[Big Red Machine]

[/quote]

Good post. That pretty much sums up my feelings as well. For the record, I sold my UFW-10's last week and am going to purchase an SVS PC-Ultra on Monday. I initially wanted to get two MFW-15's, but with all the problems I've been reading about I scratched them from my list. I haven't read one bad thing about the SVS. I've been dreaming about my next set of speakers and I'm pretty sure they'll either be Salk, Selah Audio, or possibly the new GR OB's - if the price for them is reasonable. I WANTED the Ref-4's, but they never made it to production.
[/quote]

Don't forget the Submersive.  Mark's having a sale and mine was 1895 delivered.  Took one week to get because he had the parts in stock.

[musicmaniac]

It's sure nice to "see" everyone.  I'd like to buy everyone a beer.  Bartender!

Can I substitute mine for a Jack & Coke ?

+1  Hopefully they don't close this place down. 

[drunkonjack]

Are you buying the next round?

I have a pocket full of money and I'm thirsty 

[django11]

Geez, I changed my e-mail addy and locked myself out of the forum last night,  just when I was going to buy a round ( Jack and Coke ? that sounds terrible,  I always thought bourbon was a macho cowboy drink but it tastes like fruit punch ) .

So yeah, I locked myself out just when I was going  to say something nice about Craigsub...   What was it again 

[TomS]

Just want to extend an AC welcome to all the refugees.  Yes, this is a pretty friendly place on the audio planet, though with so much growth, AC attracts some misfits at times too.  Of course, there are common sense rules regarding behavior, particularly discussion about individuals, politics, religion, etc.  Guidelines here: http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=42856.0  Oh, and we have a "Sports Bar" circle for everything non-audio, including liquor (especially scotch!) and things deemed NSFW (not suitable for women) 

Note also that this is AV123's own spot in the "Manufacturer's Mall", and is actually facilitated by MLS since Sean is no longer with AV123.  If you're looking for broader discussion on subs, for example, the "Audio Central" circle might get you some good traffic and impartial advice on non-AV123 products compared to theirs.  It also wouldn't be subject to AV123 facilitation in that location.  There are many great sub/speaker manufacturers with circles here, some already mentioned, so take a look at ACI, DIYCables, Selah, GR, Salk, VMPS, Omega, Horneshoppe, Von Schweikert, Odyssey, SP Tech, RAW, AudioKinesis circles, among others.

As a "2+ year wait club member" for LS-9's and a satisfied owner of several AV123 products myself, I hope MLS sorts it all out.  Perhaps having a "fall out" is part of the grand plan to become less of a social networking site and more of a manufacturer's forum anyway.  So far, I suppose it's working.  Who really knows, other than Mark, so it doesn't really contribute much to speculate further.  He's gonna do what he's gotta do.

Life goes on, so don't let all this change drag you down.  It's just change and it's a big world with plenty of room for everyone.  And it's still just a hobby so jump in and have some fun...  Try some of the other circles and make some new friends while you're at it.  It's a great place.

[django11]

+1  Hopefully they don't close this place down. 

What's with AVS anyway?  They are kind of trigger happy over there...

[django11]

I think all of my posts so far have gone against the posting guidelines.    Sorry...

[droht]

Come on django1, you're gonna get us blackballed here as well.     Maybe we need some sort of independent site where we are free to speak as we please.  There must be something like that somewhere...

The cool thing about av123 forum in the "good old days", that I don't really see elsewhere, is you had the feeling of hanging out in a neighborood bar with a bunch of guys talking audio.  Not a lot of rules to follow or restrictions to worry about, and no need for them either.  Threads could go in any direction and no one whined; people joked and ribbed one another a bit; there was a general give and take without things getting crazy.  Maybe the sheer number of folks there has doomed it.  Now it's more like a packed nightclub with blaring muisc that you have to scream over to be heard.  Not sure mls or anyone can "fix" it, just maybe manage it a bit better understanding that it will be different.

[TomS]

Hey guys, I'm NOT a moderator (thank heavens), just pointing out this Circle is Mark's forum on AC.  There is PLENTY of room all over AC to speak freely so carry on...

[arthurs]

Good post and good follow up Tom.  I think all the posts to date are well within the spirit of AC, if not the "letter of the law" and would also encourage new transferees to check out the whole site as Tom said, there's a lot of good people, information, and discussion here on AC   

[django11]

Come on django1, you're gonna get us blackballed here as well.     Maybe we need some sort of independent site where we are free to speak as we please.  There must be something like that somewhere...

The cool thing about av123 forum in the "good old days", that I don't really see elsewhere, is you had the feeling of hanging out in a neighborood bar with a bunch of guys talking audio.  Not a lot of rules to follow or restrictions to worry about, and no need for them either.  Threads could go in any direction and no one whined; people joked and ribbed one another a bit; there was a general give and take without things getting crazy.  Maybe the sheer number of folks there has doomed it.  Now it's more like a packed nightclub with blaring muisc that you have to scream over to be heard.  Not sure mls or anyone can "fix" it, just maybe manage it a bit better understanding that it will be different.

I get the feeling that the idea is to turn the av123 forum in to a regular manufacturer's forum otherwise what is happening is senseless.  You don't alienate a bunch of people just for fun.  Do you?   It seems pretty nice here but the size is a bit daunting.  We will see...

[django11]

Hey guys, I'm NOT a moderator (thank heavens), just pointing out this Circle is Mark's forum on AC.  There is PLENTY of room all over AC to speak freely so carry on...

 
 aa  Thanks!

[arthurs]

Come on django1, you're gonna get us blackballed here as well.     Maybe we need some sort of independent site where we are free to speak as we please.  There must be something like that somewhere...

The cool thing about av123 forum in the "good old days", that I don't really see elsewhere, is you had the feeling of hanging out in a neighborood bar with a bunch of guys talking audio.  Not a lot of rules to follow or restrictions to worry about, and no need for them either.  Threads could go in any direction and no one whined; people joked and ribbed one another a bit; there was a general give and take without things getting crazy.  Maybe the sheer number of folks there has doomed it.  Now it's more like a packed nightclub with blaring muisc that you have to scream over to be heard.  Not sure mls or anyone can "fix" it, just maybe manage it a bit better understanding that it will be different.

I get the feeling that the idea is to turn the av123 forum in to a regular manufacturer's forum otherwise what is happening is senseless.  You don't alienate a bunch of people just for fun.  Do you?   It seems pretty nice here but the size is a bit daunting.  We will see...

You can manage the size of AC through the favorites tab after you explore a bit and narrow down circles that really interest you...

[Digital Ra]

Ah so this is where everybody went!

I've read through this and tend to agree with a lot of what I've read....it's time to find a new place to go.  I found the "neighborhood bar" feeling over at AV123 at one time too but now it's just turned into a soap opera.  Seems to me that once some individuals started having problems and started posting about them and their feelings, many of them negative we have the "I'm taking my toys and going home" mentality.  Sad really!

[MaxCast]

Just want to extend an AC welcome to all the refugees.  Yes, this is a pretty friendly place on the audio planet, though with so much growth, AC attracts some misfits at times too.  Of course, there are common sense rules regarding behavior, particularly discussion about individuals, politics, religion, etc.  Guidelines here: http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=42856.0  Oh, and we have a "Sports Bar" circle for everything non-audio, including liquor (especially scotch!) and things deemed NSFW (not suitable for women) 

Note also that this is AV123's own spot in the "Manufacturer's Mall", and is actually facilitated by MLS since Sean is no longer with AV123.  If you're looking for broader discussion on subs, for example, the "Audio Central" circle might get you some good traffic and impartial advice on non-AV123 products compared to theirs.  It also wouldn't be subject to AV123 facilitation in that location.  There are many great sub/speaker manufacturers with circles here, some already mentioned, so take a look at ACI, DIYCables, Selah, GR, Salk, VMPS, Omega, Horneshoppe, Von Schweikert, Odyssey, SP Tech, RAW, AudioKinesis circles, among others.

As a "2+ year wait club member" for LS-9's and a satisfied owner of several AV123 products myself, I hope MLS sorts it all out.  Perhaps having a "fall out" is part of the grand plan to become less of a social networking site and more of a manufacturer's forum anyway.  So far, I suppose it's working.  Who really knows, other than Mark, so it doesn't really contribute much to speculate further.  He's gonna do what he's gotta do.

Life goes on, so don't let all this change drag you down.  It's just change and it's a big world with plenty of room for everyone.  And it's still just a hobby so jump in and have some fun...  Try some of the other circles and make some new friends while you're at it.  It's a great place.

Great post Tom.  Welcome to everyone from av123 and please do check out the link to the rules-n-stuff in Towne Square.  I hope we can help Mark out with some constructive discussion. I wish him and av123 the best in 2009.

[Hugh]

Morning Art & Tom,

You guys are up early huh?

Hopefully, the bad seed (there is only ONE at this time) won't find this place and spoils it like what he did over there.

I really hope for Mark's sake that he'll wake up somehow and realize something is not working and try to turn things around.

Personally, it is a shame since I truly believe he was at the top of the ID business and now...

[cab]

Damnit!, like I trainwreck, I tried to drive by this without looking, but just couldn't help it!

Anyone remember a little company called Perpetual Technologies?

Anyone remember the promises? The delays? The non-delivery? The excuses? The apologies? The health problems?  DEJA VU???!!

MLS was a gentleman then too....Still is. He hasn't changed.

Anyone doing business with MLS is as much to blame for the problems, disappointments, etc., as MLS is himself. As my Mother use to say, "it only takes a cow once" (electric fence)....Anyone laying out cash on the net should do a little due diligence and make sure of who/what they are dealing with. Anyone who had looked into MLS would have learned that he has a long history of complaints about delays, vaporware, etc.

Apparently he learned little from PT. If he won't or can't change, it is up to the consumer to either shop elsewhere or live with the hassle......

Again, he always comports himself in a professional manner and seems to be a genuinely good guy.

[620gold]

I'm sure a lot of us here will return to AV123 when the forum is back up and running, at least for curiosity's sake. I remember a comment that MLS made in the past year. He said that most of the old timers were gone. He was alluding to past forum members that had stopped posting at AV123. I think that is sort of a natural progression with these forums. People drop off for whatever reason and new ones take their place. And I know that's what AV123 counts on for their business.

[django11]

Care to elaborate about the cow reference for those of us not from cow country?  

[DRL]

Damnit!, like I trainwreck, I tried to drive by this without looking, but just couldn't help it!

Anyone remember a little company called Perpetual Technologies?

Anyone remember the promises? The delays? The non-delivery? The excuses? The apologies? The health problems?  DEJA VU???!!

MLS was a gentleman then too....Still is. He hasn't changed.

Anyone doing business with MLS is as much to blame for the problems, disappointments, etc., as MLS is himself. As my Mother use to say, "it only takes a cow once" (electric fence)....Anyone laying out cash on the net should do a little due diligence and make sure of who/what they are dealing with. Anyone who had looked into MLS would have learned that he has a long history of complaints about delays, vaporware, etc.

Apparently he learned little from PT. If he won't or can't change, it is up to the consumer to either shop elsewhere or live with the hassle......

Again, he always comports himself in a professional manner and seems to be a genuinely good guy.

And there's always a troll lurking...

I think this whole forum shutdown is absolutely WRONG, but I still have several thousand dollars in av123 (and Perpetual Technology) equipment as do thousands of other people.  Very good stuff bought at great prices and for me (and for the majority of av123 customers), delivered on time when promised.