[Eric5676]

Its still ridiculous that others have had to resort to boiling any hd dvd release to get it to play correctly new out of the case.

I hope they never fix the problems with combo discs. Combo discs are just another way to overcharge the consumer. I have not heard of having to boil HD discs that were not combos. This is a QC problem for combos. OTOH, I have encountered brand new defective Blu-Ray discs that froze or skipped - I don't know what the excuse is for these. They looked very clean and shiny.

There are plans to produce a Blu-Ray/HD DVD combo disc. I hope those don't work either because I don't need any overpriced dual format discs. Until the typical hi-res disc is priced at $20 or less I see no reason to buy and will rent instead.

Bob

I'm with you all the way. I wish nothing but failure for hybrid or combo of any kind, hardware or software.

[tex-amp]

1. There were very few reports of issues with 300 and no way to tell if they were legit or not.  If 300 had wide spread issues the Blu supporters on AVS would be all over it. 300 sold 87500 copies on HD DVD(the most to date?) I'd think we'd being hearing a lot more about this if there were issues.  Blu has had disc issues too such as having to replace all of the original run of The Fifth Element.

2. Best buy is discontinuing carrying the basic core xbox 360 not the elite or premium. x-box is adding HDMI to the x-box so future buyers can use the new audio formats. But with being able to find an A2 stand-alone for another $50 and lower I don't see any reason to buy an add-on for x-box.

3. Combo disc prices suck!

[Ears]

1. There were very few reports of issues with 300 and no way to tell if they were legit or not.  If 300 had wide spread issues the Blu supporters on AVS would be all over it. 300 sold 87500 copies on HD DVD(the most to date?) I'd think we'd being hearing a lot more about this if there were issues.  Blu has had disc issues too such as having to replace all of the original run of The Fifth Element.

2. Best buy is discontinuing carrying the basic core xbox 360 not the elite or premium. x-box is adding HDMI to the x-box so future buyers can use the new audio formats. But with being able to find an A2 stand-alone for another $50 and lower I don't see any reason to buy an add-on for x-box.

3. Combo disc prices suck!

1 I first read about the issues in USA Today with the 300 hd dvd issues and there was a poll at AVS that said 15 % had issues on there 300 hd dvd so....
TFE was remastered because it was rushed out the door after hd dvd got a two month head start with a not so great transfer.
This is hardly the same thing as actual discs having playback problems and Sony replaced them for free to buyers of the original version.

2 Yes that's already been said that 100% of the cores are defective, (33%  ???) of the premiums are defective so far including twice now for my sons which also gouged a brand new 60.00 game which was fairly common on the initial 360's.
And adding hdmi will absolutely not give the 360 the ability to playback DD-THD, or DTS-MA.
Theres much more to it than that I am afraid so I will do some research on that.
The 360 even without all the problems would make a terrible player regardless because its far too loud for any half way serious home theater..
Does the a-2 have actual 1080p output?

3 Combo discs period are utter crap in any way, shape or form regardless of the higher prices.

[tex-amp]

Does the a-2 have actual 1080p output?

Nope but 80% of HDTV owned don't do 1080p and as you know 1080i gets de-interlaced by the set and played as p.

I'm sorry that I'm not taking a poll on AVS for granted on percentages.  Way too easy for BD supporters and HD guys who hate combo discs to vote they had an issue with 300 whether or not they ever bought the disc.

[Eric5676]

Does the a-2 have actual 1080p output?

Nope but 80% of HDTV owned don't do 1080p and as you know 1080i gets de-interlaced by the set and played as p.

I'm sorry that I'm not taking a poll on AVS for granted on percentages.  Way too easy for BD supporters and HD guys who hate combo discs to vote they had an issue with 300 whether or not they ever bought the disc.

Here's a couple of search engine terms you can try at your leisure and see what you think. I did some of these and I think you'll see in fairly short order that there's something afoot.

Any variations on terms like : "Boiling Matrix HD-DVD discs" "HD-DVD 300 combo disc issues, errors, problems, boiling"  and other obvious variants on the subject being discussed.   Even just "boil HD-DVD" is probably enough.

I still have never heard of anything so ridiculous.

You'll get plenty of hits.

[jqp]

the Studio Support War?

http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/format-war/state-of-high-definition-whos-winning-the-studio-support-war-291361.php

[tex-amp]

the Studio Support War?

http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/format-war/state-of-high-definition-whos-winning-the-studio-support-war-291361.php

That will shake things up! Paramount and DreamWorks are going HD DVD exclusive.

[AdamM]

It's great to see the industry learned the lesson after the VHS / BETA fiasco...

Sony has bet the farm on Blu-Ray.  I'm not sure those two studios going HD is enough to tip the scales.

This is a few months old, but very interesting:

Top-selling Blu-Ray discs sells 880 copies
Blu-Ray and DVD-HD -- the two new high-def video formats that have
been crippled into uselessness through ridiculous anti-copying
measures -- are selling so poorly that a new disc can get on the
weekly top ten by selling as few as 880 copies.


While we should note that the VideoScan numbers are not all-
inclusive (for example, they don't include discs sold at Wal-Mart or
some online merchants), the lower sales numbers at the bottom end of
weekly list and on display elsewhere in the report (where some titles
are listed as selling fewer than 200 units since inception) are
certainly still a sobering reminder that both formats still have a
long way to go in their shared quest to supplant standard-def DVD.

Checkout the sales! (how low)


Don't ask me how i got this info...

/A

[Night_Train]

I would presume that Warner Bros. and Sony (i.e Columbia, MGM, etc.) would carry the most clout out of the major movie studios.

[PeteG]

Big News For HD-DVD

The only side I'm on is "My Side" I want more HD movies and concerts.

[klh]

It will be interesting to see how this plays out. People are speculating that Lionsgate and/or Disney may go neutral (especially since Disney has heavily invested in interactive features) and that Warner may go exclusive to HD-DVD. The playing field would go level if any of those things happen.

[Ears]

It will be interesting to see how this plays out. People are speculating that Lionsgate and/or Disney may go neutral (especially since Disney has heavily invested in interactive features) and that Warner may go exclusive to HD-DVD. The playing field would go level if any of those things happen.

Disney is after the better  copy protection on Blu-ray as well as the extra GB and bandwith so its very wishful thinking that their not remaining BD exclusive.

Warner could possibly switch to hd dvd exclusive if Microsoft were to give them say 220 million dollars or possibly more as the 150 million they gave Paramount wouldn't be considered enough when your sales are 70% BD.

The latest sales numbers are 71% BD and 29% hd dvd for software sales and I expect it to remain about the same next week.

Disney, Fox, Lions Gate, MGM and Sony are all BDA members, Paramount was not.

[klh]

Disney, Fox, Lions Gate, MGM and Sony are all BDA members, Paramount was not.

That's interesting. I had no idea... and it does explain a lot.

When you refer to the 71%/29% selling numbers, is that industry wide? Since Disney plays to a more defined crowd, it would be interesting to see if more families own X-Box's (with and without the HD-DVD add on) or PS3's since I think those players would more than likely be the first HD players for the average household with kids. I have no idea what those numbers may be and it may or may not influence Disney's decision. The extra memory doesn't do much for me as BD has done a poor job of implementing it (but of course that may change tomorrow). The extra copy protection can potentially be a big deal... especially with Disney's 7 year release pattern. I read somewhere on a different forum that Disney worked with the HD-DVD camp on internet interactivity, but who knows if it's true. If so, there's a reasonable chance of them going both ways (though I doubt it would happen).

[klh]

Warner could possibly switch to hd dvd exclusive if Microsoft were to give them say 220 million dollars or possibly more as the 150 million they gave Paramount wouldn't be considered enough when your sales are 70% BD.

For good or for bad, M$ is quite capable of that

[samplesj]

Warner could possibly switch to hd dvd exclusive if Microsoft were to give them say 220 million dollars or possibly more as the 150 million they gave Paramount wouldn't be considered enough when your sales are 70% BD.

For good or for bad, M$ is quite capable of that

Personally I'm format neutral, but I find some of the gyrations that the blu camp takes amusing.

Please notice that the original quote came from our resident blu fanboy.  In an interview a major MS executive that WAS IDENTIFIED has flat out denied any claims that they sent $150 million to Paramount.  Other than 2 unidentified sources for the Times (and how often do all managers at whatever level in a company actually know the full story) are there any other sources for this $150 million payoff?  Remember the whisper game?

[Ears]

Warner could possibly switch to hd dvd exclusive if Microsoft were to give them say 220 million dollars or possibly more as the 150 million they gave Paramount wouldn't be considered enough when your sales are 70% BD.

For good or for bad, M$ is quite capable of that

Personally I'm format neutral, but I find some of the gyrations that the blu camp takes amusing.

Please notice that the original quote came from our resident blu fanboy.  In an interview a major MS executive that WAS IDENTIFIED has flat out denied any claims that they sent $150 million to Paramount.  Other than 2 unidentified sources for the Times (and how often do all managers at whatever level in a company actually know the full story) are there any other sources for this $150 million payoff?  Remember the whisper game?

Yep, Microsoft is going to admit to directly, or indirectly giving 150 million to Dreamworks/Paramount and open themselves up to even more antitrust lawsuits and European fines.
What do you expect M/S to say?

They have the most to gain and Toshiba as well as all HD studios have not even broke even on either format so far.
Microsoft has constantly bought their what they wanted over the years and their track record more than proves it.

Paramount being paid to go hd dvd was a smart move business wise because there is no way they could have made 150 million on HD anytime in the next 1.5-2 years.

With Spielberg not allowing any of his movies to be hd dvd only, and reportedly preferring BD, the Paramount deal is not anywhere near as big as it seems, except for the perception angle.

Originally, Paramount as well as Warner were both supposed to be hd dvd only.
With the BD versions of Paramounts releases for next week reportedly having PCM audio as compared to the core dd 5.1 on all their hd dvd's, this was a big move because obvious proof that the extra GB and bandwidth of BD was about to be very evident next week.

Its also very interesting that Microsoft is in this for a stalemate until they get their HD download service in place, and that Paramount has publicly stated they believe downloads are the future with both formats never reaching mass appeal.

[Ears]

Disney, Fox, Lions Gate, MGM and Sony are all BDA members, Paramount was not.

That's interesting. I had no idea... and it does explain a lot.

When you refer to the 71%/29% selling numbers, is that industry wide? Since Disney plays to a more defined crowd, it would be interesting to see if more families own X-Box's (with and without the HD-DVD add on) or PS3's since I think those players would more than likely be the first HD players for the average household with kids. I have no idea what those numbers may be and it may or may not influence Disney's decision. The extra memory doesn't do much for me as BD has done a poor job of implementing it (but of course that may change tomorrow). The extra copy protection can potentially be a big deal... especially with Disney's 7 year release pattern. I read somewhere on a different forum that Disney worked with the HD-DVD camp on internet interactivity, but who knows if it's true. If so, there's a reasonable chance of them going both ways (though I doubt it would happen).

Nielsen numbers are for U.S. software sales not counting Wallmart or some on line sales.

For info on what the extra GB and bandwidth of BD offers, you add all the known reviewers of HD optical scores and will find that overall, BD leads in PQ/AQ scores because of the extra bandwith/ space of Disney/ Sony releases this year on 50GB discs.

So you have an unbiased account of whats really happening with the Nielsen numbers, and also an accurate way of seeing what the known reviewers scores add up to with regards to PQ/AQ scores without all the B.S. in between.

[samplesj]

Yep, Microsoft is going to admit to directly, or indirectly giving 150 million to Dreamworks/Paramount and open themselves up to even more antitrust lawsuits and European fines.
What do you expect M/S to say?

MS didn't just fail to acknowledge it.  Majidimehr explicitly DENIED it (in the very same NY Times article).  That is a VERY significant difference.  I'm not sure where the antitrust comes from except as some sort of FUD, but I'd think that a lie would be more dangerous in terms of antitrust in this case wouldn't you?

I personally don't care who wins.  I'm covered either way.  I just find selective reporting "interesting"

BTW if we want to talk unsubstantiated rumors didn't the BDA offer money for "astroturfers"?

[Ears]

Yep, Microsoft is going to admit to directly, or indirectly giving 150 million to Dreamworks/Paramount and open themselves up to even more antitrust lawsuits and European fines.
What do you expect M/S to say?

MS didn't just fail to acknowledge it.  Majidimehr explicitly DENIED it (in the very same NY Times article).  That is a VERY significant difference.  I'm not sure where the antitrust comes from except as some sort of FUD, but I'd think that a lie would be more dangerous in terms of antitrust in this case wouldn't you?

I personally don't care who wins.  I'm covered either way.  I just find selective reporting "interesting"

BTW if we want to talk unsubstantiated rumors didn't the BDA offer money for "astroturfers"?

Not sure what astroturfers is but it is legal to pay for a company to carry your product, but 100% illegal to get them to drop a competitors product....IE "anti trust' all the way with all the reason in the world to not admit anything.

[Ears]

I personally don't care who wins.  I'm covered either way.  I just find selective reporting "interesting"


[/quote]

Personally I find it very intersting that you have no problem with people saying hd dvd players are cheaper when they have no 1080p or analog outs on the cheaper models on an audio board.
How about the XBOX 360 elite doing HD audio...its 100% not true but you seem to have no problem with that either.
Disney is currently touring the 18 biggest U.S. malls with an all out touring BD marketing display and consistently has articles out stating why they are BD exclusive and also why they like BD technology better, but you have no problem with  very unlikely rumours based on zero evidence that they may support hd dvd .
I could name several more examples in this thread of hd dvd FUD or misinformation that you also seem to have no problem with but hopefully you get the picture here on who is  actually being selective, and who is trying to correct misinformation.

I tried several players from both formats early on and found that the early hd dvd players were completely bug ridden with playback problems as did every single initial pro review of the original  HD-A1 player by any reputable reviewer.
I also found that BD had every single release from Disney, MGM, Sony, Columbia Tri Star , and Fox to have one or more lossless or uncompressed audio tracks on every single release from the very start.
Pixar is due to start releasing in the coming weeks and also has uncompressed audio on every release that's up for pre-order.
This is what a true enthusiast would want after all the promises from both formats, only one has delivered on the basic ingredients of HD video as well as HD audio.

If choosing the format that delivered on the promise of HD audio as well as 1080p and players that actually function correctly, along with a format that has far more studio support and quality brand players makes me a fan boi in your eyes after trying two hd dvd players and 24 non combo  brand new discs that froze during playback randomly, then so be it.

Both my hd dvd players also froze up completely, and had to be unplugged to get them to re-boot and perform any function, both had to re-sync with my projector whenever you pushed menu, stop ect and re-synced very slowly, both asked on screen if I wanted to play the SD or HD version of an sd dvd at least once, neither had any memory for where you left off in the movie functions that any cheap dvd player has, they both were extremely slow at function reaction times as well as loading, and both had somewhat loud fans.
I also had some buzzing  noise in the analog outs on the first player.

This resulted in a very dim light for hd dvd for myself as well as many others after the initial launch.
Even though I believe the newer players are much better, I absolutely also believe that one format, and only one format has a chance at being more than just another niche format until HD lite downloads take over without any serious competition.

If either format gets 100% support, I am there, until that possible but unlikely day, I will be sticking with BD only and being a fan boi of HD audio as well as video.