[mdfoy]

Is there a point of where the price and performance of digital <cd, transport + dac,sacd,....> is as good as vinyl? For example, is an excellent $X.00 vinyl rig better than any $X.00 digital set-up?

[TONEPUB]

I've chased down this rabbit hole pretty far and there
is some overlap.  I have heard some digital players that
I have enjoyed quite a lot at various price points, but
usually analog still comes out on top in terms of air,
dimensionality and capturing the ultimate tonality
of music.

However, it does depend on what kind of music you listen
to.  If you are a big classical lover, you may never find
the ultimate nirvana with a CD player.

Also, it may depend on how picky you are as well.  I do
this every day for a living and by the nature of the job
have had to become fussier than I would if I were just
doing it for fun.

Last but not least, it's a lot easier to get analog WRONG
(setup, etc) so in that sense good CD is more enjoyable
and certainly a lot easier than bad analog.

Hopefully I haven't been to wishy washy here.

So far, my favorite CD players have been pretty spendy,
but good enough that if I couldn't have analog anymore
I'd be a happy camper!

[Wayner]

I've found that a poorly recorded CD or vinyl record will sound bad on anything. And inversely, a great recording on either format sounds wonderful. Many people think that because it's one one media or another that that makes it good/bad. Case in point here; Thomas Dolby's "Flat Earth" is a great sonically recorded piece of music. It is fun to listen to with either format (I have CD and record). I have many bad examples, but I don't want to open that can of worms.\

W aa

[lazydays]

I own two turn tables and four digital devices (actually I own five, but this one is used as a DVD player in a HT system). Turntables are somewhat of a pain to setup, but it's getting easier all the time with the new alignment tools. CD's are plug and play.
    I listen to CD's much more than the turntable just because I can do something else at the sametime without worrying. But if I'm setting down in my easy chair just listening to music, it'll almost always be an LP. None of my cd / sacd players sound as good as a turntable. The Marantz at times gets close, but never the equal.
gary

[TheChairGuy]

Bingo, bingo, binglo and bingo - you rolled my entire belief up better than I ever have 

As a wade more into classical, no CD player makes the cut.  Piano and string instruments simply don't sound right...tho CD for Rock and roll is a great device (AC/DC's 'Back in Black' is so much more guttural than on even pristine vinyl).

Again, great summary, Jeff 

I've chased down this rabbit hole pretty far and there
is some overlap.  I have heard some digital players that
I have enjoyed quite a lot at various price points, but
usually analog still comes out on top in terms of air,
dimensionality and capturing the ultimate tonality
of music.

However, it does depend on what kind of music you listen
to.  If you are a big classical lover, you may never find
the ultimate nirvana with a CD player.

Also, it may depend on how picky you are as well.  I do
this every day for a living and by the nature of the job
have had to become fussier than I would if I were just
doing it for fun.

Last but not least, it's a lot easier to get analog WRONG
(setup, etc) so in that sense good CD is more enjoyable
and certainly a lot easier than bad analog.

[Wayner]

If you had a DAC by Audio by Van Alstine, you wouldn't be so quick on the jump. When I think my LP's are the great thing, I go into the other room, where the MartinLogans are, in the land of CD's and then I get hit by this CD stuff. It's back and forth. I will say that I think my six turntables are set up better than most. I know what albums are capable of and John, I do love them. There are some CD's through Franks DAC that will challenge that.

[beachbum]

for me and i listen to classic rock and roll more than anything vinyl is king by a long shot, of course you have to be the judge, it really doesnt matter what anyone says here or anywhere,  as long as you are happy with what your system is sounding like thats all that matters, the hobby is about music and how it sounds to you, not how many of this and that you have, the longer you wade through equipment the longer you wait to enjoy the music, or something like that,

[Scotty]

Deleted non relevent information. What TONEPUB said more or less.
Scotty

[mdfoy]

I thank each and everyone one of you for your replies.

I am building a 2 ch system, consisting of odyssey khartago and tempest, and av123 strata mini.  I am currently looking for a good CDP, as my collection of music is entirely CD.  I posted because while researching on the web and the media, I see an analogue vs digital divide, and was wandering how much a person would have to spend on a CDP to be "as good as analog".  I have listened set-ups in audio shops all over eastern PA, NJ, and NYC, and have discovered that CDPs can, and do sound good, but the biggest difference maker in sound quality were the speakers. Am I missing something here?

[Wind Chaser]

I have listened set-ups in audio shops all over eastern PA, NJ, and NYC, and have discovered that CDPs can, and do sound good, but the biggest difference maker in sound quality were the speakers. Am I missing something here?

You are absolutely correct on all accounts.  CDP's can and do sound good and speakers do make the biggest difference.  And for the record, I'm not one of those people that will make a wholesale statement that analogue is better than CD.  There's good analogue and crap analogue.  I know, I've owned both.  Wayner's comment, I've found that a poorly recorded CD or vinyl record will sound bad on anything. And inversely, a great recording on either format sounds wonderful is so true.  That is the fundamental fact that determines how good any medium will be.

[JLM]

This is a audio apples vs. oranges question. 

Years ago a friend gave me an old Thorens TT (I'd owned a much nicer Thorens base, English arm, a good cart before CD, probably worth $2000 today) with a cheap cart.  I don't know what this old Thoren's is worth, but any new $30 disc player would stomp it in a variety of ways.  I don't know how cheap you can go with a new or used TT and still get something folks might agree on as being "audiophile quality" (maybe $500 new?), but a new Oppo universal player with respectable quality can be delivered to your door for $150. 

Take care to check to see how bouncy your floors are too.  Last time I got the old Thorens out it was to expose my kids to vinyl and we had to tiptoe on 50 year old wooden floors to avoid skips.

[nickspicks]

i just got an old thorens, and it smokes my digital front end.

the key to good analog is clean records.  its hard to enjoy listening to them when they make noise.  But when its clean and quiet, its really nice.

[WEEZ]

mdfoy,

If all of your music is on CD, I don't understand the question.

WEEZ

[mdfoy]

Weez,

I posed the question for information only.  I am just getting back into audio, after a long absence,  and was wondering if I was alone in my impressions.  I had a vinyl set-up in the last system that I had, and CD was just starting to come into play.  I continued to follow the industry through the media, and stopping in shops every once in a while, and noticed this "difference in opinion".

[WEEZ]

I didn't mean to come off as 'cold' , just confused.

Do you have a budget in mind for a cd spinner?

WEEZ

[JoshK]

Lots of good advise here, including Tonepub's, Wayner's.  For me it is all about the music.  If you have a lot of LPs, then by all means spend the money to get a good LP setup, if not skip it and spend the money on the CD player.  I personally don't see the point in investing in a TT when you don't have LPs.  You want to enjoy the music you already have.

Like Tonepub said, a lot has to do with your taste in music.  If you like a lot of modern music, LP might not be right for you since a small fraction of new releases are on LP.  If you have a multitude of old Jazz, classical or classic rock LPs, then LP is hard to beat, may be impossible. I say let the music guide you.

I have both CD and TT, but my TT is mostly for my collection of classic rock LPs my father gave me.  I don't buy many new LPs except for collecting and for some of my favorite bands where I have a copy on each format.

[woodsyi]

Josh makes a very good point.  For me as a student of opera, I can't do with out LPs.  Sure you can get the most famous recordings on  CDs but so many recordings of good productions from the past exist only on vintage vinyl.  By the same token, almost all new recordings of the current productions are in CDs.  So, I have both.  Of course, the best is to hear live in person. 

[mdfoy]

Weez,

No need for apology, I did not take it the wrong way. I am trying to keep the price around $1000.00.  I have gotten so much information on this site in all of the different forums.  There are so many options at this price, new and used.  I have listened to rega apollo, mcintosh ?, rotel ?, musical fidelity a?, nad master series, naim ?, so far. I am going on a listening tour next weekend, any recommendations?

[eric the red]

I own an Apollo (my last cdp and I've had MANY) and was curious as to what all the recent fuss was about regarding vinyl 20 years after selling my LPs and TT (stupid  ). Bought a nice Planar 2 with a Linn cartridge on it and a Bellari phono stage off the 'gone about 5 months ago and really really wanted to like vinyl again. Plugged everything in, was very underwhelmed by the sound, sold the Bellari, gave away my LPs and the TT went back in the closet. Last month my friend who has a really crappy vinyl set-up but @ 1000 LPs dragged me to a few record shows and I picked up 30 LPs and figured I'd give them one last shot. Bought a Grado Prestige Red off a fellow ACer and a Hagerman Cornet2 off another, hooked everything up yesterday and was expecting to be underwhelmed again and done with vinyl forever. Wrong. All I can say is WOW! The music that comes out of this $600.00 vinyl rig is amazing. Every bit (sadly) as good as the $1000.00 Apollo and I love the Apollo. I can't even imagine what a better TT would sound like and am already thinking of upgrading my TT . Plus there is something cool about not only getting LPs for about a buck each but handling the records and looking at and reading the covers and seeing the black circles spin. As Johnny Miller would say "That's good stuff".

[WEEZ]

mdfoy,

They are difficult to find, but if you can listen to a CEC player..do so, if you like 'analog' sound.

Otherwise, what eric said.

WEEZ