[zybar]

Speakers with efficiencies of 85 dB/w/m have poor dynamics anyway and should be avoided.

JLM,

That is just a silly statement.

I have listened and/or owned speakers that were 85db and had tremendous dynamics.

Painting with broad strokes isn't helping anybody out...

George

[macrojack]

I agree with George on that one. Aren't the Sonus Faber Extremas and the MBL footballs very low efficiency and knock-you-down dynamic?

[samplesj]

Assuming sufficent amp power why should a lower sensitivity speaker be less dynamic?  Why should 128 watts into 85dB/w/m be different than 32 watts into a 91dB/w/m speaker?

Everyone says planars can't do dynamics (which is probably what JLM was targeting), but my 4ohm 85dB/w/m 3.6s are easily the most dynamic speakers in my house.  Something like O Fortuna from Carmina Burana (Orff) gets both the low level whisper/chanting to the slam/punch as the big drums hit hard. 

I've got both a TL design (Danny/GR AV-3s) and a single driver (Ed's Horns).  I still enjoy both of them and won't be getting rid of them any time soon.  I mention them since others in this thread are pushing those types of designs hard as the perfect solution.

There is no perfect solution, the kool-aid has been flowing in abundance in this thread so just keep in mind that they are your speakers and you have to enjoy them.

[macrojack]

For a slight upcharge, Zu speakers are available in every Kool-Aid color.

[DSK]

For those looking for a track that demonstrates vertical imaging, get a hold of Chesky Records Jazz Sampler & Audiophile Test Disc Volume 1 (Chesky JD37).

Track 11 is titled 'LEDR Test' (Listening Environmet Diagnostic Recording) and is split into 3 tests comprising a series of noise bursts that travel in different paths: Up, Over, and Lateral.

Up: The noise bursts start at left speaker and travel straight upwards approx 6 feet. Repeated for right speaker.

Over: Noise travels from left speaker, arches overhead and down to right speaker. Repeated from right to left speaker. Highest point should be at least as high as the Up path test.

Lateral: Noise travels from left to right speaker, then from beyond the right to beyond the left, then from right to left, then from beyond left to beyond right.


I have tried these tests on a few sets of speakers and the effects are definitely audible. The upward tests are not as 'obvious' as the simple lateral tests (they sound a little more phasey if that makes sense) but they are there.


 

[lonewolfny42]

macrojack I live in New Jersey. work in Manhattan

The August Rave is in N.J. ....come down for a listen.... http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=43210.0   

[BrianM]

It's funny to me that the SongTower is laying waste to the competition though the chances are about nil that any of the voters have heard them.  No offense, I'm sure they're nice speakers.

Not funny at all, if you've heard other speakers designed and built by the same people.  No different from feeling loyal to a car brand IMO.  You buy the new model on the recommendation of the maker and those who've heard it.

[martyo]

Hi T37,

I'm finally jumping in after following this thread for the last week. All my following comments should be prefaced with a BIG "IMHO".

I'm relatively new here. I've only spent 3 days, 23 hours on the forum. 
I enjoy hangin', I've learned a few things, been entertained, making some new relationships, good stuff.
OTOH, a few days ago someone told me I wasn't listening to music "right". I'm going to RMAF to hear speakers in particular, but I'm really looking forward to meeting Frank and putting faces with some of the "characters"  I've talked with here.

Many strong opinions here, very evident in this thread. I find myself looking at the systems page alot, learning what a poster has, what kind of music preferences, and even looking at their "recent posts" to better understand where their perspective comes from.  Over time I believe I've learned a little about some of the guys here where I tend to know their preferences, I think that is useful. For myself, I only want FULL range speakers. Without the bottom octave the "picture is incomplete". For others, it may not be important.

I couldn't buy speakers unheard. I too find it curious that someone would recommend something they have never heard. However, I've come to respect BrianM and basically agree with what he says. I just think that should be made clear. For instance, I think you've made an excellent choice with your T8 and 350. I own a T8 and 550, but have never heard a 350 or any of Frank's solid state stuff. If someone asks my opinion about a 440ex I think I need to make that clear.

I think to a certain degree, most, if not all of us have biases. I appreciate when someone is up front with theirs, other times we're not even aware of them. I'm sure part of me only wanting FULL range is years of having Dahlquist speakers that were lacking in that area and regardless of how well they performed in the rest of the music, usually it just didn't sound complete. I have a bias against dynamic speakers in the midrange. I'm plan on auditioning a few at RMAF, but I'm really psyched up about the VMPS 40's, but I've never heard them. But I'm not buying any speakers unheard. I'd take lonewolf up on his invite to the Rave.

As I look back through this thread there's alot more to comment on, but this time I'm going to resist.

Happy hunting and listening. 

[zybar]

It's funny to me that the SongTower is laying waste to the competition though the chances are about nil that any of the voters have heard them.  No offense, I'm sure they're nice speakers.

Not funny at all, if you've heard other speakers designed and built by the same people.  No different from feeling loyal to a car brand IMO.  You buy the new model on the recommendation of the maker and those who've heard it.

I should have my three Song Towers mid to late next week and will do my best to post initial impressions as quickly as possible.

Please keep in mind that I am not using these in my main system, but rather in my HT.

They will be driven by a Denon 4308 or 3808 and an ATI 1506 six channel amp.

George

[JLM]

martyo,

Lots of good stuff in your post.

I've heard the VMPS RM-40s.  Along with the 626, they are wonderful.  The mid/mid-treble ribbon is awesome as the heart of the speaker. 

[BrianM]

I couldn't buy speakers unheard. I too find it curious that someone would recommend something they have never heard. However, I've come to respect BrianM and basically agree with what he says.

And make no mistake, I'm certainly willing to be wrong about that kind of a recommendation.  I would prefer to think of it as "advice" and not an actual recommendation, I guess, but whatever.  Knowing what I think I know, I would simply bet those speakers are about as good as you can do for the money (unless you find a great deal on something used of course).  If someone wants monster bass to boot, well, that's another set of choices probably.  The Songtowers are TLs of course and should give quite satisfying & usable bass for 95% of listening, but no they won't shake the floors.