VMPS RM30 at RMAF

musicman · « **on:** 25 Oct 2006, 04:43 pm »

I just wanted to comment on the sound that VMPS was able to achieve in the Bolder Cable room at RMAF. The sound of the RM30's in this room was very beautiful. Wayne Waananen who owns Bolder Cable was in the room when I entered. The RM30's produced deep tight bass, soundstage was spread across the room, the speakers virtually disappeared, mid range and highs were naturally reproduced. This is one of the best speakers I have ever heard; it is a master achievement on the part of Brian Cheney who is the designer. It demonstates what can be achieved when the right drivers are put in the right cabinet, and the right crossover pulls it all together to present one coherent sound. The cabinets were exquisite, the workmanship beyond reproach. The total package represents one of the great values in the industry. The audiophile community owes Brian Cheney a major thank you! I will be ordering a pair of the RM40's.

Brian Cheney · « **Reply #1 on:** 25 Oct 2006, 05:19 pm »

I hope Wayne will weigh in here with his own RMAF impressions.

John Casler · « **Reply #2 on:** 25 Oct 2006, 06:38 pm »

I have received much feedback that the room sounded exquisite.

Wayne being the expert he is, no doubt displayed all the products to their best.

And I would have to agree that 2 RM30's with a LARGER sub would handily compete with some of the best speakers systems available at a fraction of their cost.

Wayne1 · « **Reply #3 on:** 25 Oct 2006, 07:01 pm »

Sorry for not posting earlier. Setting up the room, running it entirely by myself for three days, tear down and loading just kicked my butt.

A great deal of thanks go out to mgalusha and Turk for helping move the gear to the hotel and unload and set up. Same again to Zybar and Sunshinedawg and mgalusha, again, for help with tear down and load out.

The MLS Piano Ebony cabinets that Brian used to build these speakers are exquisite! Everyone who saw them, loved the look of the matching CDWG finish.

MLS had to stop by to look them over. He said while he saw the cabinets in the factory in China, he had not seen the speaker completed. He later brought his wife by to look the speakers over.

Chris Brady of Teres Audio stopped by for a quick listen. He is a BIG horn, low power SET, and vinyl fan. His eyes got very wide and he said he was loving the sound of the VMPS and hard drive sourced audio in this room.

It took a little time to find the right position for the speakers in the room. A great deal of help was the pre-tuning of the putty by Brian.

The Responce Audio 60 WPC KT-88 amp had plenty of power to drive the RM-30 Ms in that hotel room. For a bigger room, having an amp built into the external XO box would take care of any power or volume issues.

I first set the speakers up in my HT room to listen. My first impression of the CDWG was that the vertical "beaming" was gone. After a short listening session, I found that the speakers disappeared completely. I could close my eyes and point to the performers, but I could not point to the speakers.

The combination of the CDWG, OXO, all BOLDER wiring from source to drivers, TRT caps, tube amp, Larger Sub, and Bybee Power conditioner all worked together to deliver one of the most natural and enjoyable systems I have had the pleasure to hear.

Thanks also go to Glenn and Bryan at GIK Acoustics for providing room treatment.

Brian Cheney · « **Reply #4 on:** 25 Oct 2006, 07:57 pm »

The system was great in my soundroom before it left here but there was considerable tuning of the speakers and the sub before I was happy.

In particular sub level and xover frequency were strictly bit-by-bit settings of the controls and the PR damping was dustspeck sized at a time. I'm glad the pretuning worked. I do it on all systems now before we ship.

The Bolder Nitro wire, though labor-intensive, paid off in noticable sonic improvement top to bottom.

Berndt · « **Reply #5 on:** 25 Oct 2006, 09:43 pm »

What was the server you utilized?
Olive or PC?
DAC?

john1970 · « **Reply #6 on:** 25 Oct 2006, 10:18 pm »

Quote from: musicman on 25 Oct 2006, 04:43 pm

I just wanted to comment on the sound that VMPS was able to achieve in the Bolder Cable room at RMAF. The sound of the RM30's in this room was very beautiful. Wayne Waananen who owns Bolder Cable was in the room when I entered. The RM30's produced deep tight bass, soundstage was spread across the room, the speakers virtually disappeared, mid range and highs were naturally reproduced. This is one of the best speakers I have ever heard; it is a master achievement on the part of Brian Cheney who is the designer. It demonstates what can be achieved when the right drivers are put in the right cabinet, and the right crossover pulls it all together to present one coherent sound. The cabinets were exquisite, the workmanship beyond reproach. The total package represents one of the great values in the industry. The audiophile community owes Brian Cheney a major thank you! I will be ordering a pair of the RM40's.

Musicman,

I have owned a pair of RM40s for ~7 months. Recently I sent the speakers back to VMPS for a MLS cabinet upgrade and various other modifications. IMO the rebuilt speaker (with all of the VMPS upgrades) competes (and usually sounds better) than speakers costing 2-3 times the RM40 price. If you are on a budget this is the order that I would personally pick the upgrades:

1) MLS cabinets (an absolute must) The finish is furniture grade and the cabinet has less vibrations than the standard cabinet (due to the use of HDF and increased bracing).

2) TRT capacitor upgrades. A vast improvement in midrange and treble clarity. If too much money go with Auricaps.

3) Supermax OXO (external crossovers with Bolder silver wire throughout)

4) SR71 treatment (addition of Blackhole 5 damping material added to the cabinet).

Best of luck,

John

P.S. If you are in the New England area and would like to hear the RM40s PM me for arrangements.

bpape · « **Reply #7 on:** 25 Oct 2006, 10:40 pm »

Berndt.

The system was purely Wayne's Boulder modded Squeezeboxes with the digital and analog mods. Everything ripped to PC with EAC and FLAC. No preamp, no DAC. All wire was Boulder - mostly Nitro. Boulder powersupplies. SB acted as source and pre-amp with the outs fed directly to the amp - and sounded excellent.

Brian.

Yes - the external xovers were a great help in tuning the speakers to the room and the associated equipment.

Bryan

musicman · « **Reply #8 on:** 25 Oct 2006, 11:02 pm »

John,

Thank you for the hierarchy of options in the VMPS RM40. I am planning on getting all the upgrades with the exception of the outboard crossovers. It is simply a matter of space. I use two (mono) MC 275 amp and they are positioned behind my present speakers on isolation platforms. Having another box to place behind, or on the side of the speaker becomes ungainly.

Nonetheless, I do appreciate your recommendation of what is needed to take the speaker to a higher level of performance. The MLS cabinets are just tremendous. I ran into Mark Schifter who makes these cabinets and told him my reaction to the cabinets; they are simply awesome.

Looking forward to getting these speakers in my home. Based on what I heard at the show, it would be very hard to do better.

john1970 · « **Reply #9 on:** 25 Oct 2006, 11:18 pm »

Musicman,

You are absolutely correct. It is very difficult to do better without spending much more money. I always wished that Brian would have made an RM50 with dual 12" woofers and a 12" passive radiator. The speaker would have been 4" taller and 2" wider to accomodate the larger woofers, but probably would have been flat to 20 Hz.

Just an idea,

John

James Romeyn · « **Reply #10 on:** 27 Oct 2006, 04:46 pm »

Quote from: Wayne1 on 25 Oct 2006, 07:01 pm

Sorry for not posting earlier. Setting up the room, running it entirely by myself for three days, tear down and loading just kicked my butt.

A great deal of thanks go out to mgalusha and Turk for helping move the gear to the hotel and unload and set up. Same again to Zybar and Sunshinedawg and mgalusha, again, for help with tear down and load out....

Thanks also go to Glenn and Bryan at GIK Acoustics for providing room treatment.

Kudos to George (aka Zybar, global moderator) & all members who donated their time to help make RMAF a success for Wayne & all attendees...Sure beats paying $2000 to watch a Teamster drop your components at CES...

James Romeyn · « **Reply #11 on:** 27 Oct 2006, 05:32 pm »

Quote from: musicman on 25 Oct 2006, 11:02 pm

John,

I am planning on getting all the upgrades with the exception of the outboard crossovers. It is simply a matter of space. I use two (mono) MC 275 amp and they are positioned behind my present speakers on isolation platforms. Having another box to place behind, or on the side of the speaker becomes ungainly.

Haven't heard the original & 1st reissue of the MC275, but as someone who auditioned the current model & believes it to be one of the best amps ever, you will have a great combination.

Not to be a pest, but as someone familiar w/ the oxo's advantage w/ fully-optioned 30s & 40s...might you be able to acquire a larger pre-built speaker box from partsexpress.com, or if necessary have someone make a specially sized custom-built box to possibly provide the dual uses of oxo box & amp stand? The speaker L-pads could go on the side of the box, enabling the amp to be sited directly on top. Just a thought.

The 30 & 40, with every possible upgrade, are so close to perfect, & the oxo is such a big part of their success, that deleting the oxo is a true shame, at least IMHO. Elevating your sweet-as-honey-looking tube amps will only advance the look, & won't take up any extra floor space. You could even increase the look further by adding a wood frame around the top edge, to make it look like the box was made for that purpose.

I thought of running the amp's line cord through holes at the top & bottom of the box for a finished look, then it occurred to me that the amp's proximity to the passive xo parts might detract from sound quality. The xo parts could be sited in the box down as low as possible & as far as possible from the amp.

musicman · « **Reply #12 on:** 27 Oct 2006, 08:54 pm »

Jim,

Thank you for the suggestion of stacking the oxo and the Mc 275's. Quite honestly, I did not think of that option, but it is in the realm of possibility. My old friend, Harvey "Gizmo" Rosenberg designed crossovers for a pair of custom Tannoy dual concentric 15" speakers for me. Harvey fully explained to me the advantages of having the crossover in a separate box from the speakers. He was going to come over to my place before he died and pull the crossovers out of the enclosures. That never happened and subsequently the speakers were replaced with another speaker.

Taking the crossovers out of the RM40's will enhance the sound, but it creates another box to deal with; your idea is viable. Reducing the vibrations the crossover is subjected to inside the enclosure by placing it outside the enclosure enhances the overall transparency of the speaker.

I use Mc275's IV version presently with SED winged C KT88's. I also have a set of Reflector KT88's. Both offer excellent sound. What few people know is that when you use the MC275 in mono the sound quality is kicked up a few notches; they sound like SET amps in mono. The amp sounds fine in stereo, but it is a different ballgame when used in the mono mode. Most stores never demo the amps in mono, only stereo, and most people purchase one amp and use it in stereo. When used in mono, the Mc275 will put out close to 180 watts. I think that will be enough juice for the RM40.

Thank you for your idea of how to incorporate the oxo and the amps minimizing the amount of space they would take up; very useful to me.

Musicman

James Romeyn · « **Reply #13 on:** 27 Oct 2006, 09:03 pm »

As good as the MC275 sounded in stereo I would be very pleasantly surprised to hear two in mono mode. Considering value, finish, service, resale, & reliability, it's a wonder tube amp companies compete w/ Macintosh. 180 underated MC tube watts will rock on your 40s; prepare for exceptionally palapable output from the ribbon array. Yuuuuuuuuuu-meeeeeeeeeee!

John Casler · « **Reply #14 on:** 27 Oct 2006, 10:42 pm »

You can order the larger OXO boxes for minimal upcharge, and they now come in a "high gloss" (Piano Black) so the "amp stand" idea is certainly reasonable.

In fact I recently have suggested it to several of my OXO clients.

The Larger OXO boxes can also contain the PBS (Powered Bass System) amp if desired.

John Casler · « **Reply #15 on:** 27 Oct 2006, 10:45 pm »

The box looks something like the center box in the picture below

Brian Cheney · « **Reply #16 on:** 27 Oct 2006, 11:07 pm »

Yes, we buy piano black finish cabinets from Parts Express then cut them to fit whatever is going inside. The .25 cu ft model is fine for passive xovers and the .75 fits both the PBS and the passive mid/treble sections.

The outboard xover is such a step forward that you should make room for it somehow.

zybar · « **Reply #17 on:** 27 Oct 2006, 11:14 pm »

Quote from: RibbonSpeakers.net on 27 Oct 2006, 04:46 pm

Quote from: Wayne1 on 25 Oct 2006, 07:01 pm
Sorry for not posting earlier. Setting up the room, running it entirely by myself for three days, tear down and loading just kicked my butt.

A great deal of thanks go out to mgalusha and Turk for helping move the gear to the hotel and unload and set up. Same again to Zybar and Sunshinedawg and mgalusha, again, for help with tear down and load out....

Thanks also go to Glenn and Bryan at GIK Acoustics for providing room treatment.

Kudos to George (aka Zybar, global moderator) & all members who donated their time to help make RMAF a success for Wayne & all attendees...Sure beats paying $2000 to watch a Teamster drop your components at CES...

The real kudos go to Sean, Mike and Wayne.

I have a bad back and didn't do any heavy lifting. Instead I was the designated hand truck operator.

George

BobRex · « **Reply #18 on:** 27 Oct 2006, 11:27 pm »

Quote from: Brian Cheney on 27 Oct 2006, 11:07 pm

Yes, we buy piano black finish cabinets from Parts Express then cut them to fit whatever is going inside. The .25 cu ft model is fine for passive xovers and the .75 fits both the PBS and the passive mid/treble sections.

The outboard xover is such a step forward that you should make room for it somehow.

You mean I can't get mine in piano rosewood?!?!

Damn! Oh, well, I'll get over it. So, am I the first to get the .75 with the PBS?? Huh? Huh?

Brian Cheney · « **Reply #19 on:** 27 Oct 2006, 11:34 pm »

Yes Bob, yours will be the first RM 30 so configured. I'm posting pix of the piano rosewood finish here in a few days, it's eye-popping. Unlike the "under glass" look of heavily gloss laquered cabinets, the piano rosewood attacks the eye (in a positive way, of course) like nothing I've seen anywhere. You'll need sunglasses.

See what 2 manhours of buffing can do for you? And we do it here, on premises.

TRT's due end of next week, after which you can expect prompt shipment.