[David Ellis]

Bill,

I recently did some experimentation with the Sonicap Platinum and was pleasantly surprised.  I vaguely recall you having some experience with the VH Cap, and you have used the standard flavor Sonicap Gen I too.  Have you ever done an a/b comparison between the VH Cap and the Sonicap Platinum?  If "yes" what are your thoughts?

I trust your ears in this regard.  Your input could save me some time and a few $$.

Any input would be very helpful.

Dave

[Bill Baker]

Hello Dave,
 Yes, I did a lot of back and forth comparisons with the V-Cap and SoniCap platinum. Obviously I use a lot of both depending on the application.

 I don't want my following words to start a debate as this is obviously a very subjective topic that has been discussed to no end throughout all the forums. These are my opinions and findings only and are just that........ my opinion.

 The SoniCap Platinum, in comparison to the V-Cap, is a bit more articulate but does not have the midrange magic of the V-Cap Teflon. Overall, I find the V-Cap a bit smoother in my applications. The upper end of the Platinum is very extended with a great sense of air. In coupling applications, I do find that the V-Cap provids a bit more body and weight in the lower end without sacrificing dynamic speed and authority. There are a few applications where I find the Platinum to be a better fit. For instance, I use the Platinum in power supply bypass applications as well as in the single ended input signal path of my Bella EXtreme 100 amplifiers. Sometimes a combination of the two provide me with the results I am looking for.

 The Bella EXtreme 3205 Platinum that was debuted at RMAF 06 in the Bolder Cable room used nothing but SoniCap Platinum capacitors. While the V-Caps do offer an exceptional presentation in this design, the Platinum offers a great balance in this circuit and is now stardard in this amp as well as the new 3205 MK II.

 I know many will dissagree but there is a sonic difference between these two capacitors. I will not say one is any better than the other and in the end it will depend on one's personal, subjective preferences.

[David Ellis]

Thanks for your response Bill!  Your comments are great!  This is exactly what I was looking for, and it eliminates my desire to perform this test.  It appears these capacitors are of similar quality, but different character.  I also realize this subject is very controversial for some folks.  There are certainly folks who believe all capacitors that measure the same also sound the same.

I found similar differences present during a test several years ago between the Sonicap Gen I and the Auricap.  Both were of similar quality overall, but there were differences in character.  The Auricap sounded slightly smoother while the Sonicap Gen I sounded slightly cleaner.  I obviously continued using the Sonicap, but if both capacitors had the same cost (they don't), the Auricap would have been a viable competitor.  Both capacitors were and are very decent quality.

Dave

[Bill Baker]

Hi Dave,
 I too experienced the same results between the SoniCap Gen I and AuriCap. However, if you ever try comparing the SoniCap Gen II and AuriCap, you will find the differences much more subtle.

 If all capacitors that measured the same sounded the same, we would need only one capacitor manufacturer.

 When I was in the R&D stage of my Bella 100 amplifiers, I "played" with several difference capacitors. My goal was to find the capacitor that offered me what I wanted from these amps with price not being a factor. If a $3 capacitor gave me this, then that's what I would have used. Price does not always indicate performace but sometimes performance does comes at a higher cost. I am also one the believes that sometimes the most unorthodox combination of components are what yields the best (or desired) results.

 As mentioned in another thread, I am going to custom build a pair of Bella 100's using the Mundorf Silver/Gold capacitors. While I have used these in the past, I have not yet experimented with them in this design. I am, however, quite confident. I will let you know the outcome.

[BobM]

I applaud your willingness to step up and actually describe the sound of these capacitors. There's not many people who:

(1) can hear this
(2) are willing to share their experience in a concise way
(3) are willing to share their experience at all, especially as a manufacturer (proprietary secrets and such)
(4) have the $$$ or time or inclination to do the comparisons at all

Thanks for your opinions. They are very welcome in a world of DIY enthusiasts.

Bob

[gstraley]

Any chance anyone has tried the Sonic Cap Platinum vs. the V-Cap in speaker crossovers. I was considering using one of these 2 caps for by pass. Or if someone has a cap they feel in speaker crossovers sounds even better. I know that better is subjective. Sometimes you hear something tho and you just know it's better. Right now what is in my speakers are the Hovland Music caps.

Gregg

[BobM]

I didn't try the Platinums or V-caps, but I did use the original Sonicps for the large values, bypassed by the Sonicap II's for the treble crossover region. This was their recommendation prior to coming out with the Platinum style caps.

The bypass definitely opened up and smoothed out the overall texture of the tweeter (I installed the bypass after testing the overall sound with the standard Sonicaps first). I guess that's the basis of a bypass anyway - increased transparency and more of a sense of texture - seeing better into the sonic picture. All very subtle though, but noticeable to one who is very familiar with the sound of their system.

Enjoy,
Bob

[Rocket]

Hi,

Sorry for my total ignorance of this subject but how do you bypass a cap and what does are the benefits if you do?

Regards

Rod

[Bill Baker]

I have used both of these capacitors as bypass. Again, I cannot say one is better than the other as it would depend more on the primary capacitors used. I like OIMP caps in crossovers as the offer a bit of that oil smoothness and seduction while maintaining speed and accuracy at the same time. Much better, in my opinion, than an all oil capacitors such as Jensen or AN. I always use a Teflon to bypass the last capacitor in the series of the high pass filter.

[ctviggen]

Hi,

Sorry for my total ignorance of this subject but how do you bypass a cap and what does are the benefits if you do?

Regards

Rod

The term "bypass capacitor" has a couple of meanings.  In its (probably original) description, a capacitor is used between a positive DC voltage and ground, as discussed here:

http://www.seattlerobotics.org/encoder/jun97/basics.html

If you look at the last figure at the link, that's the typical use being discussed here, which is that a large valued capacitor is "bypassed" by placing a small valued capacitor in parallel with the large valued capacitor.  In terms of strict theory, this should have no difference, as capacitance adds in parallel.  However, in terms of reality, each capacitor really has not only capacitance but also resistance (and perhaps some inductance, too).  Therefore, each cap is like a little circuit.  The smaller valued caps have less resistance and inductance and consequently are better at responding to higher frequencies.  The paragraph at the link (right before "summary") explains this fairly well. 

[Bill Baker]

I applaud your willingness to step up and actually describe the sound of these capacitors. There's not many people who:

(1) can hear this

 This depends more on the components being compared. In many situations, the sonic differences are very subtle and often are not easily distinguished.

(2) are willing to share their experience in a concise way

Again, as long as people realize that is this purely personal opinion, I have no problem sharing my thoughts. It is when people start debating or questioning personal opinion that I start pulling back. Why waste the breath.

(3) are willing to share their experience at all, especially as a manufacturer (proprietary secrets and such)

I have never had anything to hide (at least not much). There are a few proprietary secrets that I don't reveal.

(4) have the $$$ or time or inclination to do the comparisons at all

 This is a necessary evil in the development of new product. As a regular consumer, I doubt my research would/could be as thorough.

Thanks for your opinions. They are very welcome in a world of DIY enthusiasts.

 I hope my findings are on par with others and are useful to those who read about them. There is a lot of discussion about capacitor comparison as well as criticism  throughout the DIY community.

[poseidonsvoice]

Bill,

Heartfelt thanks from this diy'er as well. I have always wondered about the sonic differences of the Platinums, VH Audio OIMP and VH Audio Teflons. Now I realize, that you don't lose with any of them and its a matter of 'flavoring' to taste. Reminds me of cooking. It needs time, money and a willingness to experiment. It's called R&D.

Best,
Anand.

[Bill Baker]

Thanks Anand,
 Like cooking, it is a matter of coming up with a recipe the best suits your personal "taste". Although sometimes in audio, you don't want any added flavor. With amplifiers, I prefer to go for purity and let consumers do the flavoring. Whether it be with cables, tubes, etc.