Shuguang Treasure 'Black Bottle' 6CA7Z and Genalex KT-77's

cryoparts · « **Reply #60 on:** 13 Mar 2009, 03:38 am »

Thanks, Bill!

Update coming soon. Sorry, been crazy around here this week.

Peace,

Lee

Quote from: Bill O'Connell on 13 Mar 2009, 03:27 am

I spoke with Alex Yeung(Mr.Eastern Electric) and he said the plate voltages to the EL34's on the M520 are about 420v.
Lee ,you are correct that the M520 can only run EL34,KT77,6CA7's.

Audioclyde · « **Reply #61 on:** 15 Mar 2009, 02:12 pm »

Lee, you have pm.

Thanks,

Randy

cryoparts · « **Reply #62 on:** 15 Mar 2009, 06:25 pm »

Quote from: Audioclyde on 15 Mar 2009, 02:12 pm

Lee, you have pm.

Thanks,

Randy

Got it, thanks!

Lee

richidoo · « **Reply #63 on:** 19 Mar 2009, 01:49 pm »

OK, thanks guys, really good information.

cryoparts · « **Reply #64 on:** 19 Mar 2009, 08:57 pm »

Hello Everyone,

Sorry for the delay in posting my thoughts, it has been a crazy few weeks around here.

However, following are a few thoughts from my listening sessions the past few weeks.

The Shuguang tubes are 'broken in', finally (!), I think. I haven't noticed much change the past week, or so, I think they have finally leveled off and are sounding like they are supposed to, ie, GREAT!

All comments are compared to the stock (not cryo'd) SED Winged C's:

Bass is tight and tuneful, while going much deeper.
Highs are much more extended and pure. Not splashy at all like they were with the SED's. Cymbals sound like cymbals, not like
"escaping steam", which is a pet peeve of mine.
Midrange is close in purity and smoothness to the SED's (which are VERY good in this area), but more transparent, which allows one to 'see' into the stage and sound scape more clearly and allows the illusion of space to really develop. In addition, spatial cues are easier to identity which allows firm placement of instruments and/or performers within the stage.
The last week, or so, I have been finding it harder to listen critically and find myself just drawn into the music as the emotion of the artist is really coming through. This doesn't happen to me a lot with budget gear, as I am pretty jaded, so consider it high praise, indeed.

More to come. However, suffice to say that these are remarkable tubes and are keepers and, IMO, well worth the money. They are more akin to a component upgrade than a tube upgrade, to my mind.

Next up, I will cryo these bad boys and report on how they sound after they are broken in. I should have them cryo'd and back in the amp within 2-3 weeks.

While they are in cryo, I will pop in some cryo'd Winged C's and then some stock Genalex KT77's for a bit of fun.

More to come, soon!

Can someone move this thread to whatever forum ends up taking its place, please? I have people that PM me to make sure I am updating it, at least once in a while, so maybe there is some interest out there. I don't have any interest in self aggrandizement and would have let the thread just die, but now that some are interested, I want to follow through.

Peace,

Lee

JakeJ · « **Reply #65 on:** 19 Mar 2009, 09:49 pm »

Hi Lee,

If my circle (The Tube-O-Phile) is granted I'll see if I can get it moved there. I have been following your Black Treasure tubes thread almost since the beginning. I am hoping they turn out to be sonically as good as advertised and have a long life (10,000 hours or better) as a set would last me darn near forever with a bit of tube rolling.

Keep the updates coming.

Thanks, Jake

cryoparts · « **Reply #66 on:** 19 Mar 2009, 09:51 pm »

Cool, thanks!

I voted for your circle, I hope it flies, it will be great.

Lee

Quote from: JakeJ on 19 Mar 2009, 09:49 pm

Hi Lee,

If my circle (The Tube-O-Phile) is granted I'll see if I can get it moved there. I have been following your Black Treasure tubes thread almost since the beginning. I am hoping they turn out to be sonically as good as advertised and have a long life (10,000 hours or better) as a set would last me darn near forever with a bit of tube rolling.

Keep the updates coming.

Thanks, Jake

cryoparts · « **Reply #67 on:** 19 Mar 2009, 09:58 pm »

Quote from: JakeJ on 19 Mar 2009, 09:49 pm

I am hoping they turn out to be sonically as good as advertised and have a long life (10,000 hours or better) as a set would last me darn near forever with a bit of tube rolling.

Sonically, they are every bit as good as advertised.

I, too, hope they last 10k hours! I have some Mullard 5AR4'S in the amp that should last forever as well, that would be great if the only tubes I ever had to replace were the driver and phase splitter!

Peace,

Lee

JakeJ · « **Reply #68 on:** 19 Mar 2009, 10:17 pm »

I have a good feeling about the circle I've proposed, fingers are crossed, response has been very good.

Here's a question for any one that remembers Capt. Kangaroo. What was the retail price of a Mullard EL34 in 1962? What was their advertised life span? Although I'm 52 and remember accompanying my Dad to the local drugstore to test tubes from the old Silvertone TV I was too preoccupied with the Pez and comic book displays to know what a tube sold for.

Thanks,
Jake

iGrant · « **Reply #69 on:** 19 Mar 2009, 10:35 pm »

Quote from: JakeJ on 19 Mar 2009, 10:17 pm

I have a good feeling about the circle I've proposed, fingers are crossed, response has been very good.

Here's a question for any one that remembers Capt. Kangaroo. What was the retail price of a Mullard EL34 in 1962? What was their advertised life span? Although I'm 52 and remember accompanying my Dad to the local drugstore to test tubes from the old Silvertone TV I was too preoccupied with the Pez and comic book displays to know what a tube sold for.

Thanks,
Jake

Hope it happens for you and all of us too, I voted and look forward to a place to chat, exchange ideas and learn more about some of my favourite things. As far as the price, don't know either and I'm a year older, and after seeing that show about the ad exec's in the 60's I'd be guessing that 'forever' was the advertised life span and they could be right, not knowing that lot's of them wouldn't be opened until the next century.

Cheers,
Ian

cryoparts · « **Reply #70 on:** 19 Mar 2009, 11:54 pm »

Quote from: JakeJ on 19 Mar 2009, 10:17 pm

What was the retail price of a Mullard EL34 in 1962? What was their advertised life span?

Good question. I bet one of the "Bill's" (O'Connell or Thomas on AC) or Jim Mcshane (on AA) could tell us.

Peace,

Lee

richidoo · « **Reply #71 on:** 20 Mar 2009, 12:03 am »

Nice review Lee, thanks.

These tubes are very tempting!
Rich

iGrant · « **Reply #72 on:** 20 Mar 2009, 12:34 am »

Thanks Lee for the efforts. Look forward to seeing how they turn out Cryo'd. What will be your anticipated procedure if you are free to share and what would you expect as the results? I've always described the benefit of cryo treating as creating a blacker background to paint the soundstage on. The coating inside the Shuguangs are likely doing the same thing to my ears. Of course this is just a guess as I've never heard the tube with and without the coating, but do have the opportunity soon to try the CV-181-Z's with a different (light blue) coating and will compare to the black coating.

Cheers,
Ian

cryoparts · « **Reply #73 on:** 20 Mar 2009, 12:57 am »

Quote from: iGrant on 20 Mar 2009, 12:34 am

Thanks Lee for the efforts. Look forward to seeing how they turn out Cryo'd. What will be your anticipated procedure if you are free to share and what would you expect as the results? I've always described the benefit of cryo treating as creating a blacker background to paint the soundstage on. The coating inside the Shuguangs are likely doing the same thing to my ears. Of course this is just a guess as I've never heard the tube with and without the coating, but do have the opportunity soon to try the CV-181-Z's with a different (light blue) coating and will compare to the black coating.

Cheers,
Ian

Hi Ian,

I'll use the same custom cryo procedure that I have been using for many years. I have cryo'd thousands of tubes with my custom cryo profile over the years and have found that tubes generally benefit, sometimes just a bit, sometimes a great deal. I'll be doing quite a few tubes in this next load, including some ridiculously wicked expensive NOS models. Fun stuff!

I won't give away the exact details of my custom cryo process/profile as it took me a long time and a great deal of money to develop my process, however, one can peruse my websites for more information if they are so inclined. I don't want to turn this thread into an advertisement for my services, so I'll leave it at that.

As far as the expected results, I really don't have any at this point as I haven't done any of the Shuguang Treasure's, so it will be a surprise to all of us. Hopefully, it will make a nice positive difference and I can report that, however, if it doesn't do much, I'll report that as well. Again, I'm doing this project for fun, not to drum up business as my cryo service is in pretty high demand as it is.

Peace,

Lee

iGrant · « **Reply #74 on:** 20 Mar 2009, 01:09 am »

Cool Lee, look forward and again thanks.

Ian

cryoparts · « **Reply #75 on:** 20 Mar 2009, 07:56 pm »

Quote from: iGrant on 20 Mar 2009, 01:09 am

Cool Lee, look forward and again thanks.

Ian

Lee

cryoparts · « **Reply #76 on:** 25 Mar 2009, 06:25 pm »

Hey! The Tube-o-Phile circle lives! Great!

Peace,

Lee

cryoparts · « **Reply #77 on:** 3 Apr 2009, 02:51 am »

Quick update:

OK, finally got the Shuguang's into cryo today. Should have them out early next week, so will be reporting some results soon--right now I have put the cryo'd Winged C's back in the amp to refresh my aural memory. Will pop the Genalex 77's in the amp soon.

Peace,

Lee

lonewolfny42 · « **Reply #78 on:** 3 Apr 2009, 06:38 am »

Lee....

Interesting thread...

What speakers are you running with the Eastern Electric M520 ? Thanks...

cryoparts · « **Reply #79 on:** 3 Apr 2009, 01:01 pm »

Quote from: lonewolfny42 on 3 Apr 2009, 06:38 am

Lee....

Interesting thread...

What speakers are you running with the Eastern Electric M520 ? Thanks...

Lately, the past two weeks or so, I've been grooving on a set of Eminent Tech LFT-16's, there is a great synergy between the M520 and those. Any one who visited my room at the first couple of RMAF's can attest to that. However, my main passive set is custom pair of passive Sonicweld's (all of the Sonicweld's are active) that I commissioned so I could listen to tube amps on an ultra high resolution speaker to be able to easily identify any changes.

I have also tried three different sets of Whiplash Audio full range single driver speakers, a pair of Acoustat's (at LOW volumes, ha!), a big 'ol honking pair of Klipsch "something or other" that are incredibly sensitive, and some other assorted Infinity, some assorted British speakers, and some others that I have laying around at the shop, or the house.

Peace,

Lee