AKSA or Lifeforce?

IMS · « **on:** 3 Dec 2008, 11:59 pm »

Hello all,

I am very interested in the product and have been going through the forums trying to decide which to tackle, the AKSA or Lifeforce, and 55 or 100. I like the one post:

AKSA: musical, warm, intimate, involving. (MGB, Moto Guzzi Breva)

Lifeforce: detailed, satisfying, intimate, engaging, non-fatigueing (BMW M3, ZRX Kawasaki)

Right now my system includes:
Yamaha RXV3000 as prepro
Emotiva LPA1 7 channel amp
Axiom 80, 150, QS8 speakers
SVS sub
OPPO 980H

So I use my system for both HT and music, though I use it for music much more in two channel mode. The room is pretty large, approx 7000cf.

In any case, I have the bug to start improving my system. I am currently looking at diy designs for speakers. The Axioms are pretty bright for me.

My musical tastes are blues, rock, jazz, instrumental, female vocals, etc. I like some classical, but do not have a lot of experience with it. On really good recordings, I like to play it fairly loud.

I had some minor training in electronics over 20 years ago, so I THINK I could handle the AKSA kits.

My budget could handle either products. Unfortunately, I could never get the cost of the Soraya past the boss.

Soooooo…

Greg

fred · « **Reply #1 on:** 4 Dec 2008, 03:42 am »

Personally, I started with a standard AKSA - back in the day when that was all there was, upgraded to Nirvana, and then finally to LF100 - each upgrade resulted in a happy improvement in sonic quality - especially the LF. You should go with LF right off the bat - since you say you can afford it - you get all the benefits from day one, and only have to go to the capital appropriation committee but once.

Are you planning to buy 7 channels of amp, or something less. My personal recommendation is to go with 3 channels of LF100, rather than the standard 2, unless you plan to use a phantom center speaker in HT. It won't sound right if you don't.

(yes Hugh, I'm still alive and well. I've never stopped lurking the forum, but just haven't had anything worth saying).

IMS · « **Reply #2 on:** 4 Dec 2008, 04:24 am »

Fred,

The more I read, the more I am inclined to agree with you. I think I will stick with 5 channels. Is there a 3 channel version of the LF100? I don't see it on the website. I suppose the LF55 for surrounds? Gotta figure out how much that would end up being after all is said and done in US$.

Really, I'm looking to see what I can do on the music side. I don't know if a 5 channel version is overkill for HT. Of course, I'm just learning.

The main thing is Christmas is just around the corner (and my birthday), and I still need to put a list together.

Thanks,

Greg

whubbard · « **Reply #3 on:** 4 Dec 2008, 06:28 am »

Greg,

About getting the 3 Channels I would just go ahead an email Hugh. He is very responsive and a delight to work with.

I personally went with the LFs over AKSA for my active Orion System and I am very pleased. While I cannot offer you a comparison between the two, I can tell you that the LFs are an outstanding amp. The Orions are a very detail orientated speaker, but they require an amp that can send the details to it, the LF fills that role. (I also have the GK-1 which adds a bit of warmth to the system)

The LF55s should be fine for the surrounds, the Aspen line on a whole is known to be somewhat underrated in terms of what it can really put out in power.

-West

AKSA · « **Reply #4 on:** 4 Dec 2008, 09:24 am »

Greg,

I had not realised you wanted a multichannel setup; this is indeed practical to use with a mix of LF100 and LF55, and indeed, to save a few dollars you could consider using some traded but functional AKSA 55N+ modules as surround amps.

Thanks guys, terrific advice.

Cheers,

Hugh

Fred:
Real pleasure to see you here, thank you for your reply. I loved your 'capital appropriation committee', felt this elegantly encapsulated the delicate domestic situation in which we all blissfully survive.......

West,
Thank you for your gracious comments, very nice of you. I have enjoyed working with you, too, I have to say, your lightning fast absorption of all things audio has astounded all of us!

Hugh

stvnharr · « **Reply #5 on:** 4 Dec 2008, 10:49 pm »

Hi Greg,
I happened to be at Hugh's yesterday when all of the above happened. I've had the Lot of Hugh's diy works. LF is certainly the way to go for 2 channel or the 3 front channels of surround. The rear surrounds would be perfectly fine with Aksa Nirvana+, and Hugh has a bunch of these at the moment. Highly recommended.

Steve

IMS · « **Reply #6 on:** 5 Dec 2008, 12:15 am »

Thanks Steve,

I wasn't originally thinking HT for the amps, but it's got me wondering. Are there other people out there doing this?

IMS · « **Reply #7 on:** 5 Dec 2008, 02:31 am »

Fred sent you a pm

stvnharr · « **Reply #8 on:** 6 Dec 2008, 10:16 pm »

Quote from: IMS on 5 Dec 2008, 12:15 am

Thanks Steve,

I wasn't originally thinking HT for the amps, but it's got me wondering. Are there other people out there doing this?

Greg,
If you are only thinking 2 channel, and have the budget for it, adding the GK-1 preamp to a LF amp is really good. I have 2 systems, one with the preamp and one without the preamp. I prefer the touch that the preamp gives to the sound of the LF. Anyway, something to think about.

Steve

rabbitz · « **Reply #9 on:** 9 Dec 2008, 11:55 am »

I've had both the AKSA 55N+ and the LF55 and both are exceptional power amplifiers. I have a preference for the AKSA 55N+ as there is something in the presentation of that amp that appeals to me immensely.

Mine has been modded to remove some H2 and add some more bass.... in other words add a slight amount of LF55 into the mix, plus I've take out 9dB of gain to suit my pre and system.

IMS · « **Reply #10 on:** 11 Dec 2008, 07:02 pm »

Thanks all,

I ordered the 55N+, since it's my first go at the diy thing. If I decide to upgrade in the future (starting down that slippery slope), I can use them in another room. Now I just need to figure out what/where to order to complete it. I'm sure perusing the forums and Hugh will point me in the right direction.

Can't wait to get this started!

I'm also thinking about keeping my HT separate with the Axiom speakers. They work well for HT, though I need to upgrade the processor.

So that means a new pair of speakers, preamp, etc. I've been looking at a number of diy speakers out there.

Anyway, first things first.

Greg

LM · « **Reply #11 on:** 12 Dec 2008, 10:52 pm »

Hi Greg,

Congratulations on the 55N+ decision. It's such great first amp that it may well be the 'last' amp you need (though upgraditis has little to do with true needs).

I totally agree with your thoughts of separating the stereo from the HT. I did that a couple of years ago and have never looked back. Sure it costs for some extra components such as an additional source, speakers etc. but I found that no matter how hard I tried, I always had compromise in the stereo aspect of my HT setup. Now that I use the HT for just that, it performs beautifully for that purpose with my old speakers etc. and no upgrade in sight. And my Aspen based stereo in its separate cave is the bees knees.

Give the VSonics and GK1 kits a serious look (or should I say listen) though. I have a GK1 with a few upgraded components that I swear by and the only thing that Hugh's VSonics miss out on from my very much loved Vandersteen 3ASigs is a little base extension. The VSonics are astonishingly good.

Sparkie · « **Reply #12 on:** 13 Dec 2008, 03:01 am »

Hi All,

Greg you've made a good decision to build a 55N+. From talking to people who know Hugh you will have a good leader to help you build the 55n+. But firstly let me say I have not heard one but have heard the life force and today a top of the range Soraya powering the Vsonics. They only get better. from all reports the new pre amp is another revelation. I can't wait to hear it.

LM.
I have heard the Vsonics on a few occasions during development of the prototype to professionally built ones. Bloody marvellous in all performance areas.You spend more time worrying why you can't fault them. And they can be built DIY out of a kit too. NOW as far as the bass goes I heard the new transmission line woofer specifically designed as a bass extender to seamlessly extend the bass the of the Vsonics. Not that the Vsonics really require the bass to be extended IMHO. BUt the woofer is a musical instrument which adds body to the music, very similar to the slam , impact and depth of a live performance in an undescribable way. The Aspen system is getting close to the ultimate IMHO.

Barry

AKSA · « **Reply #13 on:** 13 Dec 2008, 04:37 am »

Hey Barry,

Many thanks, very nice of you....

On a scale of 1 to 10, and these scales are always difficult, I'd put the AKSA at 7.5, the LF at 8.5, the Soraya II at 9.7.

As for the new preamp (a cat you have unwittingly released from its bag!) it was designed to partner the Soraya, not the AKSA or LF. It is an utterly new circuit, completely unrelated to the GK1 and Swift, and I'm still agonising over a name for it.

I'm also working on an amp to fill the price point between Lifeforce and Soraya. Now THAT'S a tough one.....

That new sub is extraordinary.

I have agreed to to buy the design from Laurie I'm delighted to say, and will in due course release it. It is unbelievably well designed - kudos to Laurie, if genius is the infinite ability to take pains, he has it - and while it can use a plate amp (at lower quality to an Aspen amp!) it can very profitably be driven from the same amp as the VSonics, through two separate crossovers terminating on a dual voice coil, one for left channel, one for right, both on the one woofer.

A name is already agreed for this one. It will be called the LeVitator. Once we swore it lifted off the ground during a magnificent pipe organ riff, just incredible....

Cheers,

Hugh

DSK · « **Reply #14 on:** 13 Dec 2008, 09:22 am »

Quote from: AKSA on 13 Dec 2008, 04:37 am

...As for the new preamp (a cat you have unwittingly released from its bag!) it was designed to partner the Soraya, not the AKSA or LF. It is an utterly new circuit, completely unrelated to the GK1 and Swift, and I'm still agonising over a name for it. ...

Hi Hugh! Now that the cat is out of the bag, are you able to tell us whether the new pre-amp is tube/hybrid or solid state?

Topping the GK-1/Swift will be pretty tough, but then I said that about the AKSA, N+, and LifeForce

AKSA · « **Reply #15 on:** 13 Dec 2008, 11:36 am »

Darren,

It's a tube hybrid, using a triode/pentode, and a single ended SS voltage amplifier.

Everything about it is different to the GK1, which it's designed to supplement, not replace.

Thanks for the interest, no doubt you'll hear it soon!

Cheers,

Hugh

whubbard · « **Reply #16 on:** 13 Dec 2008, 04:42 pm »

Quote from: AKSA on 13 Dec 2008, 04:37 am

I'm also working on an amp to fill the price point between Lifeforce and Soraya. Now THAT'S a tough one.....

How about a full DIY kit of the Soraya. No case or transformer, just parts and PCB. We assemble it all and make the case. Wouldn't that lower the price significantly?

-West

AKSA · « **Reply #17 on:** 13 Dec 2008, 08:39 pm »

Yes, West,

But this is where the rubber hits the road.....

Cheaper kit, no quality control, little reward for IP, no wage for Hugh. And the boredom of assembling kits is excruciating, not to mention the unbillable hours spent servicing the customer. Kits are the worst business model imaginable, tried it for seven years, over it now.

Full retail amp, good quality control, some reward for IP, funds for marketing and overheads, part wage for Hugh.

I tried to fight City Hall on the business model, only to find that I was fighting myself and living in self-imposed poverty. Even with the internet model, the strategy MUST include conventional retail sales. And unfortunately labor and part costs in Oz are far higher than the US.

Cheers,

Hugh

gaetan8888 · « **Reply #18 on:** 14 Dec 2008, 02:28 am »

Hello

A full DIY kit of the Soraya would include a schematic...

Keeping the Aksa schematic from being copy was quite a job for Hugh, just think how much more works for him it would be to keep a Soraya schematic from being copy, especialy after a celestial sound reputation of a Soraya kit would be known into the diy community !

Many peoples would ask him for a free Soraya schematic !

And one day you would even see an Ebay seller with a copy of the Soraya, like somebody did to Nelson Pass.

Peoples give more respect to full retail amp designers, they seem to see kit amps designers with much less respect.

Gaetan

whubbard · « **Reply #19 on:** 14 Dec 2008, 07:33 am »

Quote from: AKSA on 13 Dec 2008, 08:39 pm

not to mention the unbillable hours spent servicing the customer.