[John Casler]

B, just posted me that the Ambiance Tweeters are "finally" shipping.

Problem was (delay) he had two bad box shipments, meaning the boxes were not acceptable for the purpose.

Also B's DSL line has been on the fritz for the last 10 days or so, so that is why you haven't seen him checking in much.

He had to post me from his daughter's dial up system, that she had reconfigured during the "fritz part".

So if you don't receive your "boxes" in the next week, post me.

B, expected his DSL to be back up by today

Oh and B, has also promised some pics.

[Early B.]

Very good! Looking forward to receiving mine soon.

I'll write a quick initial review of them once I get them set up.

[Mack]

Pictures would be good.  aa

[John Casler]

Pictures would be good.  aa

B has promised said pics soon.

[woodsyi]

Ambiance tweeters are up and running -- I got them stuck on the back of the speakers firing back.  And they are really stuck with strong tapes.  I was worried that they might come off at first but not any more.  They are completely hidden from any viewing angle except directly behind the speakers.   With my set up and room treatment, they seem to add a bit more energy in the highs with the decay lingering a tad longer.  It's a subtle difference.  I can actually tell a little more presence in the highs off axis more than from the sweet spot.  I took pictures and I will post them after dinner.  FYI, they have fine matte black finish -- not that I can see them once installed.

[Early B.]

Ambiance tweeters are up and running -- I got them stuck on the back of the speakers firing back.  And they are really stuck with strong tapes.  I was worried that they might come off at first but not any more.  They are completely hidden from any viewing angle except directly behind the speakers.   With my set up and room treatment, they seem to add a bit more energy in the highs with the decay lingering a tad longer.  It's a subtle difference.  I can actually tell a little more presence in the highs off axis more than from the sweet spot.  I took pictures and I will post them after dinner.  FYI, they have fine matte black finish -- not that I can see them once installed.

Very nice. Looking forward to the pics. Mine should be coming soon. In the meantime, I have a few questions:

What kind of speakers do you have?
How far are your speakers from the rear wall?
What kind of tape did you use to append them to the rear of your speaker?
Did you experiment with various placement options before you attached them?

Thanks.

[Early B.]

My ambience tweeters arrived today. Got them hooked up to my VMPS Tower IISE's. I took a few pics, but don't know how to attach them here.

I'll post my impressions later once I listen some more.

[Brian Cheney]

My DSL was just restored and I can now post and send pix.  The ambience tweeter is indeed housed in a plain satin black box (they ended up costing me $25 apiece!) and they do add to the soundstage very nicely.  It all depends on where you point them and how reflective your listening environment is.  All in all, money well spent IMHO.

[satfrat]

 I took pictures and I will post them after dinner. 

 

That's 1 mighty long dinner you're having there,,,, 

[woodsyi]

2 dinners 

[satfrat]

Thank you Woodsyi. 

[satfrat]

The "user adjustable" level control is a foam mask with which you can adjust the amount of tweeter output, or damp it out completely, by moving the mask.  This saves the expense of the Lpad, any sonic degradation it introduces, and about 3" of depth on the palm-sized enclosure.

What's actually involved here with this "mask adjustment"? It seems like removing the mask would increase the volume output, not dampen,,, but I'm sure I'm missing something here. I'd like to know ahead of time how I'll adjust the volume so to balance these tweeters out with my Lorelei's. I'm not really "getting it" from Woodsyi's pictures. Thank you.

Cheers,
Robin

[Brian Cheney]

The mask is a piece of 3/8" thick foam which can partially cover the diaphragm absorbing some of its output if desired.  The mask is self adhesive and is very similar to partly covering a speaker with your hand to make it softer.  Simple and effective.

[satfrat]

B, just posted me that the Ambiance Tweeters are "finally" shipping.

Problem was (delay) he had two bad box shipments, meaning the boxes were not acceptable for the purpose.

Also B's DSL line has been on the fritz for the last 10 days or so, so that is why you haven't seen him checking in much.

He had to post me from his daughter's dial up system, that she had reconfigured during the "fritz part".

So if you don't receive your "boxes" in the next week, post me.

B, expected his DSL to be back up by today

Oh and B, has also promised some pics.

Hey John,, you have a PM. Thanks.

Cheers,
Robin

[Early B.]

With my set up and room treatment, they seem to add a bit more energy in the highs with the decay lingering a tad longer.  It's a subtle difference.  I can actually tell a little more presence in the highs off axis more than from the sweet spot. 

This has been my experience, as well. There's a little more sizzle in the cymbals, and as the name implies, a bit of an ambient sound. It's a nice tweak. Of course, like most tweaks the difference is a subtle one, but I could tell the difference immediately. I currently have my ambience tweeters sitting on top of my speakers. It looks sort of "DIYish" for the AT's to be perched atop the speakers, but I may keep them there.

[Brian Cheney]

If that's where they do the most good, leave them there. 

[satfrat]

Well considering that they kick in at 5000hz, I'm hoping for more than just a little sizzle from a rear channel location.   I'm getting 3 for all 3 rear channel speakers and considering there's minimal sizzle info back there to begin with, I'm hoping for a fuller room presentation from them. If they act like my AV123 Extended response Tweeters on my front 3 speakers, then they won't be amounting to crap. But the ERT's kick in at 11000Hz and are extended out to 40000Hz. I'm hoping that these will present more information and will react like John Casler had mentioned in his very first post on this product. I will be finding out,,,,,  


Cheers,
Robin

[John Casler]

Well considering that they kick in at 5000hz, I'm hoping for more than just a little sizzle from a rear channel location.   I'm getting 3 for all 3 rear channel speakers and considering there's minimal sizzle info back there to begin with, I'm hoping for a fuller room presentation from them. If they act like my AV123 Extended response Tweeters on my front 3 speakers, then they won't be amounting to crap. But the ERT's kick in at 11000Hz and are extended out to 40000Hz. I'm hoping that these will present more information and will react like John Casler had mentioned in his very first post on this product. I will be finding out,,,,,  


Cheers,
Robin

Hi Robin,

Likely the extent to which the AT's will affect your sound will depend on several factors:

1) How reflective your room is
2) How big your room is and how near or farfield you sit
3) How good your high end hearing is
4) How well the efficiency of your mains matches the AT's
5) How much you damp them with the foam (if at all)
6) The positioning and firing of the AT's

In #6 I think some might fire them at rear or side walls, as well as at the ceiling.  Additonally the greatest SPL's would be had by firing them directly at you (which of course is also an option)

As such, Brian's primary design goal is to add "ambiance" and not necessarily supplement a main that might be lacking "highs", although using them in a front firing "direct" attitude might do just that, but only from 5Khz up.

[satfrat]

Well considering that they kick in at 5000hz, I'm hoping for more than just a little sizzle from a rear channel location.   I'm getting 3 for all 3 rear channel speakers and considering there's minimal sizzle info back there to begin with, I'm hoping for a fuller room presentation from them. If they act like my AV123 Extended response Tweeters on my front 3 speakers, then they won't be amounting to crap. But the ERT's kick in at 11000Hz and are extended out to 40000Hz. I'm hoping that these will present more information and will react like John Casler had mentioned in his very first post on this product. I will be finding out,,,,,  


Cheers,
Robin

Hi Robin,

Likely the extent to which the AT's will affect your sound will depend on several factors:

1) How reflective your room is
2) How big your room is and how near or farfield you sit
3) How good your high end hearing is
4) How well the efficiency of your mains matches the AT's
5) How much you damp them with the foam (if at all)
6) The positioning and firing of the AT's

In #6 I think some might fire them at rear or side walls, as well as at the ceiling.  Additonally the greatest SPL's would be had by firing them directly at you (which of course is also an option)

As such, Brian's primary design goal is to add "ambiance" and not necessarily supplement a main that might be lacking "highs", although using them in a front firing "direct" attitude might do just that, but only from 5Khz up.

From the first thread:

Also I feel that if you use it as a rear firing device that, depending on how far the speakers are from the walls, di or bi, might offer a better "open, airy" sonic.

This is the statement you made John that got me interested in them to begin this. You seemed convinced that these would make a positive impact in a home theater setup,,, I hope you are right. Ambiance is exactly why I bought these and the fact that they kick in @5Kz should have them doing just that. I will first try them on the inner most side of my rear side Lorlelei's and they will be partially pointing toward some ASC Cinema Panels that i have on my !/2 back wall(meaning I only have 3' of rear wall on each side of an opening to the dining room). I will try the tweeter pointing directly upward on my rear center Usher X-616. Because I have a 6' opening in the back of my room, the rear has always been lacking to some extent. I had much better results when i had bookshelves mounted on the rear walls up at the ceiling height but for music quality alone, I'd much rather have my floorstanding Lorelei's. 
I'm really not looking for a lot or expecting too much out of these,, which is why I ordered 3 instead of just 2. And I doubt I'll be wanting to mask them. I'm actually hoping they arrive with the maximum volume levels already established so I won't feel the need to mess with them. I'm hoping using all 3 back there, a little more ambiance will be exactly what I get. 

Cheers,
Robin

ps, I will also keep in minding having all 3 firing upward, which might just be the right thing to do and the first place to try for added ambiance. My room is only 11'wide with 7'h ceilings and I'm about 5' away from the rears in a 17' long room with my main Lorlei's about 7.5' in front of me 

[jonbee]

Since I seemed to have started this, I will add my 2c.
I have added this kind of device to many speakers over the years, to both monopolar dynamic spekaers and dipolar planars such as the Quad 63, and my take on them is similar to subs- if you can hear them in action, there's something wrong. They should always blend in seamlessly. If the main speaker is seriously deficient on top, or has a peaky top end, this will not fix it. Success is not readily predictable, for all the reasons John mentions. I've owned the AV123 ERT, and it is indeed very subtle, as the range is pretty narrow. I liked them with my Thiel 3.6s (facing forward as a supertweeter, not an ambience tweeter)  which rolled off from about 12k, but were very flat to that point. As the ribbon on the RM30 is very extended already, the ERT as a ST added more energy at the extreme top that was not needed. As an ambience tweeter I thought the ERT had too high a xover point, so I built my own which cuts in lower.
I haven't heard the VMPS tweeters, but a 5k 12 db xover seems about right. I'm using an 8 or 9 k 6 db xover on the domes I'm using, and that is pretty nice. Yes, I do hear more energy from the tweeters to the side, but when I disconnect them the soundstage overall does collapse somewhat from the front. There is a bit more top end energy overall, but not enough to call attention to itself, which is as it should be. Yes, there is a little more "sizzle" to cymbals, but in good balance. My tweeters are on the rear, but are angled upward by about 30 degrees, so there is some bounce off the ceiling. An upward tilt also increases the volume of the contribution somewhat. Experimentation, not theory, is needed to get the best effect in your situation.
I'm seriously considering buying the VMPS tweeters, as I know B has forgotten more about speaker design than I ever knew, and I like the looks of the tweeters.
They are also a great bargain for the price.