The Longhorn modification really does work....

philipp · « **Reply #20 on:** 13 Jan 2006, 07:26 pm »

Aw Frank, sorry to hear about the pain! Here's hoping it doesn't last.

I downloaded and printed the 1982 issue of Audio Basics where you talk about the Longhorn and about proper cartridge loading. Unfortunately, the calculations on page 7 printed over the text in column two and are difficult to decipher. Would you please post them here? The manufacturer of my cartridge recommends a 100ohm load but I just wanted to double check. Thanks!

TheChairGuy · « **Reply #21 on:** 14 Jan 2006, 04:54 am »

Hey Frank - thanks for that. Hang in there with the pain.

I've lived with my half-mod for the past few days now. It's effective. It won't make you think you bought an entirely different cartridge, but it truly improves it in meaningful ways. Again, I didn't got do the full monty Longhorn mod...but I think I'm getting a good bit of the benefits.

Dynamics are better now, too - it's almost CD-like in that regard now. In fact, the differences between CD and vinyl grow ever smaller after the mod...I mean that in all the good ways

ohenry · « **Reply #22 on:** 14 Jan 2006, 05:18 pm »

Frank,
Thanks for your generosity. I hope you feel better today...

avahifi · « **Reply #23 on:** 15 Jan 2006, 05:59 pm »

It is kind of ironic to read above a positive response that the Longhorn modification made the records sound more "CD like", while in a different thread here at AC someone else was asking for help to make his CDs sound more like records.

Actually not ironic I guess, we are working on helping things in both directions.

Frank Van Alsitne

TheChairGuy · « **Reply #24 on:** 15 Jan 2006, 06:57 pm »

Quote from: avahifi

It is kind of ironic to read above a positive response that the Longhorn modification made the records sound more "CD like", while in a different thread here at AC someone else was asking for help to make his CDs sound more like records.

Actually not ironic I guess, we are working on helping things in both directions.

Frank Van Alstine

At some point along the line, the two technologies bisect along the way and sound more alike...more like music. That's the goal, at least...the Longhorn doesn't correct the inherent shortcomings associated with vinyl playback, but makes improves much of it for nearly nothing in cost.

Thanks very much again Frank for your generosity in this very worthwhile endeavor

ohenry · « **Reply #25 on:** 3 Feb 2006, 12:57 am »

A couple of longhorn-style pics, no listening yet. I'm waiting until this cures overnight. This is an older Adcom/van den Hul crosscoil cartridge and it seems to be a good candidate for horns (I hope). More to come tomorrow.

John and Randy, your brass was mailed on Monday BTW...

JoshK · « **Reply #26 on:** 3 Feb 2006, 01:09 am »

I don't get what the horns do, is it a rotational inertia thing? I have seen them before in the past but didn't get the concept.

ohenry · « **Reply #27 on:** 3 Feb 2006, 01:29 am »

Quote from: JoshK

I don't get what the horns do, is it a rotational inertia thing? I have seen them before in the past but didn't get the concept.

Check out Frank's 1982 Audio Basics page 8. He explains that it adds a bit of mass to provide inertial resistance, and it adds a small amount of mass to the cartridge body to decrease the cantilever's vibratory affects to the cartridge body.

I think those were the basic claims, of course, the paper explains it better than I can.

TheChairGuy · « **Reply #28 on:** 3 Feb 2006, 03:37 am »

Waaaay cool, Henry...neat and clean job, too.

Is this a much used and known cartridge to you?...it'll be intersting to hear your observations of it.

On my AT440ml and Ortofon X5-MC it gave them a bit more weight overall....less of that light sound often associated with and observed in relation to CD.

Having now upgraded my phono stage, I'd like to once again put the Ortofon in and see if it still sounds lightweight. The AT is now almost too dynamic for my 12 x 15' room. Cannon shots from 1812 Overture are downright scary now after the Longhorn mod, and new phono preamp stage and the AT440ml.

ohenry · « **Reply #29 on:** 3 Feb 2006, 01:46 pm »

This old Adcom cartridge has been one of my favorites for quite a while. I have it coupled to a simple VPI HW19, Sumiko MMT arm and use a Cornet phono stage.

I had a chance to listen for about 30 minutes before work this morning and the improvement with the longhorn mod was definitely noticeable; noticeable like flipping a switch. As The Chair Guy stated, it does give the bass more weight and it cleaned up the highs very nicely. Background instruments became more defined, such as the banjo on John Hiatt's Slow Turning. I have a good King Crimson recording having crescendos that are difficult to track and reproduce cleanly...not anymore. The cartridge has the same basic sonic signature as before, but now sounds more dynamic and the presentation is cleaner. BTW, the tracking force is actually 1/4 gram less now than before.

The record clamp didn't interfere with the needle moving to the lead-out groove on the records played this morning, but it was close (the "horn" sticks out about 1/2 inch laterally and does eventually hit the side of the clamp).

Thanks again to Frank, this is an eye-opener.

avahifi · « **Reply #30 on:** 4 Feb 2006, 12:08 am »

I don't see any lead (solder) filled ends on your longhorn bar. Am I missing something or are you are. The rest of the bar then should be filled with plastic modeling clay for further damping.

Frank Van Alstine

avahifi · « **Reply #31 on:** 4 Feb 2006, 12:10 am »

by the way, loose the record clamp if it gets in the way of the longhorn bar. The cartridge improvement is much more important than the clamp.

ohenry · « **Reply #32 on:** 4 Feb 2006, 12:19 am »

Quote from: avahifi

I don't see any lead (solder) filled ends on your longhorn bar. Am I missing something or are you are. The rest of the bar then should be filled with plastic modeling clay for further damping.

Frank Van Alstine

Hi Frank,
I did fill the outer half of the channel with solder, it's a little concave at the end and hard to see in my low res images. I used clear silicone to damp the rest.

That little bar does make a surprising difference, thanks for the guidance.

JoshK · « **Reply #33 on:** 4 Feb 2006, 12:25 am »

Quote from: avahifi

I don't see any lead (solder) filled ends on your longhorn bar. Am I missing something or are you are. The rest of the bar then should be filled with plastic modeling clay for further damping.

Frank Van Alstine

Really? a clamp can provide a great service to LPs that are a bit warped, etc., you are suggesting that the longhorns takes care of this?

TomekZ · « **Reply #34 on:** 4 Feb 2006, 04:33 am »

Been long-horning my Grados and Shures for 20 years. I had subscribed to the original Audio Basics. This really works. Without it LPs sound thin and fuzzy.

Also in the early Audio Basic tweaks is mention of putting that plastic modeling clay inside speaker boxes, turntable chassis (my 20 year old Linn has this inside and the modeling clay still holds and hasn't dried out).

The Long Horn idea is one of the very best tweaks. I gave up on the record clamp right afterwards. This improved the sound more than my clamp did...ah, 20 years ago.

TheChairGuy · « **Reply #35 on:** 4 Feb 2006, 06:49 am »

TomekZ,

I've been also 'filling' my TT's up, inside and out, for about 20 years.

My dealer long ago told me about Mortite or Dennis Rope Caulk...but it's so tacky it leaves your skin raw after working with it. Frank's idea about Plast-i-Clay is perfect - it goes on easy and is easy on your hands, too.

It is very effective - I also had great success using it inside two pairs of speakers now, too.

As you can see from an earlier topic in the Vinyl Circle...I am much the devotee of Plast-i-Clay

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=22938

TheChairGuy · « **Reply #36 on:** 7 Feb 2006, 06:44 pm »

Henry,

The brass U channels you sent were received yesterday...thanks so much!

John

pufff · « **Reply #37 on:** 22 Feb 2006, 08:20 pm »

Strange tweak, but it works. I really noticed how good the improvement was when I took my blutac'ed quick and dirty experiment off. The music just became boring til listen to.

I have some questions.
When using a cart where the stylus part is vere "high" then it must be better to glue the longhorn on the stylus part to have closer to the cateliver? But, if true, then it maybe cause the long metal insert into the housing wiggel?

And for 24 years it has always been the selected version of the cheapest Grado. Why not a more refined model also?

Anyway, the brass profile is on its way. And when younger I once took a candle and dripped some of the hot wax into a cartridge over the magnets and wires to dampen internal vibrations. It worked fine, but I have never tried since. Mayby its time again....................

ohenry · « **Reply #38 on:** 7 Mar 2006, 02:02 am »

Frank is the man.

I got around to ordering and receiving the Grado Green. It was tempting to go with a higher priced model, but in my old age I'm beginning to take direction well from those I trust. And Frank has made a career of being right.

So, I got the specified silicone into the specified places and mounted the horn. Tonight I got to try it out for the first time and told myself not to be disappointed as I got the cartridge properly set up. I mean, what can you expect for $60 and a few tweaks?

All I can say is wow, this cheap little cartridge trounces my old Adcom/van den Hul cross coil that I thought was reasonably good. It was one of those "knew it in three notes" moments that was recently cited in another thread. And that's right out of the box.

The Grado has BASS, the highs are smoother and natural sounding. And the soundstage/imaging has clearly improved. Details are being reproduced that have opened a sonic door to the studio. The ample and faithful bass is so well-controlled and solid. The presentation just sounds right to me.

Eventually, I'll get another higher priced Grado to try since I'm highly impressed with this $60 marvel. I'm in no hurry to do that, but I'll have to try to quell my curiosity. It's really that good and is very satisfying, especially on my blues and rock mix of lp's. In fact, I'm no longer disappointed with a few of those 200g lp's that I bought a few months ago.

BTW, this cartridge seems to make the Cornet phono stage really shine.

So, thanks again Frank, this is great stuff. And thanks to the Chairguy for re-sparking my interest. Anyone looking for the all-time bargain in cartridges, give this one a look.

TheChairGuy · « **Reply #39 on:** 7 Mar 2006, 03:57 am »

Hey, waaaay cool, Henry

Where did you find 1000cst silicone in small batches? Keith F. told me he found it at www.chemistrystore.com, but only in gallon containers for $35.00. He got a tablespoon from Frank as he's a long time customer of his...he was kind enough to offer a thimbleful of it, but I graciously turned it down.

Did you find a place that sold it by the syringeful, or some smaller measure?

I'm pretty pumped to try it out on my AT440ml...theo a little nervous about opening her up to apply to the coils

But, your stellar results have my pumped to try it.