John, you're killin' me!

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dougdeacon

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John, you're killin' me!
« on: 16 Sep 2003, 06:06 pm »
Your hint about an ultrasonic record cleaner has been up for nearly two weeks. :peek:

Come on, at least give us something to chew on. How about a photo (or even a schematic  :mrgreen: !)
My LP's are decomposing as we speak! Hurry, hurry, hurry!  :hyper:



P. S. The Mu transformers are really excellent.  :drums:  :violin:  :guitar:  :dance:  

I'm still fussing with alignment, VTA/SRA, VTF, blah, blah. Once I get those dialed in I'll play around with loading and let you know how it goes with my Shelter 901. Still at 100 ohms for now.

John Chapman

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John, you're killin' me!
« Reply #1 on: 16 Sep 2003, 08:32 pm »
Hello!

Thanks for the fun post!  Made my day. The NYL record cleaner (pronounced 'nil') is an ultrasonic based record cleaner. It will consist of a holder for the records (up to 7 at one time), the ultrasonic tank itself, and a rinse tank. The process is:

Place the records on a shaft the holds them in the ultrasonic bath and spins them slowly. Leave them for 5 to 10 minutes or so.

Next the record holder assembly is moved to a rinse tank and left for 5 minutes or so. The solution in the ultrasonic tank is very weak so this step could be considdered optional

Finally the records can be air dryed, towell dryed using towells from discdoctor, or vacuumed dry on a vacuum machine. I have a design for a cheap'n nasty vacuum dryer and will offer it if enough folks interested in NYL need a vacuum dryer.

Right now the tank is here and the parts are being cut by the laser this week. Desparately trying to have the prototype ready for VSAC - even if it is a bit rough around the edges I should have pics by the beginning of Oct.
Price  will depend mostly on mycost for ultrasonic tanks but I am trying to keep it in the $700.00 range for the tank, custom record holder/spinner, and the rinse tank. Most of the cost is the tank so it governs the cost of the unit.

Hope that helps - I did not want to kill anyone......

Many Thanks!


John Chapman
www.bentaudio.com

dougdeacon

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John, you're killin' me!
« Reply #2 on: 16 Sep 2003, 09:33 pm »
Thanks, John. I'll stop jumping up and down now. Re-reading your explanation should occupy me for a couple of weeks anyway.

This sounds really interesting, I love the idea of near chemical-free cleaning, and also the part about 7 discs at a time. Integral vacuuming would be uber-cool, but I can't visualize any practical way to implement it.

Ideas/questions/comments:
- Do the tanks have or need any provision to keep runoff from reaching the labels?
- Is the cleaning solution pumped through a filter? Does it need to be?
- A cheap 'n' nasty vacuum drier might be of interest, at least to me
- Love the name. Soon our records will have NYL noise so they can cleanly MU into NOH preamp. I can hardly wait for the names of your amp and speaker lines!

Good luck at VSAC,
Doug

John Chapman

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John, you're killin' me!
« Reply #3 on: 16 Sep 2003, 10:46 pm »
More in-line....


>Thanks, John. I'll stop jumping up and down now. Re-reading your >explanation should occupy me for a couple of weeks anyway.

It is not too clear I know! Pictures will help a lot!

>This sounds really interesting, I love the idea of near chemical-free >cleaning, and also the part about 7 discs at a time. Integral vacuuming >would be uber-cool, but I can't visualize any practical way to implement >it.
I spent countless hours working on that but it keeps getting really weird - and expensive!

If you are vacuuming to play right away or put them away handling one at a time for the drying step is likely fine I figured. Especially since I don't think there is a practical option!


>Ideas/questions/comments:
>- Do the tanks have or need any provision to keep runoff from reaching >the labels?
The record spins really slow and  this is no problem at all. I wondered about this too. It was a local friend that introduced me to the ultrasonic cleaning and that was one of my first questions to him!

>- Is the cleaning solution pumped through a filter? Does it need to be?
I also had this worked out but again it got complex so no it is not planned to be filtered. There is a tank drain that could be hooked to a filter assembly. At one point I had all these things in the design but it was getting complex and too expensive. I simplified it a lot in an effort  to make  it straightforward to use and somewhat affordable!


>- A cheap 'n' nasty vacuum drier might be of interest, at least to me
Not much to it and I will likely whip one up for myself and offer it as an option - after VSAC when I have time to breath.and sleep again.

>- Love the name. Soon our records will have NYL noise so they can >cleanly MU into NOH preamp. I can hardly wait for the names of your amp >and speaker lines!

Thanks! I have a bit of hit and miss time when it comes to names - Bent Audio is fun but I was not aware of the UK slang meaning when I chose it!  The brits have been quite understanding and they have fun with it too. When I exhibited at HE2001 in New York one British hifi writer kept comming back over and over and just staring at my sign in dis-belief. It has turned out o.k. in the end! When i get swamped with work, tired,  and serious it helps to remind me that I got into this bussiness for fun!

Many Thanks!

John

tg3

John, you're killin' me!
« Reply #4 on: 17 Sep 2003, 08:15 pm »
Quote from: John Chapman
The NYL record cleaner (pronounced 'nil') is an ultrasonic based record cleaner.


Yikes, I was getting close to buying a Nitty Gritty vinyl cleaning system! :o

No way I can miss the VSAC now! See you there.

Best regards from Seattle,

dougdeacon

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Progress report on NYL?
« Reply #5 on: 10 Dec 2003, 07:27 pm »
John,

The pile of filthy records is growing rapidly. Can you help?

Thanks,
Doug

John Chapman

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John, you're killin' me!
« Reply #6 on: 11 Dec 2003, 01:30 am »
Hello!

I am close to getting the first batch of tanks on the way. The first time I brought a batch of tanks in they did not work out just right - which cost a bundle! I am being careful to make sure the next batch in will work out and be good for the job!

I have the latest tank from the tank vendor and testing I did last weekend looked good. Over the next week or so I will test some more and my plan is to get the first batch on the way by year end. This would put the tanks here about the end of Jan.  The rest of the system is made from easy to get parts and parts I have made locally so they will not affect delivery.

I am sorry it is taking so long! I have to fit it in with all the other stuff and try and find time to sleep once and a while!

My plan is to get a group of first customers together and pass the stuff through at as close to cost as I can. Then from this first group we'll get a good handle on solutions to use and results and then we'll go from there!

Many Thansk!

John Chapman
www.bentaudio.com

dougdeacon

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John, you're killin' me!
« Reply #7 on: 11 Dec 2003, 02:51 pm »
Thanks, John. We'd be willing to beta test if that's what you're after. We're on a used LP buying binge at the moment so we should have plenty of material to work with by Jan/Feb.

Cheers,
Doug

Paganini

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Re: John, you're killin' me!
« Reply #8 on: 6 Sep 2007, 06:38 am »
I've been using a Branson Ultrasonic cleaner for this purpose for a long time. The best cleaning process for LP's for sure! The cleaner I'm using is a number too small. Model B300 would probably be perfect :D

A closeup:


More about Ultrasonic Cleaning:
http://www.bransoncleaning.com/whitepapers.asp

« Last Edit: 6 Sep 2007, 07:23 am by Paganini »

John Chapman

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Re: John, you're killin' me!
« Reply #9 on: 7 Sep 2007, 10:22 pm »
Hello!


Thanks for the reminder! I think I have posted since about it but I passed all the record cleaning stuff to a turntable maker - he was keen to make it into a product. I suspect though that he may have discovered like I did - it is great to play with as a diy type thing but to make it into a finished product would take some doing - and cost $$$ in the end.....Part of the trick is drying the records - do you air dry or use a cloth? I felt that the Ultrasonic cleaning followed by a vacuum type cleaner (like a VPI) is a great combo - but then it is hard to justify space/cost for 2 record cleaners!

Thansk!

John

Paganini

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Re: John, you're killin' me!
« Reply #10 on: 11 Sep 2007, 07:51 am »
Til I get a larger unit, I clean one LP a time. Excellent result, but not efficient :(
For drying I put the record betwen two cotton dishwashing towels. They are well used and free of nap.

KBK

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Re: John, you're killin' me!
« Reply #11 on: 5 Nov 2007, 12:39 am »
yah know..they call me nutz at the AVSForum and at DIY audio. But I've never bought a ultrasonic cleaner for my LP's. You've got me thinking now.....