[Brian Cheney]

The RM/X are anything but portable.  Also, it is my experience that owners of very expensive systems prefer them regardless of how they sound.

[pjchappy]

Brian,
You beat me to my comment. . . if I dropped well over $100 K on my system, it would be the best. . .REGARDLESS. . .

p

[Sa-dono]

The RM/X are anything but portable.  Also, it is my experience that owners of very expensive systems prefer them regardless of how they sound.

Yes..they are certainly not easily moved. And yes, you are right about most owners. However, I mainly saw this as an interesting comparison for all of the audiophiles in the area (or could make the travel) that could attend. If it was mainly for the owner's purpose, then I would agree that this would be mostly useless. If we set this enough in the future, and highly publicize it among the forums, then this could be extremely interesting. Almost like a chance for you to walk the walk, after talking the talk. Just a thought...

[jgubman]

Didn't this shoot-out already happen at CES...

Anyway, I live in the bay area, put me  on the list. Hell, I'll even transport the speakers in my truck (w/ some help, of course).

[Brian Cheney]

I wonder if this person has spent an equivalent amount on room treatment and associated equipment.  $125,000pr speakers constructed from elaborately packaged $50 drivers generate an emotional attachment
and a sense of awe that has little to nothing to do with their real-world performance.

[pjchappy]

Maybe someone w/ the RM-40 (since hardly anyone has any RM/Xs yet) would be willing to do this shootout. . .
Althought the owner of the X-2s would have a biased opinion, if enough people are willing to get together, it would be great to see $4K speakers smoking $100K+ speakers. . . I am sure SOMEBODY could arrange this (Brian, or not). . .

p

[Sa-dono]

I wonder if this person has spent an equivalent amount on room treatment and associated equipment.  $125,000pr speakers constructed from elaborately packaged $50 drivers generate an emotional attachment and a sense of awe that has little to nothing to do with their real-world performance.

Yes..he has fully treated his room. I can't remember exactly which company completed this. It is fairly easily found on AVS though. Also, he has spent plenty on equipment as well. Acoustic Research, Krell, Nordost, etc. If you were indeed interested in going forward with this comparison, I am sure you would be welcome to bring over whatever gear you would like as well.

[John Casler]

The party in question does have some treatment but I would say it is set up more for HT than "Musical Audio" accuracy.

See below:

http://homepage.mac.com/imacdoyou86/Home_Theater/PhotoAlbum24.html

The system by its shear "physical" impressiveness would almost compel one to hear excellence.  Not to mention the "price tag".

One good thing he used was a dead front wall.  If he hit the side walls and the ceiling a bit more (ala LEDE), it should sound pretty musical too.

He should also hit the side and rear, "wall to ceiling" corners.  Something like below, but maybe a more aesthetic commercial version and not my DIY tweaked version:

http://www.audiocircle.com/circles/galleryimage.php/album81/Ceiling_Corner_Treatment_1.jpg

I don't particulalry care for Wilson's in general but most set ups don't do them justice.  This fellow has made a good attempt with some good electronics and "some" additional treatment, they probably do sound impressive.

But give me the cash and I'd send my daughter to college and get a pair of RM/x.

For a moment I thought him a "lucky guy" being a gyno   and having such a great system, then I walked into my "music room" and saw "who" and "what" was standing there and realized, I should count "my" blessings

[Sa-dono]

Well the company and oneobgyn claim that they have taken the room out of the equation. I guess only a listen would tell...

And until you get a bed in the "music room"...you have much to learn John

[John Casler]

And until you get a bed in the "music room"...you have much to learn John

Ahhh, but Weedhoppah, my listening sofa "IS" a bed.

Now continue with your "wipe on, wipe off".

[Sa-dono]

Ahhh, but Weedhoppah, my listening sofa "IS" a bed.

Now continue with your "wipe on, wipe off".

The sofa is small..and for any SERIOUS fun it will fall over

*throws John some "wax" since he is the one that has to "wipe on, wipe off"*

[Brian Cheney]

After viewing the "treated room" photos I would hesitate to put any quality music system in there.  I wouldn't expect the X-2 to sound good, nor would I be pleased at the prospect of tuning the RM/X to that environment.  Equipment seems to be quite good, however.

[Sa-dono]

After viewing the "treated room" photos I would hesitate to put any quality music system in there.  I wouldn't expect the X-2 to sound good, nor would I be pleased at the prospect of tuning the RM/X to that environment.  Equipment seems to be quite good, however.

Any reasoning why? Also, are any of your current room treatments portable, and possibly capable of treating any deficiency you see?

[Brian Cheney]

The screen behind the speakers presents a large reflective surface at the worst possible site, there is no ceiling treatment or bass traps, and the equipment is on the floor in the speaker end of the room, providing numerous small reflections.

This isn't a treated room, more like an acoustic nitemare.  The owner should get his money back from the installer.

[Sa-dono]

The screen behind the speakers presents a large reflective surface at the worst possible site, there is no ceiling treatment or bass traps, and the equipment is on the floor in the speaker end of the room, providing numerous small reflections.

This isn't a treated room, more like an acoustic nitemare.  The owner should get his money back from the installer.

Ahhhh..I love comments like these

I believe his screen is a pull down, so that is not a problem. As far as ceiling treatments and bass traps, I believe he has added new treatments since these pictures. I'm not completely sure on this, as he said he was going to update the pictures of them, but obviously these pictures aren't telling or showing of such.

[John Casler]

The sofa is small..and for any SERIOUS fun it will fall over  

No, I mean it is a "hide-a-bed".

And regarding the room "as pictured", I think that it is set up more for HT.

HT acoustics need to be more livley and are more forgiving than Audio, in fact room reinforced bass and room generated "reflected sound" is "part of the goal of sonic immersion.

[Sa-dono]

And regarding the room "as pictured", I think that it is set up more for HT.

HT acoustics need to be more livley and are more forgiving than Audio, in fact room reinforced bass and room generated "reflected sound" is "part of the goal of sonic immersion.

Actually, the goal for HT acoustics should be a dead room, as with the addition of more channels, there is no longer the need to have reflected sound for ambience. Probably the majority of all of the most respected HT construction guys will tell you this.

[Juan R]

I think I am in the wrong field, a Obgyn has  a $ 100,000  speakers and  a Plastic Surgeon a $5,000. BUt I am happy!!!!!!!

[Brian Cheney]

So if I understand correctly, the X-2 owner has ruined the sound of his system because of "trendy" advice from some nameless installer who read something somewhere about dead rooms being good for HT.

Dead rooms are not good listening environments unless you are monitoring recordings, where all you care about is hearing glitches on the tape.

"Dead" rooms are mostly only dead above 5 kHz, severely curtailing the HF output of the speakers.  A single tweeter system like the X-2 does not have enough 5 K and above output level to compensate, and the result is a ghastly dull tonal balance.  I saw pictures of Dave Wilson setting up an X-1/X-2 comparison in a completely bare, large room, which is also objectionable in its way but probably less destructive of listening pleasure than the room I see in this owner's HT environment.

I feel sorry for the man.  All that expense, pisspoor sound. He probably thinks it's great.

[lkosova]

Kevin: Try the new Led Zepplin dvd...I think you will be very suprised.

John: Just trying to make us Married ones Jealous????

Brian: You hit upon something that I have been thinking about. I also have a home theater design(now finishing construction after my unexpecting flooding from hell!!).  BUT I want musical sound also. I wanted a live end"dead end but went with a Dennis Erksine design which is ususally a good design but I am think about not having a carpeted stage but one with hardwood etc.....But I was think about a fixed postion Stewart screen but it is set back from  the front speakers with the center for the larger center behind the screen. I want to have good two channel listening ability in a home theater room.....So what to do???

My walls are double walls with one inch are space filled with Jons mansfield sound sheild. Ceiling is packed and deep and with room with -in room design. Stage is filled with sand and platform is floated on rubber pieces and filled with soundsheild. I have theater sheild on inch to place along the walls under the waistline down.  etc. etc.

I had a local wiring guy who does home theaters,music rooms come over to bid some of the job and he was very impressed by the construction and that there was no slap echo etc. I still have to put in the door etc.

So......what to do to keep the sound musical and not to dead????

I can send you drawings(or anyone else-hint hint!!). I need to contact Dennis to see if it is ok to post drawings here..copy right issues.

Thanks

Larry Kosova

I am planning having VMPS RM 40's(Jims e-bay speakers are interesting) with larger center and still confused what to do for the sides and rear(7.1 setup ) with speakers in walls.