[whubbard]

This is Open Source high end at its best, and I really appreciate the work, the passion, and the willingness to share.  It also takes faith, and a certain risk - West for example, spending $780, West, go to the top of the class!!  Thank you all!!

Working with preamps & amps that are as top class as yours, it takes a lot to get them to that next level.

Thanks Guys,
#1  If it's better, it generally costs more
Hugh

You seem to have ignored that when pricing your gear. 

So I guess its a thanks to you Hugh!

-West

p.s. Here is a link to the Solen's. I don't think they will be found cheaper, as this is direct from the manufacture. I have contacted them to ask about price breaks https://www.solen.ca/pub/cms_nf_catalogue_fiche.php?id=1396&recherche=&numRows=10&manufacturiers=26&niveau1=1&niveau2=3&niveau3=

[kyrill]

i found this about among others, the Platinum
http://www.tempoelectric.com/caps.htm

[AKSA]

Kyrill,

Don't believe everything you read here - I have tried the RT from RelCap and I'm absolutely convinced polystyrene is not as good as the teflon.  I did not see his test rig, either, so there are still some questions to be raised.

Cheers,

Hugh

[stvnharr]

i found this about among others, the Platinum
http://www.tempoelectric.com/caps.htm

Kyrill,
Good find, and good read.  It's all subject to interpretation, and inherent biases of the testers, of course.  I tend to find with these things that when one finds one's favorite thing at the top then it's all GREAT, but when one's favorite is not favorably found, then it's AN INHERENTLY FLAWED TEST.

Steve

[whubbard]

Might find this interesting as well: http://www.sixmoons.com/audioreviews/caprolling/caps.html
I think it affects all of us more as well. He makes a very good which is that certain caps might be highly regarded, but at the end of the day, it what works well in a certain circuit and what sound good to your ears. From what people have said here, in Hugh's products, it’s the platinum.

Now if someone was willing to conduct these tests with the GK-1, have multiple listeners, and then a list like this was produced...I would say it mattered more. Clearly certain caps will just work better in certain places.

-West

EDIT: Also I realized that we can get the Solens from Michael Percy for $30 per matched (1%) pair as long as we buy at least 5 caps. He might also be able to give a litter bit bigger of a discount for a lot more, but its doubtful as his prices are already extremely low, especially considering he will match the caps to 1%.

[kyrill]

i found this about among others, the Platinum
http://www.tempoelectric.com/caps.htm

Kyrill,
Good find, and good read.  It's all subject to interpretation, and inherent biases of the testers, of course.  I tend to find with these things that when one finds one's favorite thing at the top then it's all GREAT, but when one's favorite is not favorably found, then it's AN INHERENTLY FLAWED TEST.

Steve

Do have C4 and C7 the same value? I have to find my building instructions somewhere to find out

  you start to understand  human nature, w e l c o m e my dear friend

[RonR]

Hi all,

Here's an update on the C4 and C7 testing so far:

The GK-1 boards have been returned to "Mildly Tweaked" status, reversing the "Ginger" mod which affects C4, and others which use off-board components.

For the record, The GK-1 is now stock except for:

C1 = Sonicap Platinum 1uF
C6 = Oscon 47uF 20V
C11 + C12 = Nichicon Gold Tune 100uF 63V
C10 + C14 = Nichicon KZ 100uF 50V
C19 = Original 10nF Polystyrene bypassed with 120pF Polystyrene
C21 = Original 1uF Auricap bypassed with 4.7nF RTE
There are Riken Ohms at the following positions: R5, R9, R11, R22, R26a, R26b.

Next up was fitting the Wimas into the C4 and C7 positions. After drilling 2 small holes to accomodate the lead spacing, they fit on the board! See here for details: http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?action=gallery;area=browse;album=423

Testing Method:
I can usually detect the downgrade of a component much easier than an upgrade, so I thought I'd start with the Wimas (as they're in there already), then the Solens, then Wimas again, with my previous best, Black Gate 'N' (C4) + Oscon (C7) to finish.

The output to the LF55s will be taken from the Sub-Out connectors, so as to only include the SS section in the tests. This should make differentiating between the caps easier.

Next Step:
I need to fit the boards into the case and start burning in!

Cheers,

Ron.

[kyrill]

nice Ron

I will follow this post as a hungry eagle a fat rabbit(z) 
PS the C19 is a very  import node in the musical network

is this the best "tweak" you can soundwise think of?

[RonR]

Hi Kyrill,

I was thinking of putting the V-Cap TFTFs at C19, but if I take the output of the SS circuit though a stepped attenuator and into the LF55s, the whole Valve stage is bypassed, including C19.

First of all let me say I'm no EE. Not even close! Both Hugh and the tweaking community here have given the GK-1 stellar performance, which I am in awe of! Philip was the one to suggest replacing C4 and C7 with Solens, I just proposed the use of the smaller Wimas.

However, I do have one or two ideas around earthing and power supplies to investigate, but they require lots of time for design and testing, which I try to fit in around my day job, family commitments, etc..... Rest assured, If I do find something that gives an improvement, it'll be published here.

BTW, the capacitor tests you referred to in an earlier post were conducted with all Valve equipment. i.e. High voltages across the capacitors under test. Caps do have different characteristics depending on the DC component of the voltage across them, which could explain why there are so many differing results.

Cheers,

Ron

[kyrill]

Hi Kyrill,

I was thinking of putting the V-Cap TFTFs at C19, but if I take the output of the SS circuit though a stepped attenuator and into the LF55s,  the whole Valve stage is bypassed, including C19.??for a sub woofer OK, but for midrange and highs as well? I will surely miss the tube 3D and "gestalt" unless one uses a tube  power amp?

First of all let me say I'm no EE. Not even close! Both Hugh and the tweaking community here have given the GK-1 stellar performance, which I am in awe of! Philip was the one to suggest replacing C4 and C7 with Solens, I just proposed the use of the smaller Wimas.

However, I do have one or two ideas around earthing and power supplies to investigate, but they require lots of time for design and testing, which I try to fit in around my day job, family c -----------------------
Cheers,

Ron

[RonR]

Hi Kyrill,

This setup is just for testing, to make it easier to hear the effect of the Cap changes. Once testing's finished, I'll revert to the Tube stage output. There's no way I could live long term witout the Valves!

Cheers,

Ron

[kyrill]

Ahh..
you had me worried, but in vain

[AKSA]

Ron, Kyrill,

I had a long response to Ron's post set up yesterday, but it slipped away during a clumsy keyboard manoeuvre, perhaps because the bloody cat was on my lap at the time.....  (I love cats, I often feel the world's problems vanish when you stroke a cat).

Ron, thank you for this seminal work.  One of the engineering truths seems to relate to size and quality;  if C4 is to be really good, it will be LARGE.  I suspect that the Solen will be the go, but if the Wima, with its much smaller size, does the job nicely, then we are quids ahead.  Are they 22uF or 47uF?

The quality of C7 is very important, too.  This is because the front end of the SS section is highly susceptible to noise injection, and C4 and C7 shunt this noise to ground, preventing it getting into the long tailed pair, T1/T2.  Better caps in these positions will a quieter preamp make.....

I don't think C19 can be much improved upon, a polystyrene is just fine here, and in any event no AC current flows because it's driving an ultra-high impedance tube grid (4.3M).  C21 might go well if you bypass it with a 47nF teflon, just to pick up on high frequencies.

Aside from that, I can think of no other caps which matter.  C18 shunts noise from the tube supply;  it could be bypassed with a 470nF teflon, I guess, but it would be very bulky;  C20 carries signal, but to the drone cathode follower, which merely serves power supply duties, not in the audio chain;  C10/C12 might be replaced with Black Gates but even there I doubt it would have much effect.

Cheers,

Hugh

[gerado]

Hugh,

That is really useful

Thank you +++

Theo

[RonR]

Hi Hugh,

The Wimas are 22uF, the 47uFs are massive in comparison, somewhere around 10x the volume!

I have 20uF 250V Solens for the comparison, so the Cap values will be fairly close. There are also some Sonicap Gen I 20uF 200V in the parts box - there might be time to try these out as well.

Cheers,

Ron

[jules]

Hugh,

thanks for all the information.

I hope this isn't getting into the territory of trade secrets but it seems C4 relates to higher frequency while C7 is presumably lower frequency? Is there overlap here or from the point of view of listening tests, is there some sort of midpoint/frequency above which it's mainly C4 and below which we're listening to C7 or is this entirely too simplistic  .... or just wrong 

jules

[whubbard]

Ron - Have you by chance gotten around to doing a comparison with the Solens & Wimas yet? The Sonicaps Gen I will also be an interesting comparison.

I think a group buy might be the way to go no matter which cap we choose, but I just want to make sure we pick right first. Also if we go with the Solens, since Michael Percy has a great price already, so the 10% won't be a gigantic discount, but I guess at the end of the day its still a discount. Also, Solen themselves was telling me the price would be $15 per cap, which would be unmatched, and compared with michael percy's $14.85 (10 caps or more) for 1% matched caps, it makes no sense to go direct from Solen.

With the Wimas, the discount would probably be more than with the Solens, but I have somewhat of a gut feeling the solens will sound better.

-West

[gerado]

I dont care what you guys do

as long as you count me in 

[kyrill]

me too

Hugh could you find in your mail with search  all previous sold GK-1

and provide the emails ( not with this forum of course)  so one of us can warn them for this "opportunity"?
kyrill

[AKSA]

Hi Kyrill,

Sadly, to go through all my records, hundreds of them in a BIG filing cabinet, and pull out emails would:

1.  Take about ten hours,
2.  Deliver many old, unworkable email addresses, and
3.  Violate privacy, at least in the eyes of a few (whom one must consider first!!).

I really don't want to do this;  my take on this issue is that AKSAphiles know there is a forum, all they have to do is log on and show their interest!!  I set it up through AC precisely so it could be a semi-formal, anonymous (viz lurker) point of contact with the provision to use the PM channel directly to me.

I have been asked to do this before, of course, and to my discredit have never set up an effective database of this information since tax law requires hard copy of all transactions made out at the time of sale.  Consequently, I'm reluctant, with my very limited manpower, that I want to duplicate that effort when so many technical and marketing issues dominate my waking hours.

Come to Oz, Kyrill, be my house guest, and have complete access to all my files!!  It's not so difficult, lots of dollars, four barbiturates, and two long sleeps, and you're here!!  I will pay you with kafe and foccacia!!

I think you'd like Australia......

Cheers,

Hugh