[Rocket]

Hi Guys,

I thought I'd commence a thread about the advantages of purchasing secondhand equipment

I earn an average wage but I am lucky enough to squirrel a few dollars away every pay to help with my addiction.  I've spent a bucketload of money over the years in the search of the perfect amplifier and speakers.  Currently at home I have a pair of nuforce s9 speakers; salk sound ht2's; 2 x N.E.W. 20.1's, Son of Ampzilla; Ps Audio hca-2; N.E.W dc066; N.E.W. p3 and bel canto pre 1.  I know that I'm sick but I just can't seem to part with my equipment  .

I recently bought a mint condition bel canto pre1 for $550US.  Over the past six months I've been able to buy a pair of N.E.W. 20.1's which I use monoblocked and my latest addition a bel canto pre1.

This awesome combination provides a great deal of musical satisfaction and cost me the sum price of $2000au.  Which is about $1500US.



What do you guys think about secondhand equipment.  I've learnt from experience its not worth buying from audiogon due to the hassles of shipping and the voltage differences between the US and Australia.

Btw I may be able to buy a bel canto dac 2 for $600au which may be my next purchase.

Regards

Rod

[BrianP]

I've bought almost all my gear second hand, but from a reputable dealer who is also a licensed service tech for all the brands he sells. He won't put anything out for sale that hasn't been on the test bench and checked out thoroughly. And if something DOES go wrong after a few years, I can take it back to him for service (his rates are quite reasonable).

You can save $$$ by purchasing used, but be sure of your source. Buying from total strangers off e-Bay or Craig's list can be risky.

[mjosef]

Without the used market, I wouldn't have been able to afford the system I have...I bought my cd players, tube amp and Grover ICs new , everything else was bought used. Long live the used market!

[jimdgoulding]

Yep.  Me, too.  Bought a Bel Canto DAC2 online.  Bought my British speaks from a dealer friend who was discontinuing carrying the brand and traded in several items straight up to another dealer for my Acoustat Three's.  Bought my ARC line stage thru a dealer who had a customer trading up for a more expensive model.  Remember a post by Topround about a dealer discontinuing his Green Mountian Audio line.  Been good to me!

[Mister Pig]

The used market has been quite good to me. My current system contains several pieces that were sourced from Audiogon; and so far almost every transaction has been a success. Only once did I almost get stiffed, and there have been a handful of minor shipping issues. The used market has allowed me to own gear that would normally be out of my reach.

Pieces in current system that came from the used market are:

Jeff Rowland Consummate pre-amp
Jeff Rowland Model 5 amplifier
Mordaunt Short Performance 880 speakers
JVC-XL-Z1050TN CDP
Nikko Gamma I tuner

I have bought and sold a nice stable of used gear over the net too. Includes product from Quicksilver, Well Tempered, Electra-Print, Art Audio, Cabasse, Tara Labs, GR Research, AES, Audio Innovations, Acoustat, Snell, Eminent Technology, Koetsu, Dynavector, VPI...and a few others that escape me.

All in all the used market has been good to me.

Regards
Mister Pig

[doug s.]

buying used is good, not only because you can afford gear you otherwise might not be able to afford, but it allows you to demo in-home, w/o risking taking a financial bath if something is not to your liking.  and, it allows you to do a-b comparisons in-home as well.  nothing better than being able to hear stuff in your own listening room.   

doug s.

[Rocket]

Hi,

I had some issues with an audiogon transaction that presented the amps as NOS, unfortunately they weren't.  However I bought the amps at a pretty good price and I'm happy with them.  

My main problem that I now face is I have enough equipment for a second system.  I find it hard to let go of gear that I purchased that cost me $1000's of dollars.

If I lived in the US I'd be in serious trouble.  I've been eyeing off a pair of nuforce s9's that are selling on audiogon for $1950US.  Shipping costs and with the weak aussie is a deal killer at the moment.

Regards

Rod

[gsm18439]

I own a combination of new and used equipment in my primary system - new Zu Definition 2 speakers, new Ancient Audio Lektor Prime CD, and used Yamamoto A-08s amplifier - and completely used equipment in my two secondary bedroom systems: (1) Celestion SL700 speakers and Audio Refinement CDP, amplifier, and tuner and (2) Rogers LS 3/5a speakers and Linn Klout amplifier and Genki CDP. I also bought my girlfriend's system on Audiogon. I never had any problem with any transaction; all used equipment was purchased on Audiogon, and I have also sold some equipment - again without difficulty. Two advantages not mentioned are (1) the ability to obtain classic equipment no longer available - eg., the Celestion SL700s or the Spica TC50s that I bought for my girlfriend and (2) the ability to get equipment that, otherwise, might take months to obtain - eg., the Yamamoto amplifier. While the prices are better than buying new, the resale value is also not that great. Surfing Audiogon, some used equipment seems to see instantaneously - eg., the Yamamoto amp. Others seem to languish and be hard to sell - eg., an EAR Acute CDP that took me months to sell.

[timind]

buying used is good, not only because you can afford gear you otherwise might not be able to afford, but it allows you to demo in-home, w/o risking taking a financial bath if something is not to your liking.  and, it allows you to do a-b comparisons in-home as well.  nothing better than being able to hear stuff in your own listening room.   

doug s.

In home demo is exactly what I use Audiogon for. Buying used opens the market up to brands that I never would have considered either because of price or availability.
It's great for electronics as transporting them to and through UPS isn't all that dangerous. Floorstand speakers is a different story. I purchased a pair of Eminent Technology LFT-8s that cost me a two hour drive only to realize very quickly they weren't for me. I had a heck of a time selling them locally.

[denjo]

Although I can see and appreciate the advantages of buying secondhand, its never the same as buying brand new. The pride and sense of 1st ownership can sometimes be exhiralating - unpacking the box and tearing the shrinkwraps, appreciating how beautifully the items are packed, brochures that have never been thumbed or bent backwards! Sheer joy!

Placing the item on the rack and powering it for the first time since the unit was at the factory! Realising that it will usually sound better with time. The anticipation and expectation of a brand new unit is not quite the same with a secondhand item! With secondhands, one tends to be on red alert for flaws and faults. With brand new items, the presumption is they SHOULD work well with no flaws or faults, and the eye is intent on beholding the beauty instead!

Best regards
Dennis

[Wayner]

I have bought several pieces used (electronics and speakers), collecting a complete vintage Dynaco system with a PAT-4 preamp, FM-5 tuner, 120 power amp and A25XL speakers. Due to the nature of most Dynacos, they were generally offered as kits and I had small problems with each of the pieces. All were easily fixed with a soldering iron when discovered (loose wires). The speakers had a terminal problem but with a handful of small inexpensive parts, they were fixed as well. Many older brands of speakers have rotten surrounds, old cross-over caps and stuff like that that need to be considered. Also was the stuff beat to shit by the previous owner.

I certainly would have never been able to get these pieces without buying used. I had this system when I was a kid and thought It would be fun to have it back again. And while there have been advancements in electronics, these old systems are fun to listen to occasionally.

I guess when you start buying older stuff, you have to ask yourself a few questions. Are you capable of fixing small problems? Will the fun of ownership fade away in a short time? Are the board level components old (old caps usually start changing value)? Are they just little fire hazards waiting to burst into flames?

I guess if your buying something that's 5 years old or less, that shouldn't be a problem, but many of us are going for nostalgia. I think things like CD players (especially changers) would be off my list as I've seen many with all kinds of problems and you can buy a new player for a reasonable amount, with improved DACs.

Just a few of my experiences.

Wayner

[richidoo]

I buy most of my stuff new from the local dealers, either brand new or well used demo (with new warrantee.) They offer enough great deals to keep my curiousity for new equipment satisfied. I value having local dealers so I try to buy from them, but I'm cheap so I don't know how much good it does?
Rich

[jkelly]

I buy most of my music second hand from Amazon.  I usually buy "Like New".
Works fine since I rip to FLAC for the SB2.

[Wind Chaser]

buying used is good, not only because you can afford gear you otherwise might not be able to afford, but it allows you to demo in-home, w/o risking taking a financial bath if something is not to your liking.  and, it allows you to do a-b comparisons in-home as well.  nothing better than being able to hear stuff in your own listening room.   

doug s.

I find the opposite to be true.  When I buy new from a "local" dealer, I always take a demo unit home and listen to it in my system.  When I buy used through the internet, (Agon, X-sell, etc) I don't know for sure what I'm getting until I've got it and have already paid for it.

In addition the price / depreciation, one of the best advantages of buying used is the gear is already broken in.

[doug s.]

Although I can see and appreciate the advantages of buying secondhand, its never the same as buying brand new. The pride and sense of 1st ownership can sometimes be exhiralating - unpacking the box and tearing the shrinkwraps, appreciating how beautifully the items are packed, brochures that have never been thumbed or bent backwards! Sheer joy!

Placing the item on the rack and powering it for the first time since the unit was at the factory! Realising that it will usually sound better with time. The anticipation and expectation of a brand new unit is not quite the same with a secondhand item! With secondhands, one tends to be on red alert for flaws and faults. With brand new items, the presumption is they SHOULD work well with no flaws or faults, and the eye is intent on beholding the beauty instead!

Best regards
Dennis

funny, on the occasions i have bought brand-new, i have never experienced this exhilaration. if anything, i get more exhilaration w/a used piece, especially if it's wintage, or known to be a super component.  like when i first got my oracle delphi turntable.  it was almost twenty years old, and it was exactly like the one i saw when they first came out.  i was stoked!     i guess i get more exhilarated about the quality of whatever it is i am now trying, as opposed to whether or not it's new.  but, as always...

...ymmv,

doug s.

[doug s.]

buying used is good, not only because you can afford gear you otherwise might not be able to afford, but it allows you to demo in-home, w/o risking taking a financial bath if something is not to your liking.  and, it allows you to do a-b comparisons in-home as well.  nothing better than being able to hear stuff in your own listening room.   

doug s.

I find the opposite to be true.  When I buy new from a "local" dealer, I always take a demo unit home and listen to it in my system.  When I buy used through the internet, (Agon, X-sell, etc) I don't know for sure what I'm getting until I've got it and have already paid for it.

In addition the price / depreciation, one of the best advantages of buying used is the gear is already broken in.

it's certainly true that if you have a dealer in your area that has something you want, and that you can afford to buy new, you have the opportunity to demo.  and, that buying used means you may never have heard it.  but, buying used opens up your choices dramatically.  and, a prudent shopper can buy used and not worry as much about whether or not they will like it, as they can compare at leisure at home, and simply re-sell w/o losing much money, if any.

and, sometimes it may take a couple of months or six, to realize what you bought is or is not what you wanted; if you bought new from your dealer after demo of a week or two, and then you realize down the road you aren't as happy as you were at first, (mebbe the "rush" of the new stuff, like denjo describes, wore off?), then, you are faced w/the realization that you either sell for a big financial hit, or "live with it"...

doug s.

[jimdgoulding]

I don't need for something to be new to get exhilaration, personally, at all.  Something like a TV, that's different.  Or shoes, you know.   But you can only buy discontinued or vintage items used.  And like Windchaser says, a relationship with a local dealer can be invaluable.  I was able to get first crack at those things I mentioned and have had a half dozen or so speakers at home for weekend auditions.  Heck, the hunt and the deal are part of the fun.  No?

[Bemopti123]

Second hand, ahhhhggggg.  It is to be able to afford things that are reviewed in big magazines, but become incredibly affordable, I guess the term affordable is something that other non audio people would call ridiculous anyway.  My main system components, ALL have been bought either used or demos, from stores in the US or overseas as far away as Spain.  Some of the things that I bought new but at affordable prices in comparison to US stores, Denon phono cartridges from Japanese sellers on Ebay. 

When I mean second hand, sometimes I might have purchased brand new products but at second hand outlets such as Audiogon. 

The only unpleasant things that I have experienced while shopping used are less than honest sellers who claim that their goods are rated 8-9, but should clearly be 6 or less.  Asides from this, I have not had losses or UPS disasters so far. 

The dark side of second hand buying, is that you convince yourself that that piece in Gon or elsewhere is worth it or is necessary, while honestly you either do not need it or can afford it.  Long live second hand audio.

[Whitese]

I dont think I ever bought a new piece of gear, except for my VPI Scout (bday gift from the wife). But given that I am into vintage, NOS would be a super fortune if ever found, so used is good...You just have to know who to buy from.

[Rocket]

Hi,

In my case it was a pretty easy decision.  I've known the seller for over 10 years and I know how well he keeps his gear.  Whilst the bel canto pre1 is about 7 years old it performs really well.  At $550US it was a pretty good pick.

I've spent a helluva lot more than that and been really disappointed.

Regards

Rod