[Mister Pig]

Yet you take all that signal that's been painstakingly manipulated, and run it through a set of wires that sell for $300, or less. ..... There is a large opportunity for signal loss in these stages.

Actually, this is the traditional audio bias: associating dollars to better signal transmission. 

Blindly equating high price with increased performance is a fallacy. That's agreed. On the other hand, dismissing a product based on its cost(high or low) is just as narrow minded. Do you have the personal experience to validate your position? 

I never stated that position, so I don't have to validate it.  Perhaps you meant that note for someone else?  You agreed to the only point I was making. 

Blindly equating high price with increased performance is a fallacy. That's agreed. On the other hand, dismissing a product based on its cost(high or low) is just as narrow minded

The second sentence is equally important as the first. Please consider what it says.

There are several intertwining threads here, and the third and following sentences address the POV that "expensive cables" cannot sound better. Or improve the sound enough to justify the price.

From what I experience high quality cables provide a foundation for the system. What they accomplish cannot be duplicated by an equipment upgrade. I can understand if you doubt my position, and that's fine. But I suggest you take the effort to hear whats going on and bolster your position with experience. If you haven't done so already.

Regards
John Hoffman
Affordable Audio

p.s. The old saying of"you can't please all of the people all of the time" appears to hold true for this article. I think we are going to have to agree to disagree on this point. But all I am doing is relating what I experience. But you know, I spend my hard earned money on audio just like everyone else. Nobody gives me my equipment. Sure I get an industry accommodation price. But in the end, this was still a significant purchase. I voted with my dollars, and high quality cabling does make an audible difference.

[Affordable$$Audio]

Nick:
Thanks for responding.  One thing I have found over the years is that humans are creatures of habit when it comes to reading material.  Though their income may change they will trust and continue to read publications and reviewers they like.  

It took a great deal of thought to let John and Sean expand the price limits.  But I felt that as long as the vast majority of equipment reviews stayed in our wheelhouse, it would benefit both our reviewers and readers.  Why, because it lends perspective.

[nlange20]

Nick:
Thanks for responding.  One thing I have found over the years is that humans are creatures of habit when it comes to reading material.  Though their income may change they will trust and continue to read publications and reviewers they like.  

It took a great deal of thought to let John and Sean expand the price limits.  But I felt that as long as the vast majority of equipment reviews stayed in our wheelhouse, it would benefit both our reviewers and readers.  Why, because it lends perspective.

While I respect your response, I truly, truly hope you continue to write reviews/articles on truly "affordable" products to the "average"-joe. I really enjoy reading your publication, as do many others, but I thought I would just add my opinion. It doesn't hurt, right?







-Nick 

[BradJudy]

There are several intertwining threads here, and the third and following sentences address the POV that "expensive cables" cannot sound better. Or improve the sound enough to justify the price.

My point was only that there is an often blind following to more $$$=better performance in audio, a point which you agreed with.  I never said that it can't be true, I said it was the common bias in audio.  I don't know why you are try to impose a position onto me that I have not stated.

Nor do I understand why you are pushing on the issue of my experiences, since you don't know anything about them.  I hold the position (as some folks here and on other forums know) that I no longer publicly compare audio products, and I will hold that position here by not discussing any particular experiences I have had.  I will say that my experiences do not appear to match yours, so we can disagree on the importance of cabling. 

However, I will not have people putting words in my mouth, particularly in a written thread where it's clear what I have said. 

[Mister Pig]

Hi Brad/Judy

Yes we disagree on this subject. That's fine, cause audio is boring if everyone gathers around and tells each other how great they are.

However, I have not intentionally twisted your words. I have quoted your previous post so I can reference it while writing, but that's it. I have not lifted any sentence of yours from a paragraph and used it out of context. Snipping a sentence out to base a retort on is unseemly, in my opinion. The context of the rest of the paragraph is needed to fully develop the position of the writer.

It appears I am in the position of having to defend the validity of my choice of writing about some expensive cables. You have chosen to chime in on a public forum. If you had an issue with my choice, you were free to email me. Choosing to comment on another person writing about product(in a public forum) but saying that I refuse to discuss equipment publicly" is just a fence sitting position.

This appears to no longer to have anything to do with Affordable Audio, and this is my last post directed to what words I have supposedly tried to attribute to you. If you wish to continue this discussion please feel free to email me at johnhoffman@affordableaudio.org

Regards
John Hoffman

[saisunil]

I actually had skipped reading the $2k+ review on the first go, but then after some activity on this thread, I went back and read it. It is nicely written review.

Cheers

[BradJudy]

I certainly didn't mean to twist your words by being selective in my quote, I just meant to focus my response.  I actually didn't mean to be specific to cables at all and would prefer AA to stay in the under $1500 world for all of the items they review (speakers, amps, DACs, cables, etc).  To that end, my response probably would have been more clear if I had included your entire text. 

As for fence sitting, the beauty of not being in the publication business is that I have no obligations to say anything about any products.  Heck, I could have written my note directly to AA like a traditional reader would do.  The beauty of the forum is that I'm also put on the line and people get to decide for themselves if I'm some quack who should be ignored.  (I need some sort of duck emoticon)

FYI: I stopped making public comparisons because it caused too much strain on my friendships within the industry.  I'm happy for anyone who can publish good reviews and maintain both their friendships and sanity. 

BTW: I kept this response here because I'm bringing my focus back to the content of the AA publication. 

[Mister Pig]

Brad/Judy

I am glad we could have this conversation in a civilized manner. Disagreement does not have to be a bad thing. It keeps the hobby healthy, and peoples perspective in focus. After my last post, I was concerned that I stated my thoughts too strongly, for it is not my goal to browbeat anyone. Your perspective is equally valid. As far as I am aware Affordable Audio will be focused on components that can be obtained by the everyday audio enthusiast. Although what the limits are for an "audio nut" are open to interpretation.

Regards
John Hoffman
Affordable Audio

[satfrat]

I for you enjoyed your article on "high end" audio which is the reason I post here and not in a midfi forum like Audioholics,,, the home of the naysayer. And that's not to say Audioholics or midfi is a bad thing either as I've spent the majority of my life enjoying audio from that exact platform.  But at the end of my lifespan I want more from my audio experience, to expose myself to what high end audio truely is and what can be if you're willing to spend the extra for that little bit extra performance.

I understand what the "average joe" is saying, i wouldn't have $50000 on credit cards if I weren't an average joe myself but just "making due" with Lowes cables ain't high end audio in my book, never was, never will be. I want to read about components,,, and I consider anything with an audio signal in it OR anything that contributes to the audio signal, directly or indirectly, as being an audio component and as such I want to read about it. I'd like AA to do more articles on tweaks as the Acoustic Revive line of products as an example. Affordable,,, maybe not but worthwhile?? Well I want to read about this,,, good or bad.

I say keep up the good work AA and thanks for not continuing to write with blinders on. 

Cheers,
Robin

[TONEPUB]

Welcome to my world, boys....

The minute you start spending serious money on this stuff,
everyone wants to tell you that you are crazy, because they
can't hear it, don't think it's valid, etc. etc.

Keep up the good work, but buy some good raincoats!

It's only going to rain more from here on in....

[Mister Pig]

I actually had skipped reading the $2k+ review on the first go, but then after some activity on this thread, I went back and read it. It is nicely written review.

Cheers

Thank you for the kind words. I am glad you found the article interesting to read.

Regards
John Hoffman
Affordable Audio

[Mister Pig]

I for you enjoyed your article on "high end" audio which is the reason I post here and not in a midfi forum like Audioholics,,, the home of the naysayer. And that's not to say Audioholics or midfi is a bad thing either as I've spent the majority of my life enjoying audio from that exact platform.  But at the end of my lifespan I want more from my audio experience, to expose myself to what high end audio truely is and what can be if you're willing to spend the extra for that little bit extra performance.

I understand what the "average joe" is saying, i wouldn't have $50000 on credit cards if I weren't an average joe myself but just "making due" with Lowes cables ain't high end audio in my book, never was, never will be. I want to read about components,,, and I consider anything with an audio signal in it OR anything that contributes to the audio signal, directly or indirectly, as being an audio component and as such I want to read about it. I'd like AA to do more articles on tweaks as the Acoustic Revive line of products as an example. Affordable,,, maybe not but worthwhile?? Well I want to read about this,,, good or bad.

I say keep up the good work AA and thanks for not continuing to write with blinders on. 

Cheers,
Robin

Hello Robin,

I am glad to hear that you enjoyed the review. I will endeavor to write about interesting audio products, in spite of their price. Next month's issue will contain a piece about the Audio Nirvana Super 12 fullrange driver. This will be of interest to many a frugal audio person. But it shouldn't be ignored by those whose wine budget exceeds the selling price of these drivers. The following month will contain the various modification packages and power supplies for a modified Squeezebox. A portion of this review is decidedly upscale, and the deluxe package may not be of interest to every niche of Affordable Audio reader. However, there are more modest versions of the mod package that can fill the needs of the frugal enthusiast.

Regards
John Hoffman
Affordable Audio

Regards
John Hoffman
Affordable Audio

[Affordable$$Audio]

Hey Jeff, when does my membership card arrive???  :>)

[Early B.]

It took a great deal of thought to let John and Sean expand the price limits.  But I felt that as long as the vast majority of equipment reviews stayed in our wheelhouse, it would benefit both our reviewers and readers.  Why, because it lends perspective.

Excellent point. There's only one of knowing how much "value" our affordable gear has -- and that's by comparing it with much higher priced gear using the same A$$A reviewers in the same ezine. 

[jimdgoulding]

Early B.  Long time no see.  Cheers, my man.