Need help of buying digital SLR camera

tanchiro58 · « **Reply #20 on:** 20 Aug 2008, 06:45 am »

Quote

A final point is that sometimes motion blur can be effective in action shots, you don't always want to completely "freeze" the action.

JohnR,

That is a problem I always got like in these pics:

Tan

JohnR · « **Reply #21 on:** 20 Aug 2008, 08:52 am »

Heh, that sure looks uncomfortable

Anyway, these shots look like they were taken with a fairly wide angle, and therefore from fairly close up - the EXIF confirms this, it says 7.3 mm which is full wide (36mm equiv) on that camera. At this point, long glass doesn't seem to be needed. I'm not sure why you're getting blur there (assuming you are not on other shots) but it seems to me that you would get a lot of mileage from pretty much any of the consumer DSLRs. But since I'm a Nikon guy I would suggest looking into either the D40 or D60 with the single kit lens... I've had great success with my D40, have no hands-on experience with the D60 but from reading the reviews am willing to suggest it as an option anyway. Key differences:

D40:
- Lower noise
- Cheaper (but not by much any more, $150 difference at bhphotovideo.com)
- Smaller files
- A little faster in many operations

D60:
- More megapixels
- Kit lens has VR (vibration reduction)
- Sensor cleaning built in
- Slightly faster continuous mode (3.0 vs 2.6 fps)
- Higher dynamic range (can be important for digital)
- Newer model

I was about to suggest additional items like a tele lens and flash, but actually I think that starting with the single-lens kit is the best option. Buy more stuff once you know where the limitations of the basic kit are for you. (For example, you might decide that a faster lens is preferable to a longer lens, for what you want to do.)

BTW I have nothing against other brands but have little experience with them. I will let others make specific recommendations there.

JohnR

ooheadsoo · « **Reply #22 on:** 20 Aug 2008, 01:39 pm »

I don't really see the blur. It looks like the flash fired - if you actually want blur, you'll probably have to shoot without the flash and practice getting the right shutter speed and any panning you might need to do. Moving away and using telephoto should help keeping the more stationary parts of the body sharp, i think.

Randy · « **Reply #23 on:** 20 Aug 2008, 02:54 pm »

I made my move yesterday and ordered a D - 60. I have a question. These new cameras have the built in flash. How good are they? Do many people go ahead and get a separate unit as well? Another thing, do you need a skylight filter with these cameras? (I must sound like the beginner I am.)

low.pfile · « **Reply #24 on:** 20 Aug 2008, 03:50 pm »

Randy,

Need a filter?....No.

Should have a filter on your lens? Yes.

The filter is insurance. Whack your lens against a fence and loose a $500 lens. The $50 filter is there to save the lens glass. Won't cushion the whole lens a major fall. Some pro lens can't accept filters.

Have fun with the D60!

low.pfile · « **Reply #25 on:** 20 Aug 2008, 04:05 pm »

Tan,
One way to improve the pics of your kid is to get the school to buy mats that are not the same color as the uniforms!!

Your image should improve with a DSLR. I agree with johnR: the kit zoom lens (included in certain camera packages) would suffice.

I'd suggest zooming in so that the subjects fill 3/4 of your frame (you are about 1/4 in the shots you posted above). Also taking the pic from a lower angle will create a dynamic visual image.

I am not a fan of using flashes I am a huge fan of available light. But sometimes it is so dark you need light. So I use a flash but turn down the power quite a bit. With practice you can get motion blurr and a clear main image too. That would be cool for martial arts. http://digital-photography-school.com/blog/slow-sync-flash/

Randy · « **Reply #26 on:** 20 Aug 2008, 04:48 pm »

Thanks, LowProfile. (Interesting handle.) Thanks for reminding me the protective qualities of a skylight or UV filter. I have banged up a lot of them in my time, so should have thought of that. Thanks again.

nathanm · « **Reply #27 on:** 20 Aug 2008, 04:57 pm »

Make sure your filter is not loose or you could lose it.

tanchiro58 · « **Reply #28 on:** 20 Aug 2008, 11:36 pm »

Hello,

I got two choices to buy either Nikon D60 (new) and the popular D40 (cheaper) which fit my budget for now and read the reviews and specs although I do not quite understand some of the technology terms in photography.

Most of you have own both. Therefore, I need your opinions and/or suggestions.

Many thanks,
Tan

JohnR · « **Reply #29 on:** 22 Aug 2008, 12:49 pm »

I don't think there will be many who have owned both. I meant to drop by a camera store and try a D60 so I could offer some opinions on this choice but just haven't had time... I posted a list of differences above - one thing to consider is that the kit lens with the D60 is supposed to be a little better than the earlier version that comes with the D40. Given what seems to be a relatively low price differential these days that would probably tip me over the edge in favor of the D60.... again this is just opinion based on what I've read.... Regardless you really need to get ahold of them and see if they even feel good to you.

BobM · « **Reply #30 on:** 22 Aug 2008, 02:00 pm »

The stock D40 kit lens leaves a bit to be desired. It's decent enough but feels fairly plastic and not as "industrial strength" as most Nikon lenses. That's one of the main reasons I skipped the kit and went with an upgraded tele lens for a wee bit more.

As far as a D40 over a D60, I really didn';t think I would need any of the extra features offered on the D60. My choice was more of a D40X over a D40, but then again I really didn't think the extra megapixels would make much (if any) difference for the kind of photography and prints I generally need. I'm not making posters after all, and I don't play with photoshop, enlarging and cropping and such.

Just a few other things to consider - are you paying for features and extra picture size that you really won't use or need?

Enjoy,
Bob

drphoto · « **Reply #31 on:** 22 Aug 2008, 09:48 pm »

If you're going to shoot action indoors, you might really need flash. (an add on speedlight, not the built in camera flash) The trick to making it look good is balancing the flash exposure w/ the ambient. As low.profile suggest, flash to freeze action combined w/ a slowish shutter to produce motion blurs can be effective. To work correctly, the camera needs to support 'rear curtain sync', which most modern DSLR's have. This means the flash fires just before the shutter closes. This makes the blur trails the subject. If the flash fires as soon as the shutter opens, the motion blur goes the wrong way. Also, motion blurs only show up well if the background is fairly dark.

Experiment w/ bouncing the flash off the ceiling to get less of a 'flash' look. Good speedlights all have tiltable heads. You also might want to get an extension cable and have a helper hold the flash off to one side to get a nicer lighting effect. About 45º is a good starting point. Unfortunately, flash extension cables are somewhat expensive.

We've had good luck w/ the off camera flash described above, with the flash fired through a small softbox (16"x22") I just have the helper hold the flash and box by hand. A small Lighdome brand box goes for about $70, I think.

The purpose of bouncing or using softboxes is to make the light source bigger which makes the light 'softer' or really....less contrasty. The problem w/ on camera flashes is that they are point sources, which means they produce really hard edge, dark shadows, which is usually not what you want.

I also agree w/ the poster (sorry, don't remember who it was) who suggested you stage the photos. Try to set it up so you have a cleaner background for one. Direct your subjects into an interesting pose perhaps.

Oh, one other thing, if you can afford 'fast' lenses, you not only get more light gathering capability, you get better quality, especially wide open sharpness. (most slow lenses are not tack sharp wide open)

Randy · « **Reply #32 on:** 22 Aug 2008, 10:49 pm »

I am going to London in Sept. and plan on taking a lot of cathedral interiors (shots of ceilings which can be up to 100 feet away or more for instance) with the D-60. Will the built-in flash be adequate or will i need a speedlight? I guess the question is, what's the range of the built-in flash? I have taken cathedral interiors with my old FM (all manual) in France that turned out beautifully, also some time exposures. How well does the stock 18-55 mm work with these kinds of shots or do I need another faster lens?. Any suggestions welcome.

tanchiro58 · « **Reply #33 on:** 22 Aug 2008, 10:56 pm »

Quote

Oh, one other thing, if you can afford 'fast' lenses, you not only get more light gathering capability, you get better quality, especially wide open sharpness. (most slow lenses are not tack sharp wide open)

Drphoto,

What the model of lenses are the fast lenses from Nikon if you do not need Flash when taking pictures indoor with neon tube lights (kind of enough light since they are electronic neon tubes? Thanks.

Tan

drphoto · « **Reply #34 on:** 23 Aug 2008, 12:39 am »

Tan, anything that is f2.8 or better is pretty much considered a fast lens. Since you can get close, and don't need a telephoto lens, you could probably get by w/ a 50mm f1.8 which is pretty cheap, a little over $100 new.

Honestly, I think the first thing you need to do to improve you images is getting a cleaner backgrond. All that stuff behind the subjects is distracting. I agree w/ the poster who mentioned shooting from a low angle to make the subjects seem more dynamic, but you get that ugly ceiling in the shot.

Most great picture are captured as they happen, however other are 'made'. I come from the latter camp. I set up and control the situation. But I do advertising photography, not sports, journalism, or 'art'.

So, if I were you, I'd try to get the subject in front of a clean background (ie: wall) and both shoot it live and then try posing them a bit.

low.pfile · « **Reply #35 on:** 23 Aug 2008, 01:00 am »

Agree with Dr photo The nikon 50mm 1.8 is a steal! And also a very good point about images that are 'made'

Don't let this lens mislead you that fast lenses are available at good prices. Usually lenses at f/2.8 and faster (below 2.8 ) are several hundred to well over $1000US.

BTW, check out this thread.... http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=58840.0

ed

ooheadsoo · « **Reply #36 on:** 23 Aug 2008, 01:08 am »

If you stick with nikon and want the 50mm 1.8 with autofocus, you'll have to get something higher end than the D60. The D200 has come down in price considerably, especially used.

low.pfile · « **Reply #37 on:** 23 Aug 2008, 01:18 am »

Good catch ooheadsoo.

Tan
Both the D40 and D60 do not have an internal focus motor in the camera body so to get autofocusing, any lenses used must be the AF-S type. Though the included kit lenses with both of these cameras are AF-S type, which will perform the autofocusing. Therefore, using the nice n fast n cheap 50 f/1.8 with a D40/60 you would have to manually focus.

tanchiro58 · « **Reply #38 on:** 23 Aug 2008, 04:08 am »

Quote from: low.pfile on 23 Aug 2008, 01:18 am

Good catch ooheadsoo.

Tan
Both the D40 and D60 do not have an internal focus motor in the camera body so to get autofocusing, any lenses used must be the AF-S type. Though the included kit lenses with both of these cameras are AF-S type, which will perform the autofocusing. Therefore, using the nice n fast n cheap 50 f/1.8 with a D40/60 you would have to manually focus.

Thanks again for all your opinions and suggestions.

Unfortunately, instead of getting D40 or D60 I already got the old version D70S with a lens of 18-135mm/f3.5-5.6G AF-S DX ED IF... (with a good deal) since I like the bulky size of D70S and I do not need to upgrade in a short time. My next one would be much better than this after learning all your experiences and hand-ons (I guess it would be a Canon 20D or 40D).

Tan

low.pfile · « **Reply #39 on:** 23 Aug 2008, 04:44 am »

good choice tan.
yes the D40 is a bit small. some like it, some hate it. D70/80 are more standard size.
the cool thing is that the D70s will work with the autofocus on the 50mm 1.8 which is still recommended for low light.

if you want a good tutorial I recommend Thom http://www.bythom.com/d70guide.htm