears. Thats why it sounds so good.......not.
    Silly statement finished.
  It is you that knows very little you pompous ass.

[ecramer]

 For me a lot of the fun with cd's or lps is gong to rack and finding something that i haven't heard for a while the covers see who played on ect. That's why you will see me post a couple of PJ harvey cd on the what are you listening to thread as i got the urge from an other thread. I never do a play list its always the whole cd or at worst one side of an lp I have my entire cd collection 31953 tracks  burned to mp3 to use for on my portable player that i use for work but i still copy whole albums over never just a bunch of tracks. For me i take each album as it comes, because that's what and in that order the artiest presented the material We were basically talking about  the difference between sirloin and porterhouses with computer based systems and cdp  and analog  THey all work its just what sounds good to you

ED    

[zybar]

For me a lot of the fun with cd's or lps is gong to rack and finding something that i haven't heard for a while the covers see who played on ect. That's why you will see me post a couple of PJ harvey cd on the what are you listening to thread as i got the urge from an other thread. I never do a play list its always the whole cd or at worst one side of an lp I have my entire cd collection 31953 tracks  burned to mp3 to use for on my portable player that i use for work but i still copy whole albums over never just a bunch of tracks. For me i take each album as it comes, because that's what and in that order the artiest presented the material We were basically talking about  the difference between sirloin and porterhouses with computer based systems and cdp  and analog  THey all work its just what sounds good to you

ED    

Ed,

I thought I would miss the ritual of grabbing the lp or cd, but I honestly don't.  It has been replaced by the simplicity of having access to my entire collection with a few clicks of a remote or mouse.

While at times I might cruise from album to album a little quickly, the reality is that I listen to a SUBSTANTIALLY larger portion of my collection now, which is a very good thing.

George