Audiophile dudes- help me choose one

Imperial · « **Reply #20 on:** 4 Dec 2008, 11:27 pm »

Yes, some do that, but it probably voids stuff... like the warranty...

However, I agree, of course!
You could solder in a bybee too if you wanna... (the "copper" Slipstream Quantum Purifier maybee...)

I'm gonna describe how to build the ULTIMATE NAD jumper:
2 Eichmann Silver Bullet RCA Plugs, 2 Eichmann Copper Bullet RCA Plugs.
2 Bybee Slipstream Quantum Purifiers "Copper type"... and 2 bits of silver signal wire. (Audio Consulting silver wire should work)
"Jam" the bybee into the hollow stems of the eichmans... use the silverwire for the "shield" or earth connection.
I should think this would be ... just as good as internally soldering stuff.

Why bulletplug?

Well you don't really need the whole plug...

Why silver plug in one end and copper plug in the other end? And why silver for earth?
Ah... go to 6moons and start reading about Frank Tschangs cables...
Very interesting reading!!!!

Imperial

Stu Pitt · « **Reply #21 on:** 5 Dec 2008, 04:43 am »

geowak,

I've owned my B60 for about a year and a half and couldn't be happier. I honestly haven't found any shortcomings yet. Its pretty difficult to describe it, but I'll try my best...

Its neither forward nor laid back. Its not bright nor warm. Its very transparent, clean, and dead quiet. Its not a smooth, liquid sounding amp, but its not in your face, harsh, and aggressive either. It just gets out of the way and presents the music, nothing more or less. Despite being detailed and faithful to the recording, its very musical. It'll show you what everything connected to it does.

Its a true dual mono amp - 1 power supply for each channel. Its built rock solid and has a 20 year transferable warranty. Look at the "Any internal pictures B60" thread I started in the Bryston Circle a while back (page 11). They have options for remote, MM phono stage (I use an MC Dynavector 10x5 with no problems), and an internal DAC. If you need a phono stage or DAC, Bryston can retro fit them (not both - not enough room). Not sure about the remote though.

Downfalls?

Its only 60 watts. They're a very strong and dynamic 60 watts, but 60 none the less. If your speakers are power hungry and want rock concert levels in a big room, look elsewhere. If you keep things under control and don't expect it to do what its not designed to do, you won't have any problems. Its very capable of driving my Yaras to levels far louder than I care for in my medium sized room.

Some have called Bryston dry, clinical, bright, warm, dull, and everything else in the book. They're correct in a way. Bryston will amplify exactly what its given. I haven't heard the Benchmark, so I can't comment on it. I've read a bunch about it though. Its sounds like what Bryston is all about. Will it be too much of a good thing? Not sure. If you're looking for something to warm it up, smooth it over, make it fuller, you're not going to get it with anything Bryston. That's a double edged sword some times. However, I have heard a ton of Bryston amplification, and I think the B60 is the sweetest sounding of the bunch. Not overly so though.

I can say that it sounds awesome with the Apollo. It gets every last bit of what the Apollo offers. A better source will be better. I'm currently saving up for a Bryston BDA-1 DAC.

I'm curious about the Benchmark. How does it compare to the Apollo's analog output?

geowak · « **Reply #22 on:** 5 Dec 2008, 12:15 pm »

imperial- Thanks for the tips on the mod. But quite honestly, I do not want to mod equipment. I want a piece that is made the way the company intends it to be made. I am sure NAD knows about this, why don't they just make it original factory this way? It seems like an inexpensive way to get better sound from the amps??? Nonetheless thanks for the heads up.

stu- The Benchmark is the newer version USBDAC1 not the DACpre. When you have cans on, it really reveals the music. I spent alot of time comparing the Apollo, the Benchmark with the Apollo, the Cambridge Audio 640c v2 and the Cambridge with the Benchmark. This was in home for about two weeks. Here is how they rated (IMHO)

1 Apollo with Benchmark USBDAC1
2 Apollo stand alone (with internal Wolson DAC)
3 Cambridge Audio 640c v2 (with two internal wolfson DAC) with Benchmark
4 Camdridge Audio 640c v2 (with two internal wolfson DAC) stand alone

The Apollo with the Benchmark was better by a slim margin because you could hear more.
#2 and #3 very very close, not even worth mentioning really
I could easily live with the CA 640c, but the Apollo with Benchmark just edged it out.

Why? Better resolution, cleaner, smoother and also if the Benchmark gets tiring or craps out-
the Apollo alone sounds great. I like the simplicity of the top loading system, the buffer that allows
a more accurate reading of the CD, and the wolfson dac. You could say I have an expensive transport that allows my external DAC to shine.

Listening done with an Odyssey Stratos, Candela Preamp (tubed) and Snell E-5 floorstanders

geowak · « **Reply #23 on:** 5 Dec 2008, 12:17 pm »

Stu- BTW you have me very interested in the Bryston. It sounds very nice.

geowak · « **Reply #24 on:** 8 Dec 2008, 11:35 pm »

This is a bump

Thanks for all the input..again. Here ia a recap of the components recommended and listed-

NAD C372 integrated Amplifier
Bel Canto e.One S300iu integrated amplifier or Bel Canto S300i
Jolida 301
NAD C315BEE or NAD C325BEE
Cayin tube integrated
Bel Canto eVo2i or Bel Canto S-300
Naim Nait 5i
Marantz PM11S1
Electrocompaniet ECI-4
New Creek
Simaudio i3 or i5 (Moon series)
Rega Mira 3
Plinius
Exposure
Classe
Manley Stingray
Bryston B60 or Bryston B100
YBA DT integrated
PS Audio Trio Integrated
NAD M3 integrated
Vincent Hybrids
Rega Mira
Red Wine Audio Signature 30.2.
Antique Sound Labs AQ-1001DT
Prima Luna Prologue One
Eastern Electric Minimax.
NAD C 375BEE or NAD C 275BEE

Also PS Audio and Musical Fidelity were mentioned.

Right now I am leaning toward the elimination of a preamp and just getting an AMP
and using my Benchmark DACUSB1 as a preamp. I have an optical switch to flip between my Slimdevices Squeezebox and my Rega Apollo CD player as source. Therefore I do not need all the inputs of a typical preamp. Also the Benchmark has an excellant headphone amp.

I have looked at them all, a few I have had a listen (NAD, Marantz, Rega) Can anyone second a choice above with comments or suggest a comparable amp. Looking to purchase in the next couple weeks.

Thanks,
again here is my budget and consideratiions

Budget is $1000 to $2000. Here is some info about what I am interested in-

1 Enough power for a medium size room- with no audible amp strain
2 LOW NOISE unit
3 Good tonal balance and a can produce low, mid and high frequencies without bloom, harshness and with smooth midrange.
4 Neutral in presentation of the music (not warm or otherwise adding it’s own sonic signature)
5 Wide soundstage
6 Dynamics, microdynamics and quick transient response
7 Great detail
8 Musical

mcullinan · « **Reply #25 on:** 9 Dec 2008, 12:21 am »

Quote from: geowak on 8 Dec 2008, 11:35 pm

This is a bump

Thanks for all the input..again. Here ia a recap of the components recommended and listed-

NAD C372 integrated Amplifier
Bel Canto e.One S300iu integrated amplifier or Bel Canto S300i
Jolida 301
NAD C315BEE or NAD C325BEE
Cayin tube integrated
Bel Canto eVo2i or Bel Canto S-300
Naim Nait 5i
Marantz PM11S1
Electrocompaniet ECI-4
New Creek
Simaudio i3 or i5 (Moon series)
Rega Mira 3
Plinius
Exposure
Classe
Manley Stingray
Bryston B60 or Bryston B100
YBA DT integrated
PS Audio Trio Integrated
NAD M3 integrated
Vincent Hybrids
Rega Mira
Red Wine Audio Signature 30.2.
Antique Sound Labs AQ-1001DT
Prima Luna Prologue One
Eastern Electric Minimax.
NAD C 375BEE or NAD C 275BEE

Also PS Audio and Musical Fidelity were mentioned.

Right now I am leaning toward the elimination of a preamp and just getting an AMP
and using my Benchmark DACUSB1 as a preamp. I have an optical switch to flip between my Slimdevices Squeezebox and my Rega Apollo CD player as source. Therefore I do not need all the inputs of a typical preamp. Also the Benchmark has an excellant headphone amp.

I have looked at them all, a few I have had a listen (NAD, Marantz, Rega) Can anyone second a choice above with comments or suggest a comparable amp. Looking to purchase in the next couple weeks.

Thanks,
again here is my budget and consideratiions

Budget is $1000 to $2000. Here is some info about what I am interested in-

1 Enough power for a medium size room- with no audible amp strain
2 LOW NOISE unit
3 Good tonal balance and a can produce low, mid and high frequencies without bloom, harshness and with smooth midrange.
4 Neutral in presentation of the music (not warm or otherwise adding it’s own sonic signature)
5 Wide soundstage
6 Dynamics, microdynamics and quick transient response
7 Great detail
8 Musical

That looks like every amp/preamp ever made... hehe. Now to narrow it down. I think you could pick up a pair of Nuforce 9 v2s for under 2k... Neutral, very dynamic, very quiet.. compared to non Class D amps and eerie inky black background. Musical too.
Mike

Quiet Earth · « **Reply #26 on:** 9 Dec 2008, 12:42 am »

Quote from: geowak on 8 Dec 2008, 11:35 pm

Right now I am leaning toward the elimination of a preamp and just getting an AMP
and using my Benchmark DACUSB1 as a preamp. I have an optical switch to flip between my Slimdevices Squeezebox and my Rega Apollo CD player as source. Therefore I do not need all the inputs of a typical preamp. Also the Benchmark has an excellant headphone amp.

A word of caution. The unbalanced (rca) outputs of my Benchmark DAC have a somewhat high output impedance of 1.25k ohms. This may be an issue if you are using long interconnects into a solid state amplifier of 25k ohms or less. Just something to consider.

You may have a newer and better version of the DAC-1 than mine, but check your manual for the output impedance of the unbalanced outputs if you plan on using them. (The balanced XLR outputs are typically very low output impedance, so there's no concern there going passive.) A good rule of thumb is : the input impedance of your amplifier should be 20 times the output impedance of whatever's driving it. So an amp with an imput impedance of at least 25K would be required for the benchmark DAC if the output impedance is 1.25K ohms.

Lot's of gain in the amplifier is also very helpful when going passive.

Keep those interconnects under a meter and a half if you can.

WGH · « **Reply #27 on:** 9 Dec 2008, 01:29 am »

Quote from: geowak on 8 Dec 2008, 11:35 pm

Right now I am leaning toward the elimination of a preamp and just getting an AMP...

again here is my budget and consideratiions

Budget is $1000 to $2000. Here is some info about what I am interested in-

1 Enough power for a medium size room- with no audible amp strain
2 LOW NOISE unit
3 Good tonal balance and a can produce low, mid and high frequencies without bloom, harshness and with smooth midrange.
4 Neutral in presentation of the music (not warm or otherwise adding it’s own sonic signature)
5 Wide soundstage
6 Dynamics, microdynamics and quick transient response
7 Great detail
8 Musical

Sounds like you just described a Van Alstine Insight amp.

Wayne

grsimmon · « **Reply #28 on:** 9 Dec 2008, 09:42 am »

"Right now I am leaning toward the elimination of a preamp and just getting an AMP
and using my Benchmark DACUSB1 as a preamp...I do not need all the inputs of a typical preamp."

This is what I do and I'm extremely happy with the results. I send the Benchmark directly to a Bryston 2B-LP (60 watts). My system is in close proximity to cable t.v., halogen lights, a printer, cable box, modem etc. I don't know for sure if any of that matters, but the system is dead quiet, I can turn the volume all the way up with a cd on pause and there is nothing, no hiss or noise. I suppose the Torus isn't hurting things either.

Quiet Earth · « **Reply #29 on:** 9 Dec 2008, 09:24 pm »

That's good to know grsimmon.

When I use to use my old dac-1 to drive active monitors, it always sounded better using the xlrs out of the dac and keeping it balanced. However, the input impedance of the active monitors that I was using was only 10K ohm unbalanced. That's very low.

BTW, I never had an issue with with noise going passive (quite the opposite!). It was more about drive and dynamics.

geowak · « **Reply #30 on:** 9 Dec 2008, 10:20 pm »

Quiet Earth-

Thanks for the heads up (tip) on the unbalanced connection impedance compatability.

I will use the unbalanced RCA connections. There are many good recommendations to go through
and I do not know if I could hear them all. I bought my two fav components sight unseen-The Benchmark DAC and the Apollo, so maybe it's not a huge issue.

mcgsxr · « **Reply #31 on:** 10 Dec 2008, 12:31 am »

I wonder if this baby would do the trick - I have never heard one, but I think the lonewolf has...

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=62526.msg562656;topicseen#new aa

JIMV · « **Reply #32 on:** 10 Dec 2008, 02:53 am »

Quote from: wilsynet on 4 Dec 2008, 09:27 pm

Quote from: geowak on 3 Dec 2008, 10:25 pm
NAD C372 integrated Amplifier
Bel Canto e.One S300iu integrated amplifier

I have owned the NAD C370BEE and the Bel Canto e.One S300iu. At the time my speakers were (and still are) the Zu Druids and I used the Benchmark DAC as source (since moved on to the Red Wine Isabellina). I believe the C370BEE is likely very similar to the C372.

The NAD is warmer, verging on dark. The Bel Canto is more neutral, bordering on clinical.

If you're looking for a solid state integrated in the less than $1000 price range, I have also owned the Rega Mira, and believe it is more neutral than the NAD, and more musical than the Bel Canto.

My all time favourite integrated amplifier, and the one I own today, is the Red Wine Audio Signature 30.2. It is dead quiet and when you hear it you will say to yourself "Ah. That's what Vinnie means when he says 'sonic purity'. I get it now". It can easily drive many speakers despite it's conservative 30wpc. There are a number of units on Audiogon right now, and also AC member IronLion is selling his here:

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=61359.0

If the 30.2 doesn't suit your needs, then I'd recommend a tube integrated. They are not all full of hum and buzz. For example, I owned the Antique Sound Labs AQ-1001DT and paired it with the very efficient Zu Druids and there was never any hum.

The Prima Luna Prologue One is very well regarded, as is the Eastern Electric Minimax.

I have a PrimaLuna dialog II and think it is the best sounding amp I have ever heard. It is dead silent in my system.

Mariusz · « **Reply #33 on:** 10 Dec 2008, 03:02 am »

I would recommend something ..........but I am not selling anything at the moment.

boead · « **Reply #34 on:** 10 Dec 2008, 04:05 am »

One of the only intergrated amp I'd consider is the
Rogue Tempest II like this one.
http://www.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?intatube&1232283964&/Rogue-Tempest-Upgraded-to-Temp

Great tube rolling fun with KT88's.
I've heard their 90wpc amps and they are very good.
Excellent irons too.

Its a no brain-er!

AudioSoul · « **Reply #35 on:** 10 Dec 2008, 11:54 pm »

Dynamics, microdynamics, quick transient response, great detail and musical
and you are using Itunes and a squeez box. What you need is a $100.00 reciever.......

chadh · « **Reply #36 on:** 11 Dec 2008, 02:22 am »

Every time I see this thread listed on the main Audiocircle page, I wonder why someone would be asking for help in choosing an audiophile dude. Then I think, "What a crazy request. Double blind testing shows that all audiophile dudes sound the same."

Chad

nathanm · « **Reply #37 on:** 11 Dec 2008, 09:01 pm »

Well you know, it is a hard decision, they are all so charming and handsome. If I were geowak I would consider MarkC, he's got the nads!

Bob in St. Louis · « **Reply #38 on:** 11 Dec 2008, 09:25 pm »

Good catch Chad! I didn't see that.

Bob

nathanm · « **Reply #39 on:** 11 Dec 2008, 09:27 pm »

Hey, I caught it on the first page!