[rosconey]

cinenova sent me a reply to a email i sent about not doing there job on this-
the reply called me unamerican and a few other things-very rude aholes at that company to say the least -saying this is a incident like the finger in the chili thing last summer-i now have much more faith in this story-


Thank you for been Un- American.
 
You must be one of those who believe in " YOU ARE GUILTY UNTIL PROVEN INNOCENT".
 
Perhaps you never heard of WENDY'S " Finger in the Chili Bowl". This is a similar situation.


btw  -Zissou-the email says they will fix it for you if you cover postage-


As a manufacturer, we still offered him free repair ,under our good will, providing he pays his own freight.

[Zissou]

cinenova sent me a reply to a email i sent about not doing there job on this-
the reply called me unamerican and a few other things-very rude aholes at that company to say the least -saying this is a incident like the finger in the chili thing last summer-i now have much more faith in this story-


Thank you for been Un- American.
 
You must be one of those who believe in " YOU ARE GUILTY UNTIL PROVEN INNOCENT".
 
Perhaps you never heard of WENDY'S " Finger in the Chili Bowl". This is a similar sit ...

THANK YOU FOR THIS! Being called Unamerican is mild to some of the things they called us. Thanks for verifying that they can be "difficult" at times and at other times maybe they're okay.

[jackman]

cinenova sent me a reply to a email i sent about not doing there job on this-
the reply called me unamerican and a few other things-very rude aholes at that company to say the least -saying this is a incident like the finger in the chili thing last summer-i now have much more faith in this story-


Thank you for been Un- American.
 
You must be one of those who believe in " YOU ARE GUILTY UNTIL PROVEN INNOCENT".
 
Perhaps you never heard of WENDY'S " Finger in the Chili Bowl". This is a similar sit ...

Hey, if this guy is making the story up about not modding the amp, I agree with Cinenova.  You were nice enough to print their reply to your email message but you left off your original message.  Would you care to share your original un-altered message to Cinenova?  I've never heard of anyone else having trouble with these amps and, although I have never owned one, I have heard them in a couple systems and found them to be very well made and good sounding.  

In the end, the company offered to pay for this guy's amp if he pays postage.  that's a good deal for a guy who bought a used amp anyway.  There are two sides to every story and I'm not saying Cinenova is perfect but we are only getting one side of this one.  From a guy who has been on every site whining like a little baby about the way he was treated.  It's funny this has been his first post on this site.  

What are we, a sounding board for people who want to complain about companies who refuse to  repair damage that was most likely caused by shoddy mods?  Try returning a damaged second hand amp to any manufacturer, especially one that has been modded.  Ask Klaus, Frank VA, Bryston, Nuforce, or anyone else what they would do if a person called and wanted them to repair an amp that was purchased second hand and may have been modded.  While you are at it, see if they would pay for return freight. Make sure to share their comments with the rest of us.

If Cincenova gets his amp, and finds that it has been modified and that the mods caused the problems, I hope they tell him to shove it up his a$$.  Just  my opinion.

J

[Zissou]

Hey, if this guy is making the story up about not modding the amp, I agree with Cinenova.  You were nice enough to print their reply to your email message but you left off your original message.  Would you care to share your original un-altered message to Cinenova?  I've never heard of anyone else having trouble with these amps and, although I have never owned one, I have heard them in a couple systems and found them to be very well made and good sounding.  

In the end, the company offered to pay for thi ...

The amp has not been modded period. That's just the latest excuse they're using and they've NEVER SEEN THE DAMNED AMP. Anything to avoid taking responsibility for the issue and if you look in my first post you'll notice someone elses caught fire. I do not want anything from them and in fact have a tech coming today. I have emails stating they're sending a new amp, I have the tracking number of the amp they sent. They canceled that and then they told me yesterday that everytime I post, the cost of fixing it goes up $500. Nice you're so quick to believe them and discount a consumer. The amp has not been modded and they haven't even SEEN THE AMP. Oh yeah and then they told my wife they wouldn't repair it. If you want to believe them I could care less. I know what the truth is and that is that. I'm sure a catastrophic failure leading to a fire is rare but even ONE is too many. The modded thing, in an amp they've never seen, is just the latest. It started off we lived overseas. Last time I looked Canada wasn't overseas and then he said our electricity was different up here. That was the best one yet.
 Yep they ARE a great sounding amp and one I firmly recommended many times.
 I also wouldn't have a fricking clue how the hell to mod anything.

In case you missed it this was from the other failed amp:

Zissou,
I was just doing my weekly reading on this forum, not very active actually, and stumbled across this thread. I actually had the same issue with a Cinenova 5. I was lucky though as it was a brand new amp. When I uncrated it I was very excited. I got everything ready and was going to try it out. I was lucky the amp was so large as I couldn't get it in my equipment closet without help so I just left it out front of the equipment. After I connected everything I plugged it in and turned it on. Everything was sounding wonderful for about 30 minutes to 1 hour than I noticed a slight buzz or crackle on one of the channels. It got increasingly louder then popped. When it popped flames began coming out of the top of the amp and rose nearly 8-10 inches. If I had this thing in my rack it could have seriously damaged my ICs or other equipment. The amp was okay in the other 4 channels but is completely burned out the one channel. I worked with Earthquake and my dealer and did get some of the same attitude you got. The dealer offered a full refund or getting the amp fixed. I got a great deal on his last unit so I wanted to keep the amp. When working with Earthquake on the RMA and getting the unit fixed, they gave me the thrid degree on how everything happened. They told me they just couldn't believe one of their amps was shooting flames out of the top and then if it was it had to be my fault. Anyway, they did fix the amp but I had to pay shipping back to them on the module. My dealer ended up reimbursing me on the shipping so I ended up happy but overall I was definitely wary of their idea of customer service. Hopefully if anyone else has had this issue they can report it. I know that there have only been 2 reports but the first customer with a house fire from one of these amps will make headlines.

[rosconey]

hey jack my email wasnt rude-at least not for me-
my sent ones dont get saved so i dont have a copy-my email has a sent area but its always empty-

shouldnt they take a look inside the unit-then if its played with no problem not fixing-but if its a virgin and catch's fire they should be bending over backwards-

i just cant see how they can deny it till they have a look inside-
if its a hand made unit like they say -will they will find a excuse not to fix it,how would you be able to tell if its been played with or not?

cover postage get it back and sell it-just let the buyer know about the fire so your not liable if it does it again

[Zissou]

hey jack my email wasnt rude-at least not for me-
my sent ones dont get saved so i dont have a copy-my email has a sent area but its always empty-

shouldnt they take a look inside the unit-then if its played with no problem not fixing-but if its a virgin and catch's fire they should be bending over backwards-

i just cant see how they can deny it till they have a look inside-
if its a hand made unit like they say -will they will find a excuse not to fix it,how would you be able to tell if its been pl ...

Hey Rosconey there's no way I can in good conscience ever sell this piece to anyone. Thankfully if I get it fixed it does sound great. Yeah the fact they haven't seen it and say it's modded has me baffled too. They'll have another excuse later today I am sure. One of the dealers who warned me to not give them my CC number said there's no way this was one of the first 100 based on date but hey in this case I have to take EQ's word for it.

[Zissou]

I got it fixed by a technician. The bridge rectifier had shorted and the capacitor exploded so $200 and I'm up and running.

[Levi]

Sorry to hear about he amp.

Do you have the pictures yet?  

I will post some later today but I don't want this to look like a vendetta. Someone else may have a totally different experience with them, even if ours has been a nightmare. Funny how people come out of the woodwork after a post like this. We have heard from owners and dealers who have some not good things to say about them but in turn there are probably many who have positives to say.
 It's truly a shame that things turned out like this as I have said over and over again this is a fantastic sounding amp ...

[theborg]

Folks, it seems that there is acrimony on both sides. I would say that there is also insufficient basis for anyone else to decide what the truth really is and who is telling it. I request that anyone involved in this make an effort to resolve the situation to the satisfaction of all concerned. Please do it calmly and factually, *without* sending threatening messages to me, or to anyone else via the facilities provided by audiocircle.

BTW I have deleted the incitement to legal action that was just posted and will do the same if it occurs again.

Thanks

[Zissou]

The Borg is obviously right. The tech fixed it, it was relatively easy but did take him a while to troubleshoot. The exploded capacitor was easy but tracing the rectifier took him a while. He said these parts can go at anytime and it's a crapshoot. They could last 10 years and they could go in a week.
 The flames obviously are a concern but from input from other people we've heard it happen on a low end HT receiver all the way to one of the higher end manufacturers products. The 22,000 microfarad capacitor was hard to find and the one beside the one that exploded also shows signs of scorching and some leakage so will have to be replaced as well, hopefully for a slightly lower price.
 Lesson learned for me? Stick with the bigger companies, even if giving some ultimate sound quality up as the Cinenova is an amazing sounding amp, and only buy new.
 It will turn out to be a fairly expensive lesson once all is repaired but occasionally important lessons aren't cheap.
 For Earthquake owners this has happened in three units we know of and that's a very small percentage so all should be fine.
 I only wish, after a week of acrimony, that both the company and myself had handled things differently.
 To finalize I am happy with my UNMODDDED AMP, happy I'm in Canada not overseas and happy our electricity IS the same as the US!  

[Bemopti123]

I throw my hat with Zissou.  His explanation and insistence on the right story goes beyond the possibility that he is a scammer, who modded his amp and was trying to make the manufacturer pay for his own mistakes.  If this should have been the case, then, he would not have reported what he found of through the tech and the subsequent outcome.

What surprised me the most is of a Cinenova dealer questioning the integrity of what was stated and scouring the net for what Zissou wrote or did not.  Isn't the manufacturer supposed to defend their point?  The dealer, eventhough he/she might distribute a product line should not make comments upon something that he has not seen or assessed technically.

If this "defense" of all cost by the part of a network of dealers becomes the norm, then, all sort of potential occurences, especially unpleasant ones about a product would NEVER see the public light.  Remember that, unfortunately, many of the netzines that deal with stereos have commercial endorsements from different dealers and manufacturers.

As with what the Borg did in deleting the suit incitement, I wonder whether there will be a time when actually some people, manufacturers and their interests will blame site administrators for what some people wrote about their horrible experiences with certain products.  

Zissou, as Levi requested, in order to nail the coffin to the argument, can you post some pictures of the damage that has been done.  I am curious.

[PeakSound]

Wow,
  What a thread.  I have been following this with great interest, and though I wish we could all have this resolved, I think there are too many unproved facts.  I know we all would like to see some pictures of this thing.  That would certainly give us some incling of proof.  Here is the way I see it, and since this is a forum, you all have to read this... bwahahahahaha.
First-Zissou states he can't change a lightbulb and knows nothing about modding amps.  Fine.  So why did he have the back cover off and why, in is first post even before his technician looked at it, did he know that it was a blown capacitor.  Most lay-people won't know a capacitor from pacacitorificator.  He says his mods are dusting and fuse checking.  I have had amps and receivers for years and years and never had them apart.  
Second-Why open the case.  On almost every product I have ever seen it voids the warranty.  Bad move. Leave it to the pros
Third-I always check with a manufactorer before buying used.  Zissou said the seller did before the sale.  AND YOU BELIEVED HIM?????  Hey, I have a bridge to sell you.  EQ says that on the warranty card it states "non-transferable warranty".  
Fourth- Who did he buy the amp from?  He has never said.  Where was it purchase from?  Is he sure that person never modded it?  How would you know unless he knew what to look for?  If I opened my amp, all I would see is wires and well... I don't know.  I wouldn't have a clue if it was modded.  How is Zissou sure if he doesn't even know where it was sold originally and who did what to it.  It might have been sold 12 times before him for all Zissou knows.  Someone who can't change a lightbuld won't  know what a mod looks like.

So just by opening the case and buying used, Zissou voided his warranty.  Mod or no Mod.  Take some responsibility.  Like an earlier thread said, we have all tried to save some cash buying used and been burned. So true.    It was a chance, so take some responsibility for that also.  So these are the simple facts.  No transferable warranty, opened case.  That is plenty for EQ to say, piss off.  Simple as that.  
Also, why didn't he send the amp in to Earthquake?  The cost of shipping?   In his eyes they had already dismissed his claim, so what more could they do?  Certainly they would't keep the amp.  Too many shipping records for him to prove they had it.
Last, on another thread, one of the dealers says that after Earthquake called to cancel the shipment of the new amp, that Zissou called and told the company to go ahead and ship it anyway and that Earthquake had verified the order.  Is this true?   Did Zissou try to pull a fast one on the shipping company?  I hope Earthquake takes some lessons on PR if need be.  Even if Zissou was rude, the correct thing would be to either ignore it, or to reply professionally.  I am sure they are on the defensive right now and I know a lot of people, including Zissou, have stated previously how well they thought Earthquakes PR service is.  Let's hope this is just a passing thing.
P.Sound

[Zissou]

So why did he have the back cover off and why, in is first post even before his technician looked at it, did he know that it was a blown capacitor. Most lay-people won't know a capacitor from pacacitorificator. He says his mods are dusting and fuse checking. I have had amps and receivers for years and years and never had them apart.

After the fire we took the top off to see what damage had been done. After reading the numbers off the part that exploded and describing it to a friend, tech savvy, on the phone he told us what the part was. I also wanted to be able to describe the situation well to EQ.

Second-Why open the case. On almost every product I have ever seen it voids the warranty. Bad move. Leave it to the pros

 In hindsight maybe a good idea but after the flames I was completely unclear what had happened at wanted to be able to clearly describe the issue to EQ. Flames in my house I take seriously.

Third-I always check with a manufactorer before buying used. Zissou said the seller did before the sale. AND YOU BELIEVED HIM????? Hey, I have a bridge to sell you. EQ says that on the warranty card it states "non-transferable warranty".

The warranty card is still here in the manual and on this one, from 2002 it says nothing about being non transferrable. We were unsure IF it was covered and that was part of the reason for phoning, the other being one would think a company would have interest in the fact their product failed in a way that flames came out of the top. This was also before we'd heard of the other units that this had happened to.

Second-Why open the case. On almost every product I have ever seen it voids the warranty. Bad move. Leave it to the pros

Is he sure that person never modded it? How would you know unless he knew what to look for? If I opened my amp, all I would see is wires and well... I don't know. I wouldn't have a clue if it was modded. How is Zissou sure if he doesn't even know where it was sold originally and who did what to it. It might have been sold 12 times before him for all Zissou knows.

Agreed we have no idea what the previous owner did but I did ask him as I do not believe in modding. What I do know is I HAVEN'T modded it and I also know that EQ HAD NOT SEEN THE UNIT so it was just one the excuses they came up with first it was we lived overseas, noper not us, secondly it was that the electricity is different in Canada, noper same as America. Again they just said it was modded when they'd never seen the unit.

So just by opening the case and buying used, Zissou voided his warranty. Mod or no Mod. Take some responsibility. Like an earlier thread said, we have all tried to save some cash buying used and been burned. So true. It was a chance, so take some responsibility for that also. So these are the simple facts. No transferable warranty, opened case. That is plenty for EQ to say, piss off. Simple as that.

Agreed as we found out after. I take responsibility and next time will fully research warranty policies although it is very unclear in my manual. Something like Bryston with their, now old, 20 year transferrable warranty is a good example. Many companies will however offer goodwill treatment to subsequent owners. What we didn't expect was for me AND my wife to get yelled at on the phone, abused and sent rude emails. Now to keep things real not all emails were rude especially the ones where they agreed to send a new unit and in fact asked if I wanted an EQ jacket to make up for the difficulties we'd been through. I refused as I was only concerned with the amp. I do have all these emails saved. By sending the amp it is implied culpability. As for why they canceled it I was told that their German lawyers had said they couldn't send it due to I BELIEVE showing culpability and the potential for a lawsuit. I may have this part wrong and do not want to put words in their mouths.
 It went from getting a new amp and asking me to remove posts about what had happened to them canceling it, that's cool I can handle that, to calling the VP and getting yelled at from him for 15 minutes. Now this is a company yelling at a customer who'd had a fairly clealry catastrophic issue with his amp. Once he'd blown off his steam we talked for about an hour and he was waffling between sending the amp that was already at customs if I gave a CC number, which I said I;'d do then return the blown one to sending for free two modules to be replaced even though I said we didn't have the tech knowledge to do it. He said we could be talked through the process. He then, after talking to an engineer, found out there were no suitable modules available for this unit. He said this was one of 100 hand built ones and I should keep it because they were the best sounding ones. A dealer I talked to based on the date of manufacture and test told us later that this was not an early one. HOWEVER it could have just been siting at EQ before testing a shipment for quite a while so I have no reason to doubt Earthquake on this. Is it possible if this is a handbuilt one that it could have issues that a production one might never experience? Damn straight it is. We don't yet know if the others that caught fire were old or production models. We do know that the customer service they experienced was very difficult for them as well. A dealer who has his own issues with EQ and will no longer deal with them also told us to not give them credit card info.

Also, why didn't he send the amp in to Earthquake? The cost of shipping? In his eyes they had already dismissed his claim, so what more could they do? Certainly they would't keep the amp. Too many shipping records for him to prove they had it.

First yes the cost but bear in mind that a warranty replacement was in transit from Monday to Friday last week so we DIDN'T know a warranty had been declined. Had we known I would have had a tech in to fix it as we ultimately did on Saturday thereby taking EQ out of the loop and not having to deal with them. The last straw was on Friday when I wife called and was yelled at for 10 minutes straight before he hung up on her. At that point I didn't care if it was $1000 to get it fixed it was not worth the anguish of receiveing calls from them or calling them again. For peace of mind paying what we did for the repair was incredibly good feeling. Also if you'd been through all we had with them I guarantee you you'd have had second thoughts about sending them anything.

I hope Earthquake takes some lessons on PR if need be. Even if Zissou was rude, the correct thing would be to either ignore it, or to reply professionally. I am sure they are on the defensive right now and I know a lot of people, including Zissou, have stated previously how well they thought Earthquakes PR service is. Let's hope this is just a passing thing.

Couldn't agree with you more. If they'd replied in a professional way without threats then none of this would have happened. If they'd said at the beginning no warranty and we won't send a unit, no problem at all. We can afford to get things fixed.  They are very much on the defensive including not taking responsibility for 3 units have had flames shoot out the top when a component had failed. I did think their service was good and wasn't even nervous the first time I called them thinking that together we could come up with a solution, that is a big reason as to why I recommended the amps to so many folks along with the fact that this is a GREAT SOUNDING AMP. But if there's an issue which even in RARE cases can cause a component to blow and flames to come out the top then it's something you'd think they'd want to look into and take seriously.
 I was the first to admit that I did get angry during the first call when we talked for 20 minutes and got nowhere. That is certainly my fault as no matter what they said or did I should have kept my cool and I wrote in the first post I got angry. I tried to keep this as accurate as possible. Every phone call has been meticulpusly documented and all emails have been saved as well as the two parts that were replaced, a bridge rectifier and the capacitor. As to why they failed I haven't a clue but amps or other electronic devices can and do breakdown. This is certainly not only a problem with EQ. Flames however, while not unheard of, are rarer and possibly a little more serious. As for tracking the package when using the number they gave me I was always CLEARLY the receiver not the shipper and it's yet more Earthquakespeak and spin. I'm just glad I AM in Canada with the same electricity that Americans use. If they were finally convinced of those thruths then there's hope yet that they'll realize everything we've said is true.
 There are no hard feelings or animosity with which I feel towards them. It's their company and they can run it anyway they choose. It's not how I'd do it but hey that's just me.

Yes photos are coming, I'm trying to get a better digital camera today. We have both parts that were replaced, the cap and the bridge rectifier and will take shots from all angles, and will show how the other large cap still in the unit is scorched. That one will also need to be replaced. To show how well built these damned things are though everything else is now functioning just fine. I haven't cranked it, and when we go out it's always shut off but it SEEMS okay for now. Would have been a WHOLE LOT easier to have just had a tech in instead of relying on the manufacturer. Live and learn.

[Levi]

I figured.  

Yes photos are coming, I'm trying to get a better digital camera today.

I will post some later today...

[Zissou]

I figured.  

Yes photos are coming, I'm trying to get a better digital camera today.

I will post some later today...

  Just be patient.

[Levi]

Good luck with your modded amp.

Goodbye.
Levi

I figured.  

Yes photos are coming, I'm trying to get a better digital camera today.

I will post some later today...

  Just be patient.

[Zissou]

As promised:

First some pics of the cap that blew: