[ka7niq]

Plumbers putty!
Yep, could NOT find rope caulk at any Home Depot, so I used Plumbers putty.
I wouldn't recommend it, it is not as sticky, but it allowed me to take the Quarters off the passives, and start over.
For those who  don't follow my posts, I have a used pair of TRT Spiral tweeters RM 40's I purchased used locally.
I lost the putty for them, and in desperation, stuck quarters to the passives with the small remaining amount of putty I had.

Here is what I have found so far, in my room, with my equipment.

# 1 - I am in a quite large room, and I have subwoofers, so I did NOT tune for lowest bass.
In fact, I did NOT tune for bass at all. at first.
I removed ALL the putty from one speaker at a time, and kept adding match head sized amounts until I got as much bass as I could W/O destroying the midrange.

I found an excellent CD for doing this, it is the German Techno Rock band "Real McCoy" doing their hit song "Run Away"

I find it to have all the info I need to tune the 40's.
It has a punchy bass line that is repeated over and over in the song, a female singer wailing "Run away, run away, runaway and save your life"
Then, after she repeats that over and over, a male voice comes in solo.
There is a synthesizer that sounds like it is coming from outside both speakers.

In my room, if you tune the 40's bass too low, the male singer loses his chest.
Brian is right, the passive tuning is for the midrange!
IF you tune for lowest bass, in my experience, you rob your speakers of the midrange body that these are capable of.
If you do this, soon you will join the ranks of those looking for that "majic amp" wire, preamp, or tubes to "make" your speaker sound good.

I admit, I did this, and tried to rely on my level controls to 'compensate'.
BIG MISTAKE!

It is very difficult to get any dynamic driver to match the speed and low coloration of the ribbon.
The midwoofer tuning MUST be just right, or you will not get the performance in your RM 40 you expected.

And, on my speakers, in my room, with my stuff, it means giving up a LITTLE low bass, for so much more.

But ... that's what subwoofers are for, right ?

Though I have an electronic crossover here in house, it might just sit in it's box.

I now have the rich, warm, full lower midrange I was looking for, and I am not even using my "good stuff" either!

My Moscode 600 and Adcom 585 are both broken, as is my tube preamp.

I am just using a "lowly" Parasound P/SP 1000 in it's bypass mode, and a highly modified Ashly FET 500, a "pro sound" amp, LOL

The Ashly has Poly bypassed power supply caps, and bigger then stock filter caps of low ESR.
It's feedback has been reduced, it;s bias increased, and all good quality caps used in the feedback loop.

I also have an old Luxman M 117 power amp on it's way, so I will have many things to "throw" at the RM 40's.

I just use 14 gauge home depot wire, with jumpers, but I do plan to go to 12 gauge bi wire cable that is twisted, and truly bi wire them.

I am glad I listened to Brian, and tuned my RM 40's for best midrange performance, with bass a secondary consideration.

And, it isn't like I have "no bass" either ...
I "traded" a correct lower midrange, with upper bass slam, for that LAST little bit of low bass, a trade I would make ANY day!

My subwoofers fill in the last little bass I "lost", and I be a happy camper right now!

Just wanted to let all know the 40's are sounding real good here, now that they are correctly tuned.
I have a nice cold glass of Pomengranit Juice full of anti oxidants waiting, so it's time to go listen some more ...

I BET even Casler isn't "hip" to Pomengranit Juice ???

[John Casler]

I have a nice cold glass of Pomengranit Juice full of anti oxidants waiting, so it's time to go listen some more ...

I BET even Casler isn't "hip" to Pomengranit Juice ???

What???

I been drinking that "spirit here since 1969"


Finally getting the recognition it deserves, along with Blueberries (which I really dont' like)

[ka7niq]

I have a nice cold glass of Pomengranit Juice full of anti oxidants waiting, so it's time to go listen some more ...

I BET even Casler isn't "hip" to Pomengranit Juice ???

What???

I been drinking that "spirit here since 1969"


Finally getting the recognition it deserves, along with Blueberries (which I really dont' like)

It enhances Nitric Acid production, at 56 years of age, you SHOULD know about Nitric Acid, LOL

40's are sounding great, even w/o my best stuff.

Listened for 2 hours!

As IF you didn't know, weight plates atop the 40's further 'tune' the cabinets.
I can hear the difference ...

I MIGHT remove just a tad of upper woofer damping from each speaker, warm em up even more ....

No permanent harm will be done, can always put it back ....

BTW, someone was telling me of some Rain Forest plants even higher in Anti Oxidants then Pom's and Blueberrys!

[fredgarvin]

Congrats Ka7niq! I sure miss that VMPS midrange... the putty to me was no mystery, maybe I was lucky. Of course your 40's are much better sounding than the rm1's I had. If you like to work out, try some LJ 100 (tompkat ali), just two weeks of using and my lifting stamina has increased quite a bit. I'm doing 10 sets of 10 with 90 sec rest periods. Before the LJ 100 I was down to 3 or 4 reps at the 8th set. I am now at 7 reps at a full ten sets. I feel in my workouts as if 3 or 4 years have been erased.

[ka7niq]

Congrats Ka7niq! I sure miss that VMPS midrange... the putty to me was no mystery, maybe I was lucky. Of course your 40's are much better sounding than the rm1's I had. If you like to work out, try some LJ 100 (tompkat ali), just two weeks of using and my lifting stamina has increased quite a bit. I'm doing 10 sets of 10 with 90 sec rest periods. Before the LJ 100 I was down to 3 or 4 reps at the 8th set. I am now at 7 reps at a full ten sets. I feel in my workouts as if 3 or 4 years have been erased.

Hello Fred!
I am so very close to having these RM 40's just right.
It really is 'all about the putty'.

I tuned em for lowest bass, and tried to dial the mids and tweets down to 'blend'.
NOT, in my room.
Noww I tune solely for midrange, because I have subs anyway.
And, as good as the RM 40's are at making low bass, they will never pressurize this huge space anyway, so what's the point ?

I have found I can get a rch, warm lower midrange, and punchy mid bass with my current putty setting, and the subs can fill in the rest.

Right now, I am deciding on clicks of the midrange pot.
I just can't make up my mind which of the two clicks I prefer.

This is a good place to be!

I gotta order me some 12 guage wire, found some with 4 strands of twisted 12 guage, so it will be easy to truly bi wire.

Equipment wise, I am really "slumming" right now, everything is broke, or getting modded ...

I will check out that stuff you suggested, is it on the Internet ?

I wonder if Casler is hip to it ?
He suprised me, knowing about Pomengranit Juice!

[fredgarvin]

Ka7niq, I ordered it through www.iherb.com , I am always skeptical about supplements but this one and dhea have both shown obvious results for me. I'm going to check on the pom. juice myself, I have always taken selenium but this sounds interesting.

[John Casler]

I will check out that stuff you suggested, is it on the Internet ?

I wonder if Casler is hip to it ?
He suprised me, knowing about Pomengranit Juice!

Of course Casler is "hip"

Only problem is my source t-nation.com had a product call "Red Kat" which was very reasonably priced and it disappeared.

And as far as the Nitric Oxide Cycle, I have take L-Arginine ever morning since 1982 (yes even at CES)

About a year ago I switched from Coffee (well kinda) to Green Tea.

What I mean by "kinda" is that I actually brew the Green Tea, "add" some coffee (Beans ground on the spot to preserve the anti-oxidants) and also add some Hot Chocolate mix (more anti-oxidants read the research) and to this I add a 1/3 cup of non-fat powdered milk, for a little extra Protein.

This is what I wash all my Vitamins down with.

About 45 minutes before this, I take a supplement called PowerMaker, which is the Arginine based product, and this is mixed with a soda to "buffer" the stomach and cause speedier absorption.

I give it 30-45 minutes to be absorbed and begin crossing the blood brain barrier, before any food or sugar to keep insulin stable.

I also have a nice "late breakfast" of an "oatmeal concoction".

It is 1 cup oatmeal, (cooked) 1/3 cup vanilla protein powder, 1/3 cup non-fat powdered milk, and at least one handful of walnuts, topped with about a 1/3 to 1/2 cup of non-fat milk.

Umma Gumma that is good and good for you

[ka7niq]

I will check out that stuff you suggested, is it on the Internet ?

I wonder if Casler is hip to it ?
He surprised me, knowing about Pomengranit Juice!

You are an "interesting" cat John.
One one hand, I see you are very much 'old school", meaning heavy weights, and lots of Protein, but yet you are also well versed on the 'new school' life extension stuff!

Like I told you, many of my brothers friend are Body Builders, really into HGH ...
Some even getting Testosterone shots!
And yes, Insulin too.

I find this pretty sad.

I am into Nitric Acid for one main reason, take a guess ?

And Arginine is a short term Nitric Acid releaser, but why do you feel the compulsion to take it everyday ?

What do you surmise it is doing for you

It has been a LONG time since I read Dirk and Sandy's book, and I am not really 'hip' to L Arginine.

I think it's cool Fred Garvin is into the stuff we are into.

I don't think your diet habits would work for me.
You look like a combination Mesomorph, with some Ecto
I am an Endo Mesomorph, no problem gaining weight, just a problem sometimes keeping it off.

I have a friend with your body type, and he has to eat and supplement like a mad man to keep his size.

Now Mentzer ... THAT is a total Mesomorph!
Or, was .....

BTW, I really got the old spiral 40's singing!

Well, as best I can until my good stuff gets out of the Mod Shop.

I guess I could vitrify the passives, but I am scared to mess with em right now.

I bet these older Spiral RM 40's are a tad harder to get right because of their lower crossover points.

I really believe Brian was determined to take the ribbons down as far as he dared, making them a little more "touchy" to get right.

I did just what he said John, tuned one speaker at a time.
I wanted warmth, so i took the mids down to 12 o'clock, and tweeters at 12.30, maybe one tweeter click less.

I listened carefully to two songs, and played for about an hour, until i was sure it sounded the best it could.

Then, I did the other one, paying no attention to having the same amount of putty as on the other speaker.
To my surprise, it actually turned out to sound better then the other one!

I then went back, and added, then took off a scrape at a time, but I just couldnt get it to sound EXACTLY the same.

So, I committed :sacrilege: ...
I found that i had to reduce it;s midrange pot one click from "perfect" 12 o'clock, and then it sounded "Exactly" like it's twin brother.

I readjusted my amps level controls, and the big speakers from California rewarded me with an incredibly warm, rich sound, and passed my 25 CD voicing test.

Imaging got so much better, since both speakers now sounded exactly alike, and the "voices coming out of the top woofers" ceased!

I have just a very slight touch of midrange glare, but I aint worried, my good stuff is coming home soon, and I am nitpicking.

Now I know why Brian does not provide a weight for the putty, because every situation is different.

I am quite sure the putty amounts on each of my speakers is not the same, and frankly I could care less.
My left speaker midrange pot is one click lower then it;s right channel brothers is, and I ain't losing sleep.

My speakers now sound as much alike as humanely possible, and I think this is what is contributing to their outstanding imaging.

I will say this, it has been an "adventure" getting these tuned, but it has been fun too.










Of course Casler is "hip"

Only problem is my source t-nation.com had a product call "Red Kat" which was very reasonably priced and it disappeared.

And as far as the Nitric Oxide Cycle, I have take L-Arginine ever morning since 1982 (yes even at CES)

About a year ago I switched from Coffee (well kinda) to Green Tea.

What I mean by "kinda" is that I actually brew the Green Tea, "add" some coffee (Beans ground on the spot to preserve the anti-oxidants) and also add some Hot Chocolate mix (more anti-oxidants read the research) and to this I add a 1/3 cup of non-fat powdered milk, for a little extra Protein.

This is what I wash all my Vitamins down with.

About 45 minutes before this, I take a supplement called PowerMaker, which is the Arginine based product, and this is mixed with a soda to "buffer" the stomach and cause speedier absorption.

I give it 30-45 minutes to be absorbed and begin crossing the blood brain barrier, before any food or sugar to keep insulin stable.

I also have a nice "late breakfast" of an "oatmeal concoction".

It is 1 cup oatmeal, (cooked) 1/3 cup vanilla protein powder, 1/3 cup non-fat powdered milk, and at least one handful of walnuts, topped with about a 1/3 to 1/2 cup of non-fat milk.

UmmaGumma that is good and good for you

[Hipper]

I'm not sure I belong here.

I have a pair of RM30's but I like cheese and tomato sandwiches. Is that O.K.?

[John Casler]

I'm not sure I belong here.

I have a pair of RM30's but I like cheese and tomato sandwiches. Is that O.K.?

Don't mind us, we're just looking for ways to stay around longer so we can listen to our VMPS more

You do use unsprouted "whole wheat" for the sandwich, right?

[warnerwh]

What kind of cheese goes well with tomatoes?  I've not heard of this but have alot of extra tomatoes in my garden that need eating. It does sound good. Do you heat it up or eat it cold?

I can hardly believe anybody would bring up Dirk Pearson and Sandy Shaw as I've not thought about them in many years. I thought they'd be dead by now after living on preservatives

[John Casler]

What kind of cheese goes well with tomatoes?  I've not heard of this but have alot of extra tomatoes in my garden that need eating. It does sound good. Do you heat it up or eat it cold?

I can hardly believe anybody would bring up Dirk Pearson and Sandy Shaw as I've not thought about them in many years. I thought they'd be dead by now after living on preservatives

I ran into Durk and Sandy in a Grocery Store in Manhattan Beach in the mid-80's.

Both looked almost dead then.

We talked for a few minutes (long enough to view what was in their cart) and you wouldn't have beleived what they were eating.

That cart looked like a Junk Food convention

[lonewolfny42]

What kind of cheese goes well with tomatoes?

A nice plate of Tomato and Mozzarella.....salt , pepper, a little basil.......good olive oil on top.......your set.

And....their good for you.....

[warnerwh]

Thanks for the idea on the tomato recipe. We have plenty as I've got fourteen plants putting them out daily right now. Fortunately we eat alot of them as we made salsa with 50lbs and this weekend will can another 25 or 30 lbs.

John, I had been surprised as I didn't think anybody else even knew who they are/were.  I used to order amino acid crystals when working out years ago and get the Life Extension mailer by those two. Early in time they seemed to have some sense but as the years went by it seemed they went astray. I do remember them thinking that eating preservatives would help. They should have discussed it with Jack Lalane. He once said that if man made it, don't eat it. That's some good advice.

[John Casler]

Thanks for the idea on the tomato recipe. We have plenty as I've got fourteen plants putting them out daily right now. Fortunately we eat alot of them as we made salsa with 50lbs and this weekend will can another 25 or 30 lbs.

John, I had been surprised as I didn't think anybody else even knew who they are/were.  I used to order amino acid crystals when working out years ago and get the Life Extension mailer by those two. Early in time they seemed to have some sense but as the years went by it seemed they went astray. I do remember them thinking that eating preservatives would help. They should have discussed it with Jack Lalane. He once said that if man made it, don't eat it. That's some good advice.

I still get many of my supplements from a company called "Life Extension" although they have little to do with Durk and Sandy now except to still market their products.

I also have a couple projects going that may involve Jack, as long as he is with us.  What an Icon and Mentor he is.

And OH YEAH, I know a lot of the Old Timers, including Gypsy Boots, Joe Gold, and a few others from the Health and Fitness years gone by.

I think Chris mentioned Mike Mentzer (now gone) who was a good friend of mine along with his brother Ray.

[ka7niq]

I think Chris mentioned Mike Mentzer (now gone) who was a good friend of mine along with his brother Ray.
[/quote]

Mentzers Gone ??
Like deceased, or out of the scene ?

My brother, when he was seriously training, did the "Heavy Duty" thing, one set to failure,  from time to time.

Him and his training partner would do standing barbell curls with back to wall.
One would actually be doing the excersise, while the other one stood facing him, yelling "Give me one more rep or I will smack the be jesus out of you" !
It was common to hear the sound of a face getting slapped!

Most people just can't do the kind of set that Heavy Duty requires, and so it does not work for them.

But I watched my brother, who was already big, make good gains on it.

For awhile .....

Now, he is into 100 rep sets, super slow, and just plain old time heavy weight again.

He believes in always changing things up, so his body is always 'freaked out' and grows.

He is so strong, he takes much more rest now, because he needs it.

Here is a picture of him, he was cutting down for a contest

http:// www.jamiesairconditioning.com

[warnerwh]

What's funny about Jack Lalane is that he's not given as much respect in the health world as he deserves when he's the one who preached and practiced resistance training, aerobic exercise and healthy eating at least back into the sixties.  Maybe it's because he should be more rich than he already is. He could have capitalized on the situation better but I suspect he's happy and that's what's most important. Anyway to me it's somehow not right.

[John Casler]

Mentzers Gone ??
Like deceased, or out of the scene ?

Yes Mike died some time ago and a few days later his brother Ray did too.

It was all "VERY" strange.

[ka7niq]

Mentzers Gone ??
Like deceased, or out of the scene ?

Yes Mike died some time ago and a few days later his brother Ray did too.

It was all "VERY" strange.

Wow!
That's too bad.
I spoke to Mike once, and it was nice to know someone actually had a bigger Ego then me, LOL

Seriously, he was a smart dude, into all kinds of cool stuff, Like Ayn Rand.
Of course, you do not know who she was, right ?

Do you have any idea of the causes, or did he just get on the wrong side of Weider .....

BTW, Life Extension Foundation was here in Florida ....

Hey Man, forgot to ask you, WHY Walnuts in Oatmeal ?

My Mom works as a volunteer at a food bank, and can get me bags of shelled Walnuts, but I do not need to gain weight.

Do you think it till to be a good idea to hook up my daily Oatmeal with Walnuts ?

I thought Almonds were the nuts of choice ?

[ka7niq]

Mentzers Gone ??
Like deceased, or out of the scene ?

Yes Mike died some time ago and a few days later his brother Ray did too.

It was all "VERY" strange.

Wow!
That's too bad.
I spoke to Mike once, and it was nice to know someone actually had a bigger Ego then me, LOL

Seriously, he was a smart dude, into all kinds of cool stuff, Like Ayn Rand.
Of course, you do not know who she was, right ?

Do you have any idea of the causes, or did he just get on the wrong side of Weider .....

BTW, Life Extension Foundation was here in Florida ....

Hey Man, forgot to ask you, WHY Walnuts in Oatmeal ?

My Mom works as a volunteer at a food bank, and can get me bags of shelled Walnuts, but I do not need to gain weight.

Do you think it till to be a good idea to hook up my daily Oatmeal with Walnuts ?

I thought Almonds were the nuts of choice ?