Guys I need you help. Please. $1650 electronics...

rmihai0 · « **on:** 28 Nov 2005, 01:13 am »

Hi,

aftr I tried couple of integrated and separates from the last generation (after Jul 2000) I am totally unsatisfied with the sound that I get.

My budget is limited to $1650 but I wouldn't consider it low.

Basically I need a pre-amp, an amp and a phono stage (if not incorporated in the pre-amp).

As long as I remeber "vintage" equipment was sounding better 30 years ago (when I ws 10). But maybe I am just sentimental (to listen to my dad system) and I might be wrong.

Anyhow - I do not know a better place to ask for advice. I count on the members of this forum that wil help me out with good advice.

Generally speaking I don't like transistors sound, but I simply hate the hassle of keep adjusting the bias of tube stuff. So, I would prefer to keep it SS.

I am not into "audiophile" game. I am a musician and I try to build a "musical" and easy to listen to system. This are my priorities for sure. Emotional and involving - a system that can make me CRY. This is what I hope to get.

I need an amplifier at least 35W RMS pc.

And I would use ONLY MM cartridges for the forseable future.

So, What would be your recomandations for $1650 in total?
- pre-amp?
- amp?
- phono stage?

Thank you and Happy Holidays to everybody.

lonewolfny42 · « **Reply #1 on:** 28 Nov 2005, 01:19 am »

What speakers ? Room size ? Main style of music enjoyed ?... this would help....

kfr01 · « **Reply #2 on:** 28 Nov 2005, 01:34 am »

We need more information, including a listing of what components you currently own.

In my opinion, working on your speakers and your room gives the largest audible bang for the buck. Really, your speakers in your room will determine the voice of your system more than any other single component.

I would demo equipment, in your system and in your room, before buying. This way you can determine whether you need to work on your speakers or room before wasting money replacing the rest of your components. If something works, buy what you demo.

rmihai0 · « **Reply #3 on:** 28 Nov 2005, 01:54 am »

Guys - thank for your help.

You are serious about hepling me - and that gives me hope that I will end up having something that I will enjoy.

The speakers: custom made: 2-way; 83db/W/m VERY conservative; 8 ohms but can go as low into 6.3 ohms in he bass region. Basically I am using Hiquphon tweeters and SEAS W18 as woofer.

The room: small - my listening position is at 6' (2m).

The turntable: Thorens TD125 (I love it) with Rega RB-300 and Ortofon OM40 (the best MM cartridge that I encountered).

Oh yes: the listening levels: AVERAGES of 65db (+/- 5db). I am in a building apartement and I cannot listen to levels over 72db.

I hope all this will help.

mcrespo71 · « **Reply #4 on:** 28 Nov 2005, 01:58 am »

What electronics did you own before that made you dissatisfied? That may help in recommendations.

rmihai0 · « **Reply #5 on:** 28 Nov 2005, 02:04 am »

Ayre AX-7
Krell KAV 400xi
Electrocompaniet ECI-4

kfr01 · « **Reply #6 on:** 28 Nov 2005, 02:04 am »

Also, it would help to describe what about the music is unsatisfying to you.

Not enough separation between instruments? Not enough definition? Not warm enough?

Gordy · « **Reply #7 on:** 28 Nov 2005, 02:23 am »

Excellent drivers! Are you using the 1801 x-overs as well? Problem is, they won't bring tears until you reach at least 77dB's...

Have you invested in insulated drapes and or DIY sound absorption? That might allow you to get the power zone up where the drivers are happier... and could be all you really need!

lonewolfny42 · « **Reply #8 on:** 28 Nov 2005, 02:58 am »

Quote

The speakers: custom made: 2-way; 83db/W/m VERY conservative; 8 ohms but can go as low into 6.3 ohms in he bass region. Basically I am using Hiquphon tweeters and SEAS W18 as woofer.

Even at low sound levels...you'll need some watts for those speakers...83db.[/list:u]

Watson · « **Reply #9 on:** 28 Nov 2005, 03:12 am »

Quote from: rmihai0

The speakers: custom made: 2-way; 83db/W/m VERY conservative; 8 ohms but can go as low into 6.3 ohms in he bass region. Basically I am using Hiquphon tweeters and SEAS W18 as woofer.

Have you thought about trying different speakers? Both of those are excellent drivers, but the W18 is about as far from a vintage sound as you can possibly get. Part of the reason is that it's brutally revealing, and part of the reason is that it has a particular sound.

Also, have you ever noticed how David Ellis is always swapping amps? Declaring one as "best" and then finding another one that's now the "best"? Moving towards tube amps with greater intrinsic distortion (moving from ST-70 to Golden Tube)? Sometimes I wonder if there's a subconscious, intrinsic dissatisfaction with the fundamental sound of the W18 that drives this quest.

Quote

I am not into "audiophile" game. I am a musician and I try to build a "musical" and easy to listen to system. This are my priorities for sure.

If you want something easier to listen to and less 'hifi', you should honestly consider moving away from metal cone woofers and towards better damped materials (treated paper, poly, etc.).

lonewolfny42 · « **Reply #10 on:** 28 Nov 2005, 03:24 am »

If you were interested in selling your speakers...and moving on... this Odyssey system for $1,500.00 might fit well in your room.

TheChairGuy · « **Reply #11 on:** 28 Nov 2005, 05:17 am »

In today's marketplace you can get quite a lot of amplification for $1650.

My own case in point:

JVC F-10 Receiver (AM/FM and remote control) - about $200.00 new
Dynaco PAS-4 Tube Pre-amp (For Line and Phono) - about $400 used

Run your phono and CD IC's into the PAS, run the outputs into the JVC's DVD-In and choose 'DVD-Multi' setting (the purest connection available).

Turn volume on JVC to maximum ('50') and use the Dynaco for volume.

It'll greatly benefit from Balanced Power. Bolder Cables/Wayne sells excellent Son of Q (more than sufficient for this tandem) from EquiTech for $650.

For about $1250.00, you will have 100 watts (more than enough to power baby Magnepans, even), remote control, AM/FM, and excellent phono section and very fine line section (in only 3 rack spaces). The preamp has a regulated power supply; very little tube signatue except where you want it to be. And, no tube biasing required.

Good times and tunes are only US$1250.00 away

JLM · « **Reply #12 on:** 28 Nov 2005, 01:21 pm »

Seems that the speakers you're describing would be ruthlessly revealing monitors, but not musically satisfying. Their low efficiency also makes them "undynamic".

Your very thin walls and small room are not allowing you to listen at serious/realistic spls (I'm NOT a spl freak), but 70 dB isn't much more than background listening levels. And I'm sure bass reproduction is another whole can of worms.

The speakers, walls, and room together would make for a perfect storm against recreating musical enjoyment.

I'd punt and go for a headphone based system until you can move into better digs.

rmihai0 · « **Reply #13 on:** 28 Nov 2005, 05:08 pm »

Thank you very much ALL of you.