Looking for a great loudspeaker system

JoshK · « **Reply #260 on:** 27 Jan 2006, 07:02 pm »

If I were to buy a commercially made speaker, I'd have a good look into Amphion Loudspeakers, possible the Xenon or the Krypton.

http://www.amphion.fi/products/xenon/xenonframe5.htm

toobluvr · « **Reply #261 on:** 27 Jan 2006, 07:20 pm »

Quote from: skrivis

Fried Products makes speakers that follow much the same design philosophy, they tend to be less expensive, plus they're still in business. I think Frank has already rejected this style of speaker. However, if you or any of your friends want new speakers, Fried might be a better bet for you at this point.

Having never heard the Fried, I can't say whether or not they sound similar to the ML. I can say, however, that simply following the same design philosophy is no guarantee that the performance will be simiar, or even as good. There are many transmission line based speakers out there. That doesn't mean they all perform equally well...even at a given price point.

That is akin to saying that SS amp 1 will perform like SS amp 2......simply because they are both solid state.

toobluvr · « **Reply #262 on:** 27 Jan 2006, 08:18 pm »

I thought Frank was looking for a speaker for personal use only.
I didn't realize he also had an eye toward a good candidate for selling as well. Obviously, with Meadowlark now a defunct company, that is not possible.

Guess I should read the entire thread carefully before shooting my mouth.
It was very long and I just skimmed it.

My Apologies....John

skrivis · « **Reply #263 on:** 27 Jan 2006, 10:00 pm »

Quote from: toobluvr

Having never heard the Fried, I can't say whether or not they sound similar to the ML. I can say, however, that simply following the same design philosophy is no guarantee that the performance will be simiar, or even as good. There are many transmission line based speakers out there. That doesn't mean they all perform equally well...even at a given price point.

That is akin to saying that SS amp 1 will perform like SS amp 2......simply because they are both solid state.

I'd say it's the other way around - McGinty followed Fried.

ML used TL's, used drivers that are similar in many ways, used 1st-order filters, are time aligned, and Pat also relied upon the step response when designing. I read http://www.meadowlarkaudio.com/Dbench.htm and also http://www.meadowlarkaudio.com/TC1.htm Subtract the mystical foofaraw and I know right where he's coming from.

I would expect to hear similar things, and indeed I did when I heard a pair of Kestrel 2s. The bass wasn't as tight, and the highs a bit harsher, but the same feeling of hearing the dynamics in the music was there. They sounded almost as good on solo piano as Fried's, and that's pretty rare IME. I would expect Roy Johnson's speakers to also have some of the same characteristics too.

I would have considered purchasing a pair of Meadowlark speakers, but by the time I learned of his company and had decided to investigate things, Pat had disappeared. I got a very good deal on other speakers, so I bought those instead. Oh well.

The cabinetry in MLs is much nicer (some of the nicest I've seen), but that's why they cost so much more. I appreciate the looks, but I might prefer to spend my money elsewhere and get good cabinets instead of superlative ones. (It's the music that counts.)

toobluvr · « **Reply #264 on:** 27 Jan 2006, 10:21 pm »

Skrivis.....

I wasn't saying who was first ...or who followed who.
Only that if indeed the design philosophy was similar, that is no clue whatsoever as to how similar or dis-similar the performance was.

Just curious...
Did you go with the Fried speaker?

BTW, I agree with your priorities. For a given budget, I too would prefer to put $ into what really matters in producing superlative sound, rather than in eye-catching veneers.

But BECAUSE ML is no more, their prices have really nosedived. So you can do BOTH at a very reasonable price, w/o any real compromises.
This is exactly the point I am trying to make.

For example, I saw a beautifully finished pair of Blue Heron 2 on AG a few months ago for around $4k. I don't care if the speaker is non-current, or if the company is defunct, or whatever......33 cents on the dollar for a hand-crafted speaker of this caliber is a GREAT deal! Demand at that price was evidenced by the fact that it sold w/in 3 days.

What I mean by "buying smart".

Bill Baker · « **Reply #265 on:** 27 Jan 2006, 10:48 pm »

Quote

For example, I saw a beautifully finished pair of Blue Heron 2 on AG a few months ago for around $4k. I don't care if the speaker is non-current, or if the company is defunct, or whatever......33 cents on the dollar for a hand-crafted speaker of this caliber is a GREAT deal! Demand at that price was evidenced by the fact that it sold w/in 3 days.

I know these speakers you speak of. It was one of my customer who purchased a pair of speakers from me to replace them.

I also agree that if one is looking for a particular speaker that he/she plans on keeping for some time, going with a speaker that is out of production is really not much of a problem if that is what they want. The components used in the ML designs can be replaced [usually] with off the shelf parts. Besides, other than being abused, a speaker will last a LONG time.

If the speaker you want is by a company now out of business, it's really not too big a deal as long as it is not a very expensive design or uses designs, drivers or other that is unique to the point that the speaker cannot be repaired if something goes wrong.

skrivis · « **Reply #266 on:** 27 Jan 2006, 10:58 pm »

Quote from: toobluvr

Skrivis.....

Just curious...
Did you go with the Fried speaker?

Yes, they're actually my third pair of Frieds, over a period of 20+ years.

Quote

BTW, I agree with your priorities. For a given budget, I too would prefer to put $ into what really matters in producing superlative sound, rather than in eye-catching veneers.

But BECAUSE ML is no more, their prices have really nosedived. So ...

I was almost tempted to buy a pair when they were being liquidated, but I was already in the process of buying the Frieds and I had yet to actually hear any ML speakers. They're pretty, and the designer sounded like he was doing the right things, but I played it safe.

All I was really saying originally is that, for people who value McGinty's design precepts, there could be an alternative that wouldn't involve buying used speakers.

I noticed you mentioned VMPS. I don't know what incident or incidents you're referring to, but from what I've seen of Brian I bet he took care of it. He seems to be easy to deal with. Now I do think that VMPS are the "Have it Your Way" speakers, and each person will get different things out of a VMPS model once they start tweaking. That could be good or not. <shrug>

Tone Depth · « **Reply #267 on:** 4 Feb 2006, 05:37 am »

Frank:

The Legacy Focus 20/20 should be right around your budget, it is a full-range floor-stander, and I'm sure Legacy would add you as a dealer if you desired.

You should be familiar with Bill Duddleson's work, he's been designing speakers for over 20 years. His approach is consistent with yours, and his speakers seem to get good reviews.

Legacy website: www.legacy-audio.com

I've only had the opportunity to listen to the Focus' briefly. I hope to one day buy the smaller Victoria bookshelf/stand-sized speakers as a better fit for my family's lifestyle.

avahifi · « **Reply #268 on:** 4 Feb 2006, 03:18 pm »

I have been offered loaners from three companies, but none have shown up here yet.

Speakers, speakers, where are you?

Frank Van Alstine

avahifi · « **Reply #269 on:** 4 Feb 2006, 03:24 pm »

In general no speaker manufacturer wants me as a dealer because I sell my electronics direct to the customer worldwide and selling their speakers direct would be stepping on other dealer's toes.

Frank Van Alstine

elcaptain88 · « **Reply #270 on:** 4 Feb 2006, 03:37 pm »

Count me among those eagerly awaiting Frank's candid opinions on a number of these speakers. One speaker line I haven't seen mentioned yet - and I have an older set of their monitors used - is Tyler acoustics. They have an extensive line of speakers, including full range systems, sold consumer direct. Built using great drivers, seriously heavy cabinets and no BS marketing claims. I've found them to be a terrific value.

tyleracoustics.com

Cut-Throat · « **Reply #271 on:** 4 Feb 2006, 11:59 pm »

Quote from: avahifi

In general no speaker manufacturer wants me as a dealer because I sell my electronics direct to the customer worldwide and selling their speakers direct would be stepping on other dealer's toes.

Frank Van Alstine

Frank,

I did not read every post in this thread, but GR Research in Texas makes some Killer Speakers. I took a pair of them over to you a few years ago in Burnsville and you liked them. He also sells direct to customers. Danny Richie is a Prince of a Guy and has some great ideas. He has sent me some to audition and I'm sure he would send you what you are looking for. He also is a member of Audio Circles.

I think he would have what you are looking for. I still own a pair of his Paradox 1's that compared very favorably with my Biro L1's.

Regards,

CT

avahifi · « **Reply #272 on:** 5 Feb 2006, 02:29 pm »

Sorry Cut-Throat, I took a quick look at the GR Resarch web page and his big full range speakers are only available as do it yourself component kits, and I don't own a band saw and other sawdust making tools.

Frank

Cut-Throat · « **Reply #273 on:** 5 Feb 2006, 02:39 pm »

Quote from: avahifi

Sorry Cut-Throat, I took a quick look at the GR Resarch web page and his big full range speakers are only available as do it yourself component kits, and I don't own a band saw and other sawdust making tools.

Frank

He was teemed up with someone that would build these at a very reasonable price. You might shoot him an e-mail and see what building options are available.

gold · « **Reply #274 on:** 5 Feb 2006, 03:13 pm »

I have been happy with a bunch of speakers from Tyler Acoustics. If your room size is on the larger side go for the Woodmere. It's a pretty awesome speaker.

avahifi · « **Reply #275 on:** 9 Feb 2006, 06:35 pm »

I am still waiting for representative sample speakers hopefully from:

SP Technology

VMPS

Salk

I suspect that each of these companies builds outstanding speakers, and the "loaners" won't necessarily be the full sized ones I will eventually decide on, but smaller units that will give me at least a good idea of their sonic signature and capabilities.

I realize that their business comes first, but this thread has been here a long time now and I wish I had some more speakers to evaulate here.

Frank Van Alstine

Aether Audio · « **Reply #276 on:** 9 Feb 2006, 07:42 pm »

Frank,

Don't give up om me, we're working on a pair of Timepiece 2.1's right now that are going out to you. I apologize for the delay, but not only was I sick after coming back from Vegas, but I was already behind on orders before we left. Manpower is pretty limited here and we had to take time out to get ready for the show, so everything got pushed back.

Believe me, we're still playing major catch up. To add insult to injury, we used up a lot of our financial resources going to the show and that has caused further delays here after returning. We're starting to catch up and I think I see light at the end of the tunnel - just hope it ain't a train.

Oh, and don't worry about being a web based retailer - I have others already as well. If you sell speakers, you make me happy. As long as it's not illegal or unethical, we don't have a problem at all with it.

So...I hope you can hang tight a little longer. We're working hard to get them out to you.

Take care,

-Bob

jackman · « **Reply #277 on:** 9 Feb 2006, 07:58 pm »

I'm looking forward to Frank's comments. I've heard positive things about SP speakers from people I respect. Frank is very open and I expect him to provide some good feedback.

This is a fun thread!

J

skrivis · « **Reply #278 on:** 9 Feb 2006, 08:08 pm »

Quote from: SP Pres

f you sell speakers, you make me happy. As long as it's not illegal or unethical, we don't have a problem at all with it.

Speakers so good, it's immoral!

avahifi · « **Reply #279 on:** 10 Feb 2006, 09:10 pm »

Hey SP Pres, it sounds like your company is likely the same size as ours. I understand.

Frank