[jk@home]

I am using a VDA2 dac and VPC1 passive pre to an Aragon 8002 amp, with minimum cabling (8" and 18").

For giggles and kicks, I would like to try a Yaqin tube buffer in the system. Without going into the whys or whynots, would it be better to place the tube buffer before or after the passive pre?

One advantage I see with placing it before the VPC1 would be, with the extra I/Os on the CI units, and cabling, I could switch the buffer in and out of the system.

Has anyone else tried this?

[doug s.]

i would use it between pre and amp - get it closest to the speakers.  but you could always try it in both places.

doug s.

[Russtafarian]

Don't most preamps put the buffer/gain stage after the volume pot?

[jk@home]

I would think the best place would be after the preamp, maybe help with any input impedance issues with the Aragon caused by different settings of the passive pre?

[stereocilia]

Personally I liked it best between the cd player and the pre, but YMMV as they say.  Honestly, in my system I thought it sounded different but neither better nor worse, so I'm not using it.   PM me if you want to buy mine by the way.  I boxed it up and never bothered to post a for sale ad.

[S Clark]

I tried one between my cdp and my pre.  Definite differences.  It seems that in my system, adding the buffer deepened and maybe tightened the bass a bit, but also it had a loss in the upper mids.  I don't use it.

[jk@home]

Personally I liked it best between the cd player and the pre, but YMMV as they say.  Honestly, in my system I thought it sounded different but neither better nor worse, so I'm not using it.   PM me if you want to buy mine by the way.  I boxed it up and never bothered to post a for sale ad.

I just bought one used, off the Gon, haven't gotten it yet though. I also have one of the old MF X10D tube buffers, in the cylinder chassis. Used it for a while, in a different system. Plus and minuses there too, now in the closet.

The Yaqin is said to be improved with tube rolling, something I never tried with the Musical Fidelity unit. Since the Yakin's tubes are exposed, it should be no big deal to do so.

Since I bought both the CI VPC1 and this unit used, basically what I am doing is ending up with a poor man's tube preamp

[stereocilia]

I didn't do any tube rolling...I think you've inspired me.

[doug s.]

i have two ase z-man buffers (nla), and a kailin mu-1.  (dunno what happened to kailin, did they drop off the planet?)     i have heard the mf x10d.  i think the z-man buffers are the most neutral.  the kailin is the tiniest bit warmer, but still wery neutral.  the x10d seemed the most coloured.  i rolled tubes in the kailin and the z-man - the kailin two uses matsushita 12ax7's, which are japan-made mullards.  i have a mullard 12ax7 in one z-man; the other has a cryo'd tungsram.  all better than the sovteks, which came in the z-man, & some cheap chinese stuff in the kailin.  i never tried other tubes.  the x10d wasn't mine; i have no idea what tubes were in it...

i presently use the kailin from the outputs of my modded art di/o dac.  it would be fine w/o it, to be honest, but i have it, so i am using it.  it doesn't do anything bad, and does add a tiny bit of warmth.  it has a bypass, so i can run it both ways.  one z-man goes from the hi-pass out of my deqx to the almarro amp driving the fostex fe206e's in my oris 150 horns.  i have never tried it w/o the z-man in place - i hooked it up when i got the deqx - it yust seemed like the right thing to do, considering the deqx is a digital dsp.  the other z-man is hooked up to the outs of my sony xdr-f1-hd tuna - it is absolutely essential here - the xdr becomes extremely fatiguing to listen to, after a while, even when it is broadcasting analog fm.  i used to use one on my s/s analog tunas - again, not essential, but it does add a tiny bit of warmth, w/o any veiling or coloration, so why not.  hmmm - mebe i need to get another one...   

yes, even w/tube amps, and a tube preamp, i find tube buffers to be a worthwhile tweak, w/solid-state & digital sources.  if i had a solid state amp and/or preamp, i would stick one between those...

doug s.

[jk@home]

Right now I am using a Behringer DEQ2496 eq, digitally before the VDA2, I really don't need tubes for tone control. But I do remember the MF buffer also affecting the soundstage, so worth a try.

Also, before I picked up my new CI VDA2, I was using the Behringer's built in DAC which I think outputted more voltage than the new dac does. So the tube buffer might make a difference there also.

FWIW, the Grant Fidelity B-283 tube buffer is a rebadged Yaqin unit, so anyone looking for tube rolling ideas can google that unit also.

[jk@home]

Well, got the Yaqin yesterday, been playing around with it.

First of all, I'm getting a MUCH better S/N ratio with it between the DAC and passive pre, Vs the pre and power amp. This may be dependent on my system, for whatever reason.

Second, while A/B-ing in the above setup, found that the left and right channels are switched by the unit (mis-wired?). Fixable by a cable swap ( I may go inside the box later to check it out).

Sonically, there's a slight tonal difference, and the soundstage seems to back off some. But really not night and day / better or worse.

So I think I will keep it like this for a while, switchable for optional use. Roll some different tubes that will improve selected music that can get "irritating". BTW, got the silver front plate and tranny cover version, matches nicely with my older brushed aluminum SB3 and the CI gear.

[stereocilia]

...
First of all, I'm getting a MUCH better S/N ratio with it between the DAC and passive pre, Vs the pre and power amp. This may be dependent on my system, for whatever reason.
...

That makes sense to me, and it was my experience, too.

When I think about it, the signal level going into the buffer after the preamp will be much lower than the signal from the DAC.  So, if the buffer has a fixed noise floor then the signal coming out of the pre will be much closer to it.  Happy rolling.

[el84bill]

Funny finding this here in the CI forum...I just bought the Channel Islands VMB1s that were for sale here and was looking for discussion on them.
Back to the Yaqin...I have one and you know it ain't bad...I use it as a buffer for my CDP player and there is a noticeable improvement in the sound-stage with it on and running.  I am running a Matched Pair of Mullard EF95 6AK5 in her as opposed to the stock tubes which I never installed.  All in all I am pretty happy with the little bugger....

[jk@home]

Well, I posted it here, wondering how it would relate/interact with to the two CI components I had. But yeah, really nothing to do with CI per say.

 

[HerculePirate]

Hi

I was going through your article on Tube buffers.
My equipment is as follows:
Slim Devices SB3
Tact 2.0S as Pre and DAC
Acoustic Reality eAR1001 Ref
Salk Sound HT3

I am looking for some tube warmth in my set up...
would you recommend the Tube buffer...if so which one...
Is there any buffer with a balanced in and out since I am planning to use the Balanced cables from Pre to POwer
PLease advise
Regards

HP

[jk@home]

Right now, I have replaced the Aragon SS amp with a Bottlehead S.E.X. tube intergrated unit, so the tube buffer is not needed/used.

IMO, I don't think an inexpensive tube buffer would "improve" your system, appears pretty nice.