find a player with 2500 budget????

2bigears · « **Reply #60 on:** 3 May 2006, 07:09 pm »

full blown 3910 is 4k.

sony full mods is 3500

PhilNYC · « **Reply #61 on:** 3 May 2006, 07:14 pm »

Quote from: tvad4

The latest version of the APL now uses 8 AKM DACs per channel.

Just curious...how does using 8 DACs per channel work? I understand 2 per channel running parallel in a balanced design, but I don't know how you'd use 8 per channel...

BrassEar · « **Reply #62 on:** 3 May 2006, 07:31 pm »

PC Audio all the way. My wife and two kids LOVE using the Squeezebox. Add a decent NOS DAC and you will smoke almost any CD player under $5K.

I tried literally dozens of CD players over a 20 year period to try and tame the harsh digital sound. PC audio is the true fix. Once I listened on the SB3 I never again was looking for the magic fix for digital sound.

I will never go back to standalone CD players. They remind me of turntables (God Bless analog's little soul).

ZooDog · « **Reply #63 on:** 3 May 2006, 09:51 pm »

Quote from: tvad4

IMO, PC based systems do not blend well into a home's decor...specifically living rooms and common areas other than kitchens, offices and dedicated audio rooms.

A Mac Mini would be a good choice if you don't like the looks of a traditional PC tower. Lacie makes stylish external HD's that could be used with it.

tvad4 · « **Reply #64 on:** 3 May 2006, 10:22 pm »

Quote from: Ray Bronk

Quote from: tvad4
Quote from: Ray Bronk
Which one was that. On a cheaper note, JVC was using these AKM Dacs, and they are suppose to be rather good. But as usual, they are getting cheaper, and can't find the good ones any more. So that was why my question on which CDPlayer are you referring to. Thanks.

Ray

Ray, the player was an APL Denon 3910, which uses AKM4396 DACs. The latest version of the APL now uses 8 AKM DACs per channel.

Hey thanks for the info. How much is that player? and how ...

Full blown APL Denon 3919 with the lastest upgrades is $7,000. However, it's my understanding that Alex is no longer modding the Denon 3910. Any pricing info on the APL HiFi website is at least ten months outdated and is behind by two or three price increases due to ongoing improvements in the modification's design and parts content.

tvad4 · « **Reply #65 on:** 3 May 2006, 10:23 pm »

Quote from: PhilNYC

Quote from: tvad4
The latest version of the APL now uses 8 AKM DACs per channel.

Just curious...how does using 8 DACs per channel work? I understand 2 per channel running parallel in a balanced design, but I don't know how you'd use 8 per channel...

You'd have to ask the designer.

PhilNYC · « **Reply #66 on:** 3 May 2006, 10:40 pm »

Quote from: tvad4

You'd have to ask the designer.

I actually did a little searching around, and found this:

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=3117&highlight=parallel+dacs

tvad4 · « **Reply #67 on:** 3 May 2006, 10:47 pm »

Quote from: PhilNYC

Quote from: tvad4

You'd have to ask the designer.

I actually did a little searching around, and found this:

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=3117&highlight=parallel+dacs

Phil, with all due respect to the people who posted in that thread, they are not discussing AKM DACs, nor are any of them Alex Peychev. The man knows what he is doing. He used to work for Sony, and he is the person who discovered the solution to repairing all the failing Phillips SACD1000 machines. He designs and is manufacturing state of the art digital machines based on the Esoteric UX-1 that rival, or better, EMM Labs and Reimyo players.

I'm not going to debate the topic of multiple DACs with you because I don't have the technical knowledge to do so. If you want the answer, then contact Alex Peychev at APL HiFi.

PhilNYC · « **Reply #68 on:** 3 May 2006, 10:54 pm »

tvad, I'm not trying to debate anything. as always, I'm just simply trying to learn. That thread was the only thing I found that had some comments about what is trying to be achieved by paralleling multiple (more than 2) DACs. Obviously there can be great results doing it...in addition to APL, Accuphase (whose stuff I love) is another company that designs its digital sources using this technique. I had just never heard an explanation of what the theory was behind it...that thread was the only thing I have been able to find that describes it.

I think generally if you read how I post on AC, you'll find that I'm rarely judgemental about anything. Probably my worst trait as a salesman is that I think there's tons of good stuff out there (ie. I'd sell more stuff if I told all my potential customers that the stuff I sell is the best in the world...instead, I let them listen and judge for themselves with their own ears and tastes).

Sorry if I came across as trying to debate you on something...

EDIT: btw - did you read the second page of the thread?

tvad4 · « **Reply #69 on:** 3 May 2006, 10:59 pm »

Quote from: PhilNYC

tvad, I'm not trying to debate anything. as always, I'm just simply trying to learn. That thread was the only thing I found that had some comments about what is trying to be achieved by paralleling multiple (more than 2) DACs. Obviously there can be great results doing it...in addition to APL, Accuphase (whose stuff I love) is another company that designs its digital sources using this technique. I had just never heard an explanation of what the theory was behind it...that thread was the only thing I hav ...

No problem. I misused the word debate for the word discuss. Something I do regularly in my day to day conversations. Mostly, I didn't want to get involved in a topic I'm not qualified to discuss due to my lack of engineering background.

woodsyi · « **Reply #70 on:** 4 May 2006, 01:49 am »

See below -- duplicate post.

woodsyi · « **Reply #71 on:** 4 May 2006, 01:49 am »

Very good information everyone. Certainly the ease of dropping in a CD and playing it can't be beat but consider this for PC audio. Once all you music is ripped to a server, any wifi player anywhere in the house can access any music at anytime without having to truck CD up and down the stairs.

Buying used gear can also be good if you plan to have it modded by a reliable modder. Any modder worth the salt will warrenty his work which will include full inspection of the used stock unit.

As for me, my wife insists that she be able to simply drop in a CD and push a button to play music. So I keep both CDP and PC audio all over the house.

2bigears · « **Reply #72 on:** 4 May 2006, 02:00 am »

very good stuff indeed.i am thinkin' for the next short while i can use a one box,load and play.this new tech is only gonna' get better and in short time.my little short list is:----consonance droplet-----res audio opus 21----ayre cx-7------sony and denon modded----all these used at 2000 or close.this is where i am at,the cross-roads of a small decision.cheers

tvyankee · « **Reply #73 on:** 4 May 2006, 03:04 am »

I know this dosen't mean much coming from a guy who sells April Music but the CDA-320($2500.00) Stello cd player fits the bill and they have been using the AKM dacs long before Alex been using them.

Also they have come out this month with their new DA/220mk11 dac that is very nice and it goes for $1595.00.This piece also uses AKM DACS as well.

BTW it also has a usb input.

Good luck looking.

guest1632 · « **Reply #74 on:** 4 May 2006, 03:20 am »

Quote from: tvyankee

I know this dosen't mean much coming from a guy who sells April Music but the CDA-320($2500.00) Stello cd player fits the bill and they have been using the AKM dacs long before Alex been using them.

Also they have come out this month with their new DA/220mk11 dac that is very nice and it goes for $1595.00.This piece also uses AKM DACS as well.

BTW it also has a usb input.
Do you have the site for that player? JVC was using the AKM Dacs in their machines too, and I was told they are pretty good.

Ray

Good luck looking.

tvad4 · « **Reply #75 on:** 4 May 2006, 04:52 am »

Quote from: tvyankee

I know this dosen't mean much coming from a guy who sells April Music but the CDA-320($2500.00) Stello cd player fits the bill and they have been using the AKM dacs long before Alex been using them.

As we're not comparing apples to apples here, this may be a moot point. I know the Stello products have received some very good press. It's not really a question of who used AKM DACs first, but how the DACs are used in the overall design.

The Stello DA220 utilizes the AKM AK4395 DACs, whereas APL HiFi players utilize the flagship AKM AK4396 DACs. Also, the Stello upsamples at 24/192, whereas the new APL players upsample at 32/211. Also, APL uses 8 or 10 DACs per channel. I was not able to determine from the Stello specs how many DACs per channel the DA220 uses, but I suspect it's no more than two. Do you know?

By the way, do you know why the April Music website will not load?

brj · « **Reply #76 on:** 4 May 2006, 05:55 am »

Quote from: PhilNYC

The Olive Opus uses the same top of the line Burr-Brown DAC as many of the highest-grade audiophile CDPs...it uses 4 of them (2 per channel) in a balanced design similar to the Resolution Audio Opus 21 and BAT VK-D5

Since we've already wandered onto the issue of specific DACs, I risk a quick topic diversion.... Phil, do you know specifically which BB DACs are used in the Opus?

Thanks!

Jon L · « **Reply #77 on:** 4 May 2006, 07:13 am »

Quote from: brj

Quote from: PhilNYC
The Olive Opus uses the same top of the line Burr-Brown DAC as many of the highest-grade audiophile CDPs...it uses 4 of them (2 per channel) in a balanced design similar to the Resolution Audio Opus 21 and BAT VK-D5

Since we've already wandered onto the issue of specific DACs, I risk a quick topic diversion.... Phil, do you know specifically which BB DACs are used in the Opus?

Thanks!

PCM1704 DAC chips (4 of them). Not sure if they are the premium "K" version, but probably not..

tvyankee · « **Reply #78 on:** 4 May 2006, 11:57 am »

I wasn't comparing the two units because one is $7000.00 and one is $2500.00.I just saying that they both use akm dac's

The topic was a good machine for $2500.00 Budget.I said that the stello uses these dacs because you sounded like you like the sound of these dacs and that not many machines use them.

As far as how many they use i could find out for sure if you would like to know.

The mark11 da/220 i know is impoved alot in the power supply and in the componets used through out the circut.

I spoke to the designer and he said that it has better soundstage and depth.

The reason why i posted is not for a sale for myself but to let people know that for the money asked for these products they are hard to beat.

The unit is built like a tank and looks great in your rack.

PhilNYC · « **Reply #79 on:** 4 May 2006, 12:32 pm »

Quote from: tvad4

the new APL players upsample at 32/211....

Another "just curious" question for anyone who might know...what is the benefit of upsampling at 32/211? Both the 32 and the 211 seem really odd to me...

find a player with 2500 budget????

guest1632