What gets 70 Hz?

Hantra · « **on:** 19 Jun 2003, 05:16 am »

I have this major problem around 70 Hz in my room, and it SUCKS. Listening to bluegrass, and acoustic stuff, there is a LOT of activity right around there in the alternating bass lines.

This is beginning to get on my nerves. It's such a BOOM right there on that frequency, and then the other note of the alternating bass line is just fine. . .

I have been thinking about trying a Behringer Ultra-Curve to correct it, but I am afraid that will degrade my analog. . .

Any ideas?

B

Tyson · « **Reply #1 on:** 19 Jun 2003, 05:24 am »

You can either do bass traps tuned to 70hz, or you can go active w/ dual subs, high quality crossover, and digital EQ. QSC amps have a neat EQ module that fits right to the output of the amp, and there is a program you can load to your computer that will do real time analysis on your room and makes taming bass nodes very, very easy.

Hantra · « **Reply #2 on:** 19 Jun 2003, 05:28 am »

Heh. . . Either of those options would probably cost the same too. Bass traps are expensive!

Thanks for the input!!

B

Tyson · « **Reply #3 on:** 19 Jun 2003, 05:31 am »

JMHO, but I think dual subs are the way to go. Takes a load off the main speakers, and gives a lot of flexibility in tuning the bass to your liking, and is especially usefull if you have uneven bass loading in your room. Plus, it lets you put your main speakers WAY out in to the room for best imaging and soundstage, while still giving you a lot of bass power.

JohnR · « **Reply #4 on:** 19 Jun 2003, 07:04 am »

FWIW you could perhaps try the "super quick and dirty" basstraps to see what effect they have...

http://www.geocities.com/jonrisch/a2.htm

MaxCast · « **Reply #5 on:** 19 Jun 2003, 11:55 am »

Heh, at least you don't have a hole at 80Hz's. I think I will eventually have two subs, but I Didn't want to cross over that high, or buy a crossover. We shall see.

8thnerve · « **Reply #6 on:** 19 Jun 2003, 01:42 pm »

Attenuating one frequency with an acoustic product is very challenging. It is almost impossible with an absorptive product to not affect all the other frequencies in the audible range as well. I have a VERY early R&D project that would achieve this but you won't see it for quite some time. I think the best solution at this time is the Rives Audio PARC. I understand that it is entirely analog and only affects frequencies below 350 Hz and will only attenuate those frequencies, so it won't provide any gain for bass holes.

http://www.rivesaudio.com/PARCframes/PARCframes.html

As far as quality, the $100,000 Avantgarde room at the SF Stereophile show this year was using one, so you might be able to live with it.

Best of Luck.

8thnerve · « **Reply #7 on:** 19 Jun 2003, 02:01 pm »

But you didn't just want a $2800 solution did you? ART makes a very inexpensive EQ you could use. I would assume that the quality is better than normal crap out there, and could probably be modded to good effect. And then you could always build a PARC. Once you know what frequency you need to attenuate, run your signal through a little box that has a filter network to notch out that frequency. Maybe your buddy Scott could help you out??

This has me thinking Hantra... you are creating work for me in the near future, I can see it.

Hmmmm.

brad b · « **Reply #8 on:** 19 Jun 2003, 02:37 pm »

I have the same thing around 60 hz. I purchased a used Marchand X9 which allows me to pick my crossover point between my Diluceos and REL. I found this to be the ticket, because as Tyson says, I can move the monitors out into the room, retain the midbass, but lose the boom.
Brad

Wayne1 · « **Reply #9 on:** 19 Jun 2003, 02:57 pm »

The QSC DSP-4 CAN be used with ANY amplifier. It is easier to use with QSC amps because some of them have a connector built into them so it can be plugged right into it.

http://www.qscaudio.com/products/dsp/dsp4/dsp4.htm

You will need to get a small power supply to use with it and you will need adaptors to go from the XLR ins and outs to your gear. It comes with the software you can load into your computer. You just need to hook up to the RS-232 port on it. This is a very powerful unit and it can also be used as a crossover among other things.

This is the DSP we used to EQ the sub at MAF. Everyone has commented on how seamless the whole thing sounded.

I do not sell QSC products but I do USE them. I have a QSC amp and the DSP-4 used with my sub in my system.

8thnerve · « **Reply #10 on:** 19 Jun 2003, 04:10 pm »

Or of course, the most obvious answer is the Eighth Nerve Framed Response Controllers. They will attenuate at those frequencies and reduce some of that boom you are wrestling with. Will it completely eliminate the node, no, that would be unlikely. But it may attenuate it enough to not bother you, and without compromising the signal path. As with any of our products, if it doesn't work, send it back to us.

Hantra · « **Reply #11 on:** 19 Jun 2003, 04:15 pm »

Wayne:

Is the QSC a good enough amp to use for bi-amping the Piegas? It would have to handle things below 500Hz. . .

That may be a tasty solution to use one with that module, and just bi-amp. .

Thx!!!!

B

Wayne1 · « **Reply #12 on:** 19 Jun 2003, 04:54 pm »

B,

I use it for everything below 80hz in my HT. I did use two of them when I had a pair of 626Rs and Original subs in my office.

I do like the sound of them very much. They are designed for full range sound in concert systems and theaters. They pack a LOT of power in a small case. If would be worth giving them a try. See if there is a pro audio shop in your area that carries them and will let you try them out.

Sorry for hi-jacking the thread, Nathan

Juan R · « **Reply #13 on:** 19 Jun 2003, 07:34 pm »

I dont know about 70hz, but since I have the 8th. nerve room treatment ,the sound is from night to day, a complete sound environment, I had to lowered my pots to 9:30 and 9:00 , add putty(somethig that I thought impossible) my R-40 are incredible in bass, no echos, and midrange with powerful front(my taste). I did not believe that a bunch of pillows( as my wife call them) will create so fantastic sound.

nathanm · « **Reply #14 on:** 19 Jun 2003, 08:06 pm »

Hantra have you considered, say a PEQ-220 which could notch out that 70Hz resonance (and then some) like nobody's business and for a very inexpensive price? I think I saw someone here selling some. Oh look, I just happened to find it completely on accident - isn't that convenient!

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=2415

Hantra · « **Reply #15 on:** 20 Jun 2003, 01:39 am »

Hey Nathan:

Does this work like the Ultracurve? In the digital domain?

B

JohnR · « **Reply #16 on:** 20 Jun 2003, 02:41 am »

Oops I didn't realize this thread was in the 8thnerve circle

So do the Framed controllers act just like bass traps?

nathanm · « **Reply #17 on:** 20 Jun 2003, 06:06 pm »

Quote from: Hantra

Hey Nathan:Does this work like the Ultracurve? In the digital domain?

No it's analog!

Pure analogue sounde, no harsh digital jittery coldness! It's like vinyl actually...living breathing warmth and total musical involvement! Lush midrange, liquid highs, tauterific slamming bass and delicate upper air and smoothness. An ear opener, and no mistake! Did I mention about the veils? They will be lifted. I swear to you.

8thnerve · « **Reply #18 on:** 22 Jun 2003, 04:24 pm »

Quote from: JohnR

So do the Framed controllers act just like bass traps?

Not entirely. The framed response is a beefier seam essentially. It attenuates much more sound pressure and at lower frequencies since the absorptive material is 5" thick. The frame also absorbs more of the sound traveling along the wall and pressure in the corner (when it is placed there) as the entire side of the frame is open to the absorptive material, with as little obstruction as possible. As with all the 8th Nerve products, the front side is reflective, and they can be mounted flush on the wall or ceiling, or in a corner with the available corner mount. They are 36" tall so two on top of each other in the corner make a fantastic solution for the corners of your room.

These are the products we use almost exclusively in schools, gymnasiums, churches and other commercial spaces. We are almost done releasing a larger frame which we plan to use for these larger spaces, but the frame will continue to be used for corners and for home and smaller rooms.

The main difference between the framed response and bass traps is that bass traps are designed to attenuate bass frequencies, while the framed response is a full range product that works down to lower frequencies than the other Response Controllers.

WilliamL · « **Reply #19 on:** 23 Jun 2003, 12:18 am »

Over in another related thread, Hair of the Dawg wrote:

Quote

On the 70 hz thread, is there any way to make your idea tunable? Not everyone has the skills or equipment to isolate the offending frequency, but if you could make it to be so over the small range mentioned in the thread...

[/b]

Yes, we have been working on initial designs along these lines. Our designer (posting as 8th Nerve in this thread and others) can elaborate on this better than I can....

By the way, my guess is that in a few years this guy is going to be known as one of the top designers in audio.

Bill