Song Towers vs. Axiom M80's

Nuance · « **Reply #140 on:** 24 Feb 2009, 07:32 pm »

Quote from: cujobob on 24 Feb 2009, 04:25 pm

For speakers, I still think they have a high value product, however I would be leery of any electronics. I haven't been paying as much attention as others to the situation, though. Salk has nice products, I would just suggest that for <2K for a total system, it offers a lot of value. Overall, a step down from Jim's products, but at a big cost difference. The OP seemed to imply he was looking for a HT, I thought.

FYI - read about the current issues AV123 is having. It would seem people aren't getting their products, nor refunds. If you search around you'll find information about this issue. Due to this, I just can't recommend their stuff, no matter what kind of value it offers.

To be fair, if Salk was taking customers' money but not delivering a product, I wouldn't recommend their stuff either. Of course, that's NOT a problem with Salk, but you get the idea. Be weary!

BoB/335 · « **Reply #141 on:** 26 Feb 2009, 06:44 pm »

OK. So I still don't own any Salk speakers and still giving my M80's a workout. I have hooked up the sub (have it turned all the up though) and have the center speaker hooked up. Surrounds are still in the boxes. This setup is sounding pretty good for HT but I am listening to 2 channel music and I still hear something bothersome.

The reason for this post is I finally took pictures of my room and want to post them somehow. I don't get on the Axiom Forum anymore. Where and how can I post them so others can see? Probably better to be a neutral posting ground.

Let me try this and see how it works.

http://bob335.myphotoalbum.com/view_album.php?set_albumName=album01

edited to say it works!

Nuance · « **Reply #142 on:** 26 Feb 2009, 08:04 pm »

Bob,

Well, that's certainly not the most ideal setup with the corner placement of the speakers, the hardwood floors and the mostly bare walls, but you've gotta do what you've gotta do. Other than moving the room around to accommodate better speaker positioning (using the wall to the left of the current setup and to the right of that opening in the back, which would probably sound a lot better), there's not a whole lot else that can be done. You have a very beautiful home, though.

Levi · « **Reply #143 on:** 26 Feb 2009, 10:15 pm »

Hey Bob, Looking at your pictures looks like you need to spread those speakers more for better imaging. YOu remember when you where at Evan? Your speakers were placed at least 7-8' apart. I would try to position them at least 7' apart if you can and probably toe them in a little. Even with ultra expensive speakers will not sound as good if they are not placed properly.

Levi

cujobob · « **Reply #144 on:** 26 Feb 2009, 10:56 pm »

Beautiful home ...seriously.

As for your setup, I'd probably set things up elsewhere so you can spread out the speakers (as mentioned)...but if you're stuck with that location, perhaps a high-end sealed bookshelf or tower would suit you better? (I'm assuming the speakers being mentioned are all rear ported)

BoB/335 · « **Reply #145 on:** 27 Feb 2009, 11:51 am »

Thanks for the compliments and suggestions. A little background check is in order.
I have been neither a movie buff or a "critical listener". I haven't had what I deemed a good stereo for quite a number of years. After my initial sytem experienced problems, any replacement fell on the back burner. Music listening fell to one of the kid's boom boxes or the car. Being a guitarist, I'm usually trying to learn a song through headphones rather to just sit and listen. My time spent with Evan, Joe, and Levi was very relaxing and enjoyable.
Our 31" picture tube was in a typical entertainment center against the big flat wall. It stuck out almost 2' and had to be walked around to exit the room. Having a large screen there would be to close for viewing from the couch by the window and the rear ports of any rear-ported speaker would be flat against the wall.

The tv WAS the priority. It was fixed in our minds that if we ever got a big screen that it would go great in that corner for the best viewing and actually incorporates more seating in that location. The HT system was an immediate afterthought after purchasing the tv. I was looking at the Orb satelite system which probably would have looked good in there. When I started talking towers my wife had a strange look in her eyes. Turns out she likes the way the towers look where they are. And my picture seems to be pretty commom among HT enthusiasts who don't have a dedicated HT room.

There really is no other place to put any of this in this room or this house. I have been looking into making a few home-made room treatments to place along the big wall, behind both speakers and on the bottom slant of the stairs.

I want to thank all of you for allowing my intrusion into your Salk world. I have learned a lot here and enjoyed my time with those in person as well as on the net. I still hope to get better mains (Song Towers) and to try to make the GTG tomorrow and continue learning.

Nuance · « **Reply #146 on:** 27 Feb 2009, 03:05 pm »

Well, that's completely understandable, Bob. However, you must understand that you will probably never get "good" sound quality from speakers placed in such a way you have them. Still, keep your priorities if you must, else move them into a dedicated room or something. I am also a bit of a videoholic, and I know how important it is to have a quality screen. However, a TV your size will not be too close for viewing from the couch if you moved it against the flat wall. Also, you could also mount it, which frees up the space below it to hold audio components, allow the total system to protrude less into the room. I'd think the only thing that would stick out into the room would be the speakers, which ideally should be a minmum of 18" from the back wall.

Concerning the TV, I can PM you a link to an HDTV seating chart calculator if you'd like, but that's a totally different topic. Still, I assure you it wouldn't be too close, and would actually give you the best of both worlds because it would be a more enveloping experience visually and sound wise.

Anyway I know you may just not be able to accommodate anything I said, and if so just ignore me.

Good luck on your search and it's been a pleasure having you here at AC. Enjoy the GTG tomorrow (I will be attending one of my own, but it's a subwoofer GTG).

Take care!

MaxCast · « **Reply #147 on:** 27 Feb 2009, 04:12 pm »

Bob, do you have a basement you can commandeer?

BoB/335 · « **Reply #148 on:** 27 Feb 2009, 05:48 pm »

No I don't. And that wouldn't work anyway. I must do a combo HT/Stereo system so I have to live with that compromise. In fact before 2 months ago I never would have thought that people have 2 separate and different systems. I don't imagine that happening for me any time soon.

Also there is no way that I can have speakers 18" from the wall. The M80's probably need more room than the ST's. My wife is pretty easy going but I can't imagine her parting with this tv in the corner. Everyone loves the picture of this set and how it sits in the corner so well.

I can spread the right speaker further to the right for music listening most likely.

cujobob · « **Reply #149 on:** 27 Feb 2009, 06:53 pm »

Order the speakers front ported? Or sealed?

cdorval1 · « **Reply #150 on:** 27 Feb 2009, 08:06 pm »

You may want to put a bass trap behind the TV in that corner. I'd bet you'd notice the improvement right away.

BoB/335 · « **Reply #151 on:** 27 Feb 2009, 08:46 pm »

Not really having a problem with the bass. It's the perceived brightness that is bothersome. I will attempt to make some with that stiff insilation and fabric. In fact is there a detailed home made treatments with pics that can be linked here?

BoB/335 · « **Reply #152 on:** 27 Feb 2009, 08:46 pm »

Quote from: cujobob on 27 Feb 2009, 06:53 pm

Order the speakers front ported? Or sealed?

Are you talking about Song Towers? I read somewhere that there is a "vent" in the back and not a port.

DMurphy · « **Reply #153 on:** 27 Feb 2009, 09:41 pm »

Quote from: BoB/335 on 27 Feb 2009, 08:46 pm

Quote from: cujobob on 27 Feb 2009, 06:53 pm
Order the speakers front ported? Or sealed?

Are you talking about Song Towers? I read somewhere that there is a "vent" in the back and not a port.

It looks like a port. But it doesn't quite talk like a port. You can get it pretty close to the rear wall without a bunch of boom. Certainly less than 18"

evan1 · « **Reply #154 on:** 27 Feb 2009, 09:55 pm »

Hi Bob
I think you should move the system to the left and that may solve part of the problem

BoB/335 · « **Reply #155 on:** 27 Feb 2009, 10:46 pm »

Well I don't find the bass boomy. Not as tight as the ST's and by comparison might seem boomy but I don't find them boomy. Axiom claims the M80's can go as close as 6" but I believe that I have plenty of space on the angle that they are.

Someone assumed that the bass may be heavier out of the left speaker. That might be so but not noticeable probably because bass is non-directional.

Nuance · « **Reply #156 on:** 27 Feb 2009, 11:18 pm »

Bob,

I think we're just over anxious about trying to help you resolve your issue. You've gotten a LOT of GOOD advice, but if you can't accommodate it, that's life. Unfortunately you're just going to have to settle for "less than ideal" sound, at least until you can do something about room placement and what not. I think you already know this, though, so I am sure you've accepted it and can live with it. If you do get ST's, though, just know that if anything changes down the road and you can give them the proper setup, placement and calibration, it only gets better.

Best wishes to you!

Tyson · « **Reply #157 on:** 27 Feb 2009, 11:52 pm »

If you thought the axioms were bright in a treated room, then treating your room won't fix that. Return the axioms and go with a different brand. The ones I mentioned before will all be better options.

BoB/335 · « **Reply #158 on:** 28 Feb 2009, 01:09 am »

I realize what I have to live with and I really do appreciate everyone knocking themselves out tryin to help me. I also realize how the M80's sounded in a treated room. (Evan has a very comfortable room)

I really like the way the Song Towers sounded and would like to hear any other competitive speakers no higher than that price range. (I'm already way over budget)

I had some email correspondance with Jim Salk earlier today. (What a nice guy) He has seen the pics of my room. Although he also agrees that I don't have optimum conditions, he felt that the Song Tower would not be beat in my circumstances. I will continue looking that route.

Thanks for all the help!

BoB/335 · « **Reply #159 on:** 28 Feb 2009, 01:14 am »